Industrial Heat Issue Statement, Say Rossi Lawsuit ‘Without Merit’

In an article written by Lauren K. Ohnesorge published today in the Triangle Business Journal which discusses the Rossi/Leonardo Corp. lawsuit against Industrial Heat.

http://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/blog/techflash/2016/04/scientist-sues-raleigh-cold-fusion-startup.html

The article reviews the scope of the lawsuit and reports that JT Vaughn of Industrial Heat has issued a statement calling the suit “without merit.”

UPDATE: Industrial Heat has issues a response in the following press release:

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-releases/industrial-heat-statement-on-meritless-litigation-from-leonardo-corporation-and-andrea-rossi-300248066.html

RESEARCH TRIANGLE, N.C., April 7, 2016 /PRNewswire/ — We are aware of the lawsuit filed by Andrea Rossi and Leonardo Corporation against Industrial Heat. Industrial Heat rejects the claims in the suit. They are without merit and we are prepared to vigorously defend ourselves against this action. Industrial Heat has worked for over three years to substantiate the results claimed by Mr. Rossi from the E-Cat technology – all without success. Leonardo Corporation and Mr. Rossi also have repeatedly breached their agreements. At the conclusion of these proceedings we are confident that the claims of Mr. Rossi and Leonardo Corporation will be rejected.

Industrial Heat continues to be focused on a scientifically rigorous approach that includes thorough, robust and accurate testing of promising LENR technologies. Our goal remains to deliver clean, safe and affordable energy.

So this is the first response to the lawsuit — we may be hearing a lot more back-and-forth as times goes on.

  • Donk970

    Here’s the sniff test. If Industrial Heat’s claim that the E-Cat doesn’t work is legit then they really should make everything to do with it public or at the least hand the whole pile back to Rossi and walk away. If they try to hang on to the patents it means that the claim that it doesn’t work is BS and they are attempting to remove Rosi before they get the big payoff.

    • bachcole

      To give I.H. some credit, it is potentially the biggest money maker in the history of the world, so I can understand the temptation. But I still think, if what I am seeing is true, that they are scum-bags.

    • DrD

      IH haven’t claimed it doesn’t work.
      The above response is that they were unable to substantiate the claims (of AR).
      Maybe that subtle difference is important.

  • Michael W Wolf

    Rossi can go to prison. I don’t think he would sue if he was a fraud. Rossi must know the only way to win is provide a working reactor.

  • Michael W Wolf

    Maybe that is why they are so vague in their Statements. Maybe they do think Rossi violated the contract by not giving them access to new developments he has made. When I said about government intervention, I was just throwing you know what at the wall. But what you said explains a lot. Man, and Rossi is getting old, I hope to God he doesn’t die with it. Or worse, if you are right, shut him up permanently.

  • Michael W Wolf

    Think about it. If Cherokee is heavily invested in fossil fuel assets, they can’t get rid of the right now because basically they would most if not all be losses because of the current fossi fuel crash. I can call it a crash, right? If they make a major announce about a new energy source, proven, and working prototype exists, what do you think those 2 billion in assets would be worth?

    • bachcole

      And not just Cherokee. Any investors who KNOW that LENR is real may be reacting to a fossil fuel market collapse.

      Too bad the greatest and most destructive back stab in human history may be named after an American Indian tribe. They don’t deserve it.

  • Michael W Wolf

    Isn’t “ecat techology” completely different from saying “ecat”? What were they using when building their own reactor? They were using ecat technology.

  • psi2u2

    Yikes.

  • Fiesler Storch

    Seems simple to me: IH believed the Lugano test proved that Rossi had something; but they did more tests and couldn’t get OU and decided that Rossi’s e-cat didn’t work; so they refused to pay the 89 Million.

    After all, if the e-cat really worked, 89 million would be pocket change; having the rights to the e-cat would be worth hundreds of billions.

    • timycelyn

      – I think the operative word is seems.

    • Michael W Wolf

      IH’s patent of 2014, claims they built and tested a reactor and got a COP of 11. Within the 3 years they claimed to have worked on it. A contradiction to the public statement.

  • Andreas Moraitis

    Making a statement that is materially false while being convinced that it is true is not the same as making a false statement, while knowing that it is false.

  • Publius

    Far more probable is that Rossi has a history of deceit and not working well with others, so why is it a surprise the relationship soured?

  • Ged

    Having coal smog thicker than the heaviest London fog will certainly motivate a society.

