MFMP Publishes New Video and Slideshow: Doppelgänger — Does a 2006 Patent Describe the ‘Rossi Effect’?

UPDATE: New Video and Slideshow from Bob Greenyer: Doppelgänger

The slideshow is here:

The patent application that Bob is referring to: “Deuteride/hydride catalyzed condensation energy production” Inventors — Richard Day, Kenneth Rubinson, Terrence McConville, Alfred Kornel.


Thanks to Ged for posting this:

“Hey everyone, just wanted to give a heads up that MFMP may be releasing something important soon. Those who get the donor e-mails will know what I mean. I don’t know what it is, just to keep an eye on their Facebook page.”

I have been in touch with Bob Greenyer who won’t give any details yet, but is getting ready to post something today, I believe, that he considers to be important.

I’ll be keeping an eye on the MFMP Facebook page and see what he will be coming out with.

I am told the information will come in video form.

From the MFMP FB page:

What if you had a document that…
– Showed nuclear synthesis without harmful radiation
– had two catalysts, a big and a small one
– could self sustain
– operated between familiar temperatures
– had demonstrated melt-downs
– works as a fluid
– could be enhanced by other catalysts

  • Bob Greenyer

    If we replicate the claims in this patent, say production of 6Li from Deuterium or 4He from Protium, we would first check again to see if we had made a mistake – then we would have to conclude that this is something completely different from the “Rossi effect” especially if it worked without a transition metal. As I said in the video, Nickel or other transition metals may boost the process claimed here for a variety of reasons and/or form inter-metal catalysts, say AlH3 attached to Ni nano particles. All of this was possible within the embodiments claimed in the patent since the reactor structures were specified to be made of transition metals and with often high Nickel content. In the video, I describe how molten Li and Aluminium can both dissolve Ni and other transition metals and then the LiAlH4 can stabilise Ni nano particles say. All of this is possible under the research whose summary is this patent application.

    The latest iteration of the “Rossi effect” is something to do with an extension to Mossbauer resonance (Cook/Rossi) and I look forward to learning where that work is going this week. It is nothing whatsoever to do with hydrogen condensation as discussed in this work, which has its heritage going back to before 1994 with some of the same authors. The use of Li and LiAlH4 and heating to between 300 and 1500ºC + in a transition metal based reactor is absolutely covered in this patent application and is therefore unpalatable. This is straight, dispassionate, reality.

    The data coming from the experiments would indicate provenance.

    Moreover, revelation of this “condensation theory” work suggested to me that NH3 may be active as I speculated in the video and this led to Fredrick Hibbs to comment about seeing massive heat excursions using Nickel powder, NH3 etc around 40 years ago in experiments that he was conducting at the organisation he worked at.

    Rossi seams to think the embodiments in this patent will not work, but given that it pre-dates Rossi coming onto the scene, the similarities are remarkable. The specific embodiments may not work because they are missing something which is necessary in the description (which they did but were unaware of or held back) which Rossi has identified and has disclosed. The interesting thing is, unless I have missed it, I don’t see any more disclosure in Rossi’s patent either – unless it is just a nickel processing thing – because there is no disclosure on specific stimulation in either work.

    It is amazing to me that non-working research would come up with so many coincidences before Rossi had uttered a single word in public on the matter. There are only a few possible conclusions, here are some

    1. Rossi knew (not ideal)
    2. Rossi didn’t know (fantastic, this could mean the claims are real or they are both wrong)
    3. They are completely different processes where one or the other has more potential

    Has anyone asked Rossi if 26th September 2016 was the first time he heard about the prior work? If it was not, then he has missed this apparently very important text and that raises questions about what else he may have missed given that he has previously claimed to have studied all work in the field before.

    • Axil Axil

      Regarding: “because there is no disclosure on specific stimulation in either work.”

      Rossi got one by you. In the update to his patent, he defines high voltage DC electrostatic stimulation with voltage between 50 and 100 Kvolts

      See patent update

      • Bob Greenyer

        Ok – yeh, I saw that but not in the awarded patent. As well to remember though.

        • Axil Axil

          A post from Alan Smith as follows regarding what a Lugano professor told him as follows:

          @axil Don’t get too excited. As I understand it HT (high tension) was applied to the mixed fuel before loading into the reactor, OR via a single-wire input to the reactor shortly before the claimed excess heat was produced. I am not sure that such a wire can be seen in the Lugano images- never checked. I was told it was HVDC and that the aim was to produce a glow discharge, not sparking. Time and intensity not known None of the profs know every detail of what went into the reactor, Rossi has never revealed the exact nature of his fuel mixes -or let anyone see inside a fuel container – since the days of Professor Sergio Focardi. And he isn’t talking either

          • Bob Greenyer

            Well – this could be to set up initial magnetic domain states, or to achieve “heavy electrons” as cited in the Clean Planet Patent. Or simply to provide hydrogen species and a bias for loading the material correctly.

            I am more minded than ever to think that some form of heavy electron or equivalent is needed to deliver viable embodiments.

  • LT


    The United States patent application US 2007/0263758 A1, DEUTERIDE/HYDRIDE CATALYZED Related CONDENSATION ENERGY PRODUCTION provides insight in the type of catalysts to be used with LENR systems. (This assuming the contents of the patent application are valid)

    One of the properties of a catalysts are that they are not consumed in the catalyzed reaction
    Now if we look at the mass numbers in the fuel used in the Lugano test before and after the test, we see one element which is present in about the same amount before and after the test.
    This is the element with mass number 69.
    (See figure 9 of appendix 3 of the Lugano report, but be aware of the different scales used in both figures presented}
    While there are several isotopes with mass number 69, one of the most likely elements is Gallium.

    The patent application states that the catalyst must be able to form a covalent hydride/
    deuteride and that the preferred element are from the Groups V, III, IV, VI and II. The preferred catalytic elements are antimony and germanium.

    Note that while gallium is not in group V, it is one of the elements of group III. (The second preferred group).

    So is it a possibility is that Rossi for it’s Lugano test used Gallium as the catalyst ?
    And while he could have used antimony or germanium for possible higher efficiency, he probably wanted not to show all his cards by providing a system for the test with the highest COP possible, but only a system with a lower COP which proved that LENR is real.

    As a final note : Gallium could also have been added in the fuel the form of LiGaH4 which decomposes to :

    2 LiGaH4 -> 2 LiH + 2 Ga + 3 H2

    • Bob Greenyer

      Yes, I was looking at that last week, not the form in which it may have been added, but that it could have been added all the same.

      There is one issue as I see it, and that Ga is often (but not always) used in SIMS (Secondary Ion Mass Spectrometry) analysis as the primary ion species. We used bismuth as the primary ion source in the Padua cell ash analysis – without knowing this data from the Lugano report authors, it is hard to be sure.

      The other issue is that nearly 40% of Gallium is mn 71

      I agree it is possible. Moreover, gallium is a liquid ad room temperature and prevents oxidation in air due to forming a protective oxide layer it can alloy with some metals readily to enable addition. It can also allow with Antimony and Arsenic.

      • LT

        Hello Bob,

        Thank’s for your additional comments.

        As far as the primary ION source used in the SIMS analysis, it is mentioned in the Lugano report what the primary source was.
        In the last paragraph of the first page of appendix 3 of the Luganao report the
        authors state with respect to figure 9 : The Na+ ion signal comes from the primary ions.
        So Na+ (mn = 23) was used as the primary ion source.
        This still makes it possible that Gallium was used as a catalyst. However I totally agree with your remark that normally there should also have been Gallium 71 visible in the SIMS analysis.

        • Bob Greenyer

          Thanks for the detail

  • Bob Greenyer

    Don’t think so.

  • Bob Greenyer


  • Bob Greenyer

    If 8Li is produced (from deuterium and observation of decay) or 4He produced (from 4 protium and 2 electrons and observation of decay), it is the only possible explanation.