  • Andreas Moraitis

    Obviously, Rossi’s and IH’s statements cannot be true at the same time. But that does not yet mean that one of the parties lied. People can make wrong statements while being truly convinced of what they are saying. In contrast to that, a liar says deliberately the untruth.

  • Mylan

    People growing up in religious families are less altruistic than others: http://www.cell.com/current-biology/abstract/S0960-9822(15)01167-7

    • Michael W Wolf

      That wasn’t a very altruistic statement. You religious? If not, I rest my case.

  • Skip

    I DO like margaritas…
    But…

  • Mylan

    Christians are no better than others, they just think they are. Indeed children from religious families are even less altruistic then others. http://www.cell.com/current-biology/abstract/S0960-9822(15)01167-7
    So maybe if Vaughn was an atheist he would act less selfish.

  • Omega Z

    I create a device that will save Sam a $1000 every year. In return, I want $20 for said device. For this, I’m seen as being greedy.

    Sam isn’t satisfied with saving the $1000, He also wants to skip paying me my $20. Who is really the greedy person here.

  • wpj

    Rossi was paid $11.5m for “validated” results (doesn’t matter if we believe it).

    IH reportedly obtained $260m ($60m Woodford, $200m Chinese- “reportedly” due to the Chinese figure coming from Rossi). IH say that the work was not “substantiated” in 3 years, yet they took the money.

    Who is the fraudster?

    • Tom59

      While the quarrels continue and time passes, China is going ahead bold and fast and will bring the reactors to the market. Would help the technology…

      • SG

        No doubt about it. China’s only viable alternative is coal, which is killing off their people, and making life in their cities unbearable. They have FAR bigger incentives to run with LENR than the US. You will also see India in the mix as well given the needs of their gigantic population and limited energy resources.

  • Private Citizen

    Giving Rossi the benefit of doubt, Rossi could be like Philo T. Farnsworth who invented electronic television as a dogged solo inventor, while David Sarnoff saw the potential and bought up the patent of Vladimir Zworykin as cover for reverse engineering Farnsworth’s technology while delaying Farnsworth endlessly in court.

    Or Rossi could have nothing, but based on flawed Lugano thermography and an earlier flawed Penon test, IH bought into Rossi’s claims.

    Those who yearn to either believe or to disbelieve will torture and twist the narrative to their own comfort, inventing theories about the withheld “secret sauce” and such. Those heavily invested in skepticism or faith will be the last to admit they are wrong.

    • Michael W Wolf

      You are absolutely right. But why fraudulently claim 50 COP when you only need a more believable 3 COP to pull off the scam? Why not walk with an 11.5 million dollar scam? Just like sometimes paranoid people are right. Blind faith doesn’t always mean you are wrong. I believe Fabiani and he is working for who I consider the bad guys in this scenario. I could be wrong but Fabiano would have to be a double agent, right?

  • psi2u2

    Jumping to conclusions is surely premature given the extensive discussion that has taken place on these forums about IH various actions, including taking out its own patents on a process you now condemn as the work of a “fraud.” Whether or not Rossi is a “fraud” can only be decided by a court of law or through some unequivocal demonstration of a working product.

  • http://sifferkoll.se Sifferkoll®

    “Rossi is a pain in the ass” I would consider a scientific fact.

    Apco is a clue though. They make a living from the kind of stuff we could label “conspiracy theories”. They also have Clinton and green agenda connections. The academics will go for the “scientifically rigorous approach” type of arguments.

  • JDM

    IH claims that they cannot replicate flies in the face of their patent application for the device. Anyone investing in IH as a results of a known, non-functional device and patent will be looking for blood I would think!

    • Frank Acland

      I don’t know if it makes a big difference, but the word they actually used was they could not “substantiate” Rossi’s claims.

      Substantiate means: “provide evidence to support or prove the truth of.”
      Replicate means: “make an exact copy of; reproduce.”

      • http://sifferkoll.se Sifferkoll®
        • artefact

          Good one!

        • ggummm

          The paradigm shift will be even more disruptive than ecat itself. “They” can not stop “that”

      • wpj

        Rossi used “replicate” when describing what they said rather than “substantiate” which is where the confusion may arise.

      • Andreas Moraitis

        In case that they did not refer to own replication attempts, „to substantiate“ could only mean to assess the report of the ERV. If they agreed with the test protocol as is stated in #63 of the suit, I guess they are not in a good position to question the result, even if it should be a false positive – except if they could prove that either the protocol was modified or that the report contains incorrect data or calculations.