  • georgehants

    The Tom Bearden Website
    Extraordinary Biology
    Kervran’s Proof of Biological Transmutation In orthodox chemistry, one of the strongest dogmas is the stubborn insistence that it is impossible to create
    another element by chemical reaction.
    Most chemists also insist that all reactions occurring in living systems
    are chemical in nature.
    They believe fervently that chemistry can and must explain life itself.
    In the early 1960’s, a French researcher named Louis Kervran
    published work which flew directly in the face of the accepted chemistry
    Kervran reported the astounding results of his research showing that
    living plants were able to accomplish limited transmutation of
    Kervran was then the Conferences Director at the University of Paris,
    and his first paper was published in La Revue Generale Des Sciences, July 1960.

    • Obvious

      ” As Kervran pointed out, the ground in Brittany contained
      no calcium”
      That is complete nonsense.

  • bfast

    Yea know, I’ve been wondering why the inventors left this patent in an incomplete state rather than forging ahead and at least getting somebody to implement it. The most logical explanation is that they had MAJOR repeatability issues. I fear that there is no magic bullet here.

    • Andre Blum

      Maybe they didn’t know you have to say BOOM while clapping your hands several times to shock the reactor.

  • Alan DeAngelis

    This is a bit like finding Winston Smith’s diary.

  • Alan DeAngelis

    By the way, there’s a Density Function Theory (DFT) paper that mentions LiH’s covalent character.

  • BillH

    Time to play hard-ball, would something based on this be commercially viable? AR has held out the hope that a plant based on Nickel, Hydrogen and Lithium would be a huge advance over energy generated from fossil fuels or even conventional nuclear. This seems like a step back to the past to travel down a road which ends in a cul-de-sac.

    The best hope would still appear to be AR, if he can bring to fruition COPs that he has so far claimed. My main fear would be that AR’s devices still lack the reliability that would enable commercial production any time soon. My best advice, ease up on the secrecy and throw a lot more manpower at the outstanding problems.

    • Gerard McEk

      Indeed, secrecy does not improve the development speed at all, but I doubt AR will go into that direction. It seems however, that he is quickly approaching the 5 sigma border, which would be great.

    • sam

      September 26, 2016 at 12:05 PM
      Mr Andrea Rossi,
      Can you explain which has been the inspiration that made you arrive to the present results?

      Andrea Rossi
      September 26, 2016 at 7:09 PM
      The spark has been started from the first announcement of F&P. Eventually, after I reaized that the electrolysis was conducting nowhere, the idea to use nickel as a catalyzer of compounds with hydrogen came from the enormous work, and experience, I made with Ni as a chemical catalyzer in hydrogenation processes when I made experiments for my thermolytic plants from 1976 to 1994. Obviously the matter was totally different, but ideas and intuitions make tunnels between arguments apparently strange to each other.
      Warm Regards,


      • BillH

        I take your point Sam stepping back into the past and re-examining ideas can often be useful. However, AR would seem to have made the leap forward and his path is at least clearer and more likely to uncover the underlying mechanisms.

  • Axil Axil

    The underluing assumpion in this chemical analiaya is that very short cemical bounds will force electrons inside the nucleus and this will cause fusion.

    But electrons pass through the nucleus all the time on their orbits and fusion never occurs. Electrons inside the nucleius is a false conjecture.

    What the patent under discussion shows is that compounds with shorten chemical bounds will METAILIZE under moderate compression. That means that compressed hydrides will form a superconductor when slightly compressed in a metal nanocavity.

    Lithium Aluminum Hydride becomes metalized at the lowest pressure : 42 GPa of all hydrides because it is a ternary hydride.Other hydrides can be found that become metalized at even lower pressures if the aluminum atom is replaced with a heaver atom. Lower pressure of formation means easier LENR startup.