        • wpj

          They had 2 people there for a lot of the time which should have been their “substantiation”- that and the electricity consumption.

          • Andreas Moraitis

            The presence of the two IH employees is an interesting detail. If they had noticed that something was wrong with the test, they should have informed IH immediately. IH would then have been obliged to disclose this information to their investors, I suppose. This could be another point for Rossi.

      • JDM

        2.5 years of due diligence for investment on unsubstantiated results would still not be reasonable. 50M$ unreasonable!

      • Omega Z

        “substantiate” would be a safe term. They have not called Rossi a out right liar or fraud which could be an issue latter in court $$$. It can be considered an (F9) statement.

    • http://www.health-answers.co.uk Agaricus

      “Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence”. Even more so if you are deliberately looking in the wrong direction.

  • Andre Blum

    An extra round of applause is in place for MFMP at this moment. Their recent replication, as Bob Greenyer said, lends a lot of credibility to Rossi, helping me a lot to stay positive in this crisis.

  • GordonDocherty

    “Industrial Heat has worked for over three years to substantiate the
    results claimed by Mr. Rossi from the E-Cat technology – all without
    success”

    What does that mean?

    Are they going to say “the E-Cat doesn’t work but, hey, here is the F-Cat, and it works just fine”, or “the E-Cat works, but not as he claimed (50 times isn’t 6 times, after all)”, or “the E-Cat can’t be automatically and continuously loaded with new fuel as we say Andrea Rossi said it could” or some such?

    I note, in other words, that the wording has been very careful crafted so as to say not very much at all.

    Again:

    “Leonardo Corporation and Mr. Rossi also have repeatedly breached their agreements”

    but no detail – but, then, there is a Freudian slip in there – the word “also”. In effect, IH are admitting they breached their side of any agreements, as in, if I say “he also did it”, this means I must have done it too…

    • Teemu Soilamo

      I think you’re reading too much into it. Look at what happened the last time we tried to analyze IH’s words; few predicted that it was pre-emptive damage control for an upcoming lawsuit. Some even construed it as a positive for Rossi and LENR.

    • EEStorFanFibb

      nice catch! re: “also”

  • http://sifferkoll.se Sifferkoll®

    IH has issued a standard lawyerBot answer. However we need have our eyes open for the Apco people getting to work behind scenes. Their specialty is fake grassroot movements and using the “science” word out of context. They show themselves in the last sentence. In this case the purpose is all about delay. This is the establishment talking. They do not want to sell the product even if it works, only to research it indefinately and find the best way to implement it top-down to reduce disruption.

    • kdk

      Indeed, they’ve done very fine work for us… this ridiculous saga of messing up our planet should have been over decades ago.

  • e-dog

    Ok… Ok. What ever happened to the company who was getting the heat?
    Did they save money? or not?
    Did they use less power for heating or not?
    Was the shipping container useful or not?
    When, how why cant we find out????????

    • bachcole

      Yeah, where is the customer? Who is the customer? I would be nice to hear from them.

  • http://www.libertynewspost.com/ Liberty Newspost

    After thinking about this for a while I have a few of thoughts on IH. 1. IH doesn’t want to pay Rossi because once they do he is off to the races with his plant which will be in direct competition with their other “LENR” technologies. They want to set the table for the entire market and Rossi wont allow them to do it. Brillouin Energy and others are in the ear of IH. 2. They don’t like Rossi its like Tesla and Edison all over again. 3. The picture runs deeper than we know Governments and Multinationals are now involved and it is now a question of power and security. 4. Rossi will go down as one of the biggest disruptors in human history (possibly along with Dr. Mills who seems content to give the market time torealize that he is coming).

    • Bob Greenyer

      yes

    • BadgerWI

      Or…Just to play Devil’s advocate… Rossi has nothing and IH has the research to prove it.

      • blanco69

        Agreed. This risk here is to pick a side first and then wade in with an opinion. I think one would be prudent to conceed that IH know much more about the 1MW system than we do. They have also just publicly said that, after years of closely working together, they cannot substantiate Rossi’s claims. That’s got to be damaging. Especially when it turns out the ERV is not as independant as he could be. If the ecat runs at COP>50 lets see it – a first year science sudent would be able to determine that. If we get clear independent verification then IH’s position becomes less solid. A letter from Rossi’s friend Penon wont do it.