    Also see


    “From detailed assessments of electronic structure, we find that a combination of significantly quantal elements, six of seven atoms being hydrogen, becomes a stable metal at a pressure approximately 1/4 of that required to metalize pure hydrogen itself. The system, LiH6 (and other LiHn), may well have extensions beyond the constituent lithium. These hypothetical materials demonstrate that nontraditional stoichiometries can considerably expand the view of chemical combination under moderate pressure.”

    DGT told me that they were using LaNiH5 and LiAlH6, 30/70 usually in their R6 reactor.

    The LaNiH5 ternary hydride is very heavy because 139La has a nucleus which contains 139 nucleons. Nickel is also heavy containing 58 nucleons. The chenical bounds in this three element hydride is very short and the pressure required to compress it into a superconductor is minimal.

  • Bob Greenyer
    • HarryD

      Bob, are you hinting here (and in video) towards LENR in organisms with the help of amino acids? 😉

      • Bob Greenyer

        The universe is a wonderful place, I’ll explain my thoughts in due course.

    • Thomas Kaminski

      What is the contract for? It seems that the company does mostly MRI research. From the DARPA listings, it continued until 2007.

    • Andre Blum

      I’ve tried to send a short mail to Kenneth Rubinson on a address I found on the net, informing him of the patent being discussed here at ECW. So far, no response.

      • Bob Greenyer

        Thanks Andre

  • Bob Greenyer

    What needs to be born in mind is that these covalent hydrides can have many phases (shapes) and in a highly energetic state (hot) with elevated and dynamic pressures there can be a continuous flux.

    It would be great if the crowd could see what research there is out there on this.

    • Gerard McEk

      Hi Bob, I asked Andrea how hi thinks about your idea how it works and if he knows the patent.

      This is his answer:
      Andrea Rossi
      September 27, 2016 at 10:56 AM
      Gerard MkEk:
      As you know, I never comment the work of my competitors.
      Just two obvious considerations: this patent application has not been allowed because the system cannot work. Should this patent application and its theoretical implications be someway related to my effect, I would be dead many years ago, due to the high energy gamma rays that this theoretical hypothesys implies. Obviously the theoretical bases I am working with are totally strange to this proposal.
      Warm Regards,

      Any comment?

      • artefact

        Another one about the video:

        “Andrea Rossi September 27, 2016 at 10:59 AM
        Rip Van Winkle:
        Yes, I just saw it. I already responded on this issue minutes ago on this blog to Gerard MkEk. who put the same question. This having been said, I continue to wish success to the MFMP to succeed to replicate my effect.
        Warm Regards, A.R.”

      • This contradicts his claim to have hunted down all related patents and tried to replicate.

      • Bob Greenyer

        We and others have demonstrated that Li eats metals – 100% pure iron is the most resistant.

        Given that EVERY reactor container metal they suggest in the patent had a range of transition metals, it is absolutely certain that the fuels led to the creation of the requisite nano-particles in solution under the right conditions (see the segment of the video at the end which addresses how LiAlH4 creates and stabilises Ni nano particles)

        • Gerard McEk

          The purpose of the transition metal may be that it puts the ionic hydrate into such a position (by locking one of its hydrogen atoms into the lattice) that they are in the right position for the anionic hydrate to enter the fusion reaction of the Hydrogen atoms. It just enhances the probability of the reaction.
          AR is right about the lack of radiation. That is not explained.

          • Bob Greenyer

            Yes – I tried to explain that in the video at the end and then in a post here – just too tired to make it clear. Thanks for this contribution

      • Bob Greenyer

        The interesting thing is – 2 of the four people named on the patent, created a patent for Cincinnati University that claims to make tritium by a similar process.. It was a bit of a broad patent which kind of suggests they were unsure what was exactly going on.

        Then, 12 years later, and under their own names and those of two others – they have a much more SPECIFIC patent application with data which additionally states NO TRITIUM OBSERVED.

        One may argue that the specified embodiments not not create useful heat – but if they can show 6Li where there was none before, or they can melt down a steel reactor that would never otherwise melt with the same heater, a replication of the data and claims in this patent would PROVE LENR and therefore the floodgates would open.

        Remember $600+bn a yearis invested into oil and gas – would non of this money support LENR research if it was PROVEN?

  • Steve Savage

    Bob … WOW … Thank you … Very exciting and well explained … I watched it twice … One thing you did not address and I was wondering how this might fit in to the observations and possible mechanisms outlined in the video. Rossi, with the Quark, is generating an electric current, do the reactions you highlight allow for that phenomena?

    • Bob Greenyer

      The “Glow” could be Cherenkov Radiation from high energy Beta

      The beta could be converted to electricity via beta voltaic.

      Actually, both alpha and beta particles present opportunities for electricity generation – this would require deuterium though and energy would come from decay of 8Li, having said that – we are talking about miniscule amounts of deuterium.

  • bfast

    From what I can see:
    > There is a cool patent that makes a lot of promises.
    > The cool patent has effectively expired, so it is in the public domain (No royalties required, nobody else can patent the same thing — though they can patent specific techniques used to better implement this patent.)
    > The patent has not yet been replicated. This is still a MAJOR ouch, as replication has been so dificult in this field.

    • Ged

      The ultimate goal is to change that last point, and now MFMP has the backing and resources to make it happen, so hopefully we’ll learn if it works or not soon enough!

      Though, this makes the idea queue 3 deep for MFMP to do; not counting more Glowsticks, the clamshell, the mysterious idea Bob has designed, any additional Celani replications or P&F replication… Whew.

  • SD

    I have watched the video but haven’t read the patent application yet. Do I understand that the methods in the patent might be transferable to a LAH/lithium/nickel system? If so, what is it that we were not doing that is described in the patent?

    Bob seems to imply that Li3AlH6 would play the role of Stibine. It might be obvious to some, but I have to note that Li3AlH6 comes from the decomposition of LAH when heated:
    3 LiAlH4 → Li3AlH6 + 2 Al + 3 H2

    I guess my question is: how would you design an experiment that uses the methods of the patent and uses LAH/Li/Ni. Also, why not try that instead of working with highly toxic compounds?

    • Bob Greenyer

      Actually, it might be NiAlH3 – effectively forming a molecule similar to Stibine, potentially a nano cluster of Nickel with effectively AlH3 hanging off – see the slide at the end of the presentation.

    • Warthog

      The Al doesn’t stick around just as elemental Al. I suspect that it serves the purpose of an internal “oxygen getter”, preferentially reacting with an residual O2 and protecting the Li and H from oxidation.

  • Warthog

    An extra warning!!!! ALL of the elemental congeners of stibine (silane, etc) are highly pyrophoric in addition to being highly toxic. DO NOT screw around with them unless you are an expert and have correct equipment (which is NOT a glove bag, unless said glove bag is in a nice BIG hood and purged with Argon). Sealed glove box is preferred.

  • Gerard McEk

    That was a very good presentation Bob, by far the best I have seen of you so far. If it works this way than I expect a lot of proving experiments soon. I understand you have some in the pipeline as well. Can you give us any insight when those may take place?
    I am sure that Rossi is already asked for comment on this presentation. I Hope he will answer it in a conclusive way.
    I am very hopeful now, thanks!

    • Gerard McEk

      Why did the inventors of this patent not further develop and commercialize it? It would be interesting to hear that of them.
      It is quite strange that they just have let it dy. They must have been aware of the vast potentials?

      • Warthog

        Patent was rejected. No patent, no commercialization. I’d love to know on what grounds the rejection was made.

      • Bob Greenyer

        Need to check on the authors ages.

        They seam to have first done work following 1989 announcement at Cincinnati University with a patent application on behalf of the uni circa 1994.

        What gives me confidence is that they, along with two others, again applied for a patent in 2006/7 with a much more robust idea, definition of working embodiments and empirical results.

        It would be very interesting to understand what the intervening story was.

        Did they retire, find investment and move forward only to have their future crushed by the patent office… lot’s to find out.

  • JustLooking

    How many years now? 5? More… so… how can rossi be so far ahead of everyone else? I dont get it. Shouldnt be this way.

    • Bob Greenyer

      Because no one was paying attention or there was a whole bag load of “don’t look over there. look over here”

  • Dods

    Just watched the Video Bob and thought it was brilliant.
    Loved all the Booms!.
    I can see you hitting the big stage one day and doing a TED-X or even as a presenter on an Open Science Streaming Service.

  • DrD

    Sounds very convincing to a non expert like me, excellent presentation!
    Regarding the rejection I wonder if, once LENR is proven beyond doubt, there will be any possibilty that a good attorney might sue the USPTO foor failing to protect workers IP on such weak grounds that it’s not compatible with current science. I mean, how many times has current science had to change.

  • I think I found his CV
    note the achievement: “Patents: Hydride catalyzed condensation”

  • Bob Greenyer

    The Doppelgänger patent is free to use!!!

    The patent applicants were issues a “Non-Final Rejection” on 03-28-2011, which they did not respond to and so as of 10-07-2011, this intellectual property has been free to use!

    No waiting needed

    Tip Off: Alan Goldwater

    • wpj
    • georgehants

      Morning Bob, my birthday 29th December, plenty of time I think for MFMP to design and build a Wonderful Cold Fusion machine for the World to copy.

      • Bob Greenyer

        baby steps.

        We’re trying

      • Jouni Tuomela

        george, mine too!

    • Bernie Koppenhofer

      Bob, great lecture, not that I understood more than half of it. So, are you organizing a logical step by step series of experiments by your MFMP friends to verify the points in your talk and in the patent?

      • Bob Greenyer

        Well, I thought there were many important similarities with claimed observations by other parties to bring to everyone’s attention – but more than that, this patent was in the public domain and the reagents it suggests, like Antimony and Germanium as Hydrides are UNBELIEVABLY toxic, like chemical warfare toxic, and so, with many people “trying” different things, I simply had to draw peoples attention to the possibility of radiation but more worryingly, the possibility of vapours that, at extremely low levels, could kill a human inside an hour.

        The patent made NO comment on these risks.

        • Bernie Koppenhofer

          Hi Bob: Even more reason for you to take command and organize the experiments. Are you underestimating your influence and abilities to guide these experiments?

          • Bob Greenyer

            I learnt a long time ago that the key to getting a lot done was to accept one can’t do everything ones self – a participant should play to their strengths, with the growing team (as you will soon see), their competences and the crowds participation (all important) – if it is possible, we’ll find a way if others don’t first.

  • I notice it is only an application, still pending ?

  • Brilliant.

  • bfast

    I have followed the slide show, but have not watched the 1 hour presentation. Has MFMP replicated this patent? That isn’t blatantly clear, though it appears that they have. If this patent is easy to replicate it is a major game changer — major.

    How licensing goes to the patent owners will set the tone for LENR for the next 10 years.

    • Andre Blum

      They have not. Bob is asking people who have the proper skills, labs and precautions to try it. soon.

      • Zephir

        After then everyone could try to heat the nickel and palladium dust with molten lithium hydride – it’s just an idea in a given moment – not less, no more.

  • Hhiram

    Well, one key possibility we haven’t yet discussed here very much is that Industrial Heat discovered that Rossi’s IP can’t be successfully protected because of prior patents, and so it is useless to them.

    • bfast

      Um, this patent certainly appears to weaken Rossi’s position. However, Rossi has done a heck of a lot of advanced research, exploring avenues not discussed here. He has plenty of room for patent protection in any case.

      That said, IH may be of the same mind as you that with this patent, Rossi can be pushed out — especially as Rossi seems to be holding his IP very tightly.

      • The earlier patent does not mention Rossi’s Nickel method.
        Discoveries are not patent-able only technology is.
        It is method that patent able.

    • Omega Z

      You Can’t patent LENR itself.

      You Can patent specific processes and hardware that works in a specific way. The trick is to patent the most optimal designs.

      • if it works Rossi sure ca,n patent an improvement and people will love it if the price match the advantage.
        if rossi can not improve it (improbable) he van just license to the author, and why not share the benefits.

        best way to be rich with IP is to share IP with people who have something useful for you.
        fencing your corn field is not productive, just make a joint venture with neighbours to sell popcorn to cinema.

        • Hi all

          Since the doppelganger patent application was never defended and lapsed on 10-07-2011 Rossi’s patent stands.

          There is some prior art in Doppelganger but Rossi’s patent skirts this, possibly Rossi knew of the patent his work in the field on Petroldraggon may have lead him to read it, so he would have skirted it in his publications so as not to let his competitors know, if he was doing it for this reason he was very sensible.

          The key fact is this proves Rossi has a theoretical and experiment basis and he was right all along and that thus IH’s position is not real.

          I still hold with the October Surprise explanation especially seeing as the mandated Defence Secretary briefing was postponed closer to October 🙂

          Kind Regards walker

          • DrD

            Yes, it’s wasn’t granted which is not too surprising given the Patent offfice attitude to anything LENR.
            No need to wait till 2026.
            It does mean AR can’t patent anything disclosed within.

        • Warthog

          “..fencing your corn field is not productive, just make a joint venture with neighbours to sell popcorn to cinema.”

          And suppose your neighbors raise pigs or cattle?? You will find that you darned WILL fence your corn field, or you’ll have nothing to market.

  • The authors appear to be connected to the University of Cincinnati.

    One wonders what they did with the knowledge asserted in this patent.

  • LuFong

    Very interesting patent. Has any effort been made to contact the authors of this patent? I’m curious about what they might think about the LENR connection. Perhaps they’ll get wind of this new attention and surface.

    Good stuff MFMP.

  • Ophelia Rump


    I hope you distribute replication kits by the carton. Not the pack.

    • invient

      Bob doesn’t want us to end up destroying our neighborhood. It is surreal the juxtaposition of MFMP and the presidential debates in the US.

  • Frank Acland

    Interesting that Robert Mockan commented here about the patent that Bob is referring to:

    “You must be doing something interesting to reach those temperatures. The only patent literature I’ve come across that suggests high temperature and power density at 3500 C, nuclear but probably not LENR related, is this application US 2007/0263758 A1, dated Nov. 15, 2007, titled: “Deuteride/Hydride catalyzed Condensation Energy Production”.

    More about it here:

    The information claims the inventors had to keep the reactor below 1500 C to keep it from melting, using stainless steel, so it would appear they could have gone higher if they used for example a pure tungsten reactor chamber, that would not melt in an inert gas until 3400 C.

    I acquired a 500 gram germanium ingot that I had intended to experiment with to make the volatile reactive hydrides, but funding remains a problem.

    The higher temperatures are always more difficult to experiment with.”

    Comment in this thread:

    Unfortunately we haven’t heard from Robert for years.

    • Ged

      Oh wow, blast from the past.

    • TomR

      Thank you Frank for bringing up one of Robert Mockan’s posts here from years ago. I wish he would start posting again, if he is able.

    • Bob Greenyer

      Of course – back then we we had little idea what was going on in the E-Cat or what fuel components were.

      If Robert Mockan and our contributor could find this application, did Rossi not? If Rossi did, then when did he? If he didn’t then his claims of testing all other work in the field are shattered.

  • Bob Greenyer

    This information dump does include two tests that if conducted and show the effect claimed, would conclusively show a LENR process.

    These are not the tests I have been referring to recently. What I have been referring to is a tests that would conclusively prove LENR in a Live streamed fashion.

  • Bob Greenyer

    There will a presentation, as normal that will include a whole bunch of other links

    Look in the video description for key links.




    – potentially gave insight to the whole LENR field

  • Go MFMP Go!