        • Ged

          I am kinda curious as to know where the idea Penon is Rossi’s friend comes from. We know from the filing that IH was involved in Penon’s original selection with the 24 hour test, so at the least, he’s a mutual friend of them both. But, IH also had techs working constantly in there, so if they have proof, they will pony up. If they don’t provide data, then they are just doing the usual “deny everything and accuse the other” legal maneuvering.

          • Omega Z

            It’s simple,
            If you know Rossi, even due to a previous test, you must be biased. Therefore, Not independent.
            It is similar to Rossi/Levi. They did not initially know each other. Levi spent much time trying to debunk the E-cat. That He come to know Rossi during that time and could not debunk the E-cat, he must be his friend and automatically Biased.

    • Eyedoc

      AR is off to the races anyway !!!!

  • Obvious

    “Darden says his group was not involved with the test cited in the report.
    “We built the reactor, but we shipped it over to Switzerland,” he says.”

    http://www.bizjournals.com/triangle/blog/techflash/2014/10/raleigh-investor-darden-still-bullish-on.html

  • Iggy Dalrymple

    If Ih asserts that Rossi’s technnology is inferior, then now is
    time for Rossi to negotiate his way back into the driver’s seat. IH cannot have it both ways….claiming that the e-Cat is worthless, yet claiming that it is entitled to the marketing & production rights.

    • Heath

      Let’s wait until we see both sides. We are seeing a lot of history that we weren’t privy to. And as you may recall the wait on this info has been frustrating for years to us all.

    • bfast

      If I read IH right, they simply say that the e-cat doesn’t work — not that it is somehow inferior to something else. Their agreement with Rossi was for the run to produce a minimum COP of 6. Rossi says it blew the doors off 6, they seem to say it didn’t. Either it did or it didn’t. Either IH or Rossi is feeding us the brown stuff.

      When IH says, “Industrial Heat continues to be focused on a scientifically rigorous approach that includes thorough, robust and accurate testing of promising LENR technologies” they seem to be implying that the tests done on the e-cat were not “robust and accurate”. This smells brown to me. They were partner in the testing, why it would somehow not be “robust and accurate” is beyond me.

      My vote is that IH is the one feeding us the brown stuff. ‘Just hope Rossi can survive their shenanigans.

      • US_Citizen71

        Yes IH seems to be treating the world like mushrooms.

    • sam

      I think you are right Iggy.
      But Rossi is from the old
      school of business where
      if you agree to a deal you
      stick to it.
      So it might not happen.

  • Ecco

    I have nothing to do with Rossi or IH. I simply took some time off.

    • Charlie tapp

      Alright your back! You know that was just for fun right I know where you stand. Now get back to work.

  • e-dog

    Ecco…. they are all in on it

    • e-dog

      year after next.. we might find out

  • Obvious

    Andrea Rossi
    April 7, 2016 at 9:09 PM

    Hank Mills:
    In the press release of IH they write that ” for three years they tried to replicate the Rossi effect, with no avail”: very good, but during those three years Industrial Heat collected about 60 million dollars from Woodford, more millions from other sources, exclusively based on my E-Cats technology. This before making shopping to buy other patents. Now, the cases are two: either they are lying when they say they didn’t replicate, or they made a fraud collecting 60 millions from Woodford, more from others, not to mention Cherokee fund. You had to see Tom Darden and JT Vaughn dance like ballet etoiles around the investors, showing them the E-Cats, and telling them that the E-Cats had been built by them! “Stellar” coherently Darden, in his role of etoile, repeated to the enchanted attandees, ready to spend 50 millions. Now, that my bill arrived, the E-Cat had not been replicated , they say. For three years.
    Again, I am just answering to a press release of IH.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

    • SG

      Hindsight is 20/20, but the $89 million should have been escrowed. Otherwise, no deal.

      • bfast

        You are soooo right!

      • deleo77

        Also, did IH sign off on the ERV and the testing protocols before the test started? The details of the test should have been explicitly laid out and agreed upon in the contract. Why would Rossi conduct a 350 day test expecting a pay day at the end of it if there was not an iron clad agreement that the test was signed off on by IH? This should have all been agreed to by both parties in a binding contract. $89 million is a lot of money. Where were the lawyers?

        • SG

          I don’t think IH ever intended to pay the $89 million. They dragged their feet (for about a year) on getting the 350 test underway. Whenever Mr. Darden or IH have made public speeches, announcements, or interviews, they have always downplayed the e-Cat, and in most instances, didn’t even mention it. In fact, they were careful to expound upon their efforts to invest in a variety of LENR startups.

          Yet, in the background, they were allegedly using their own independently replicated e-Cat devices and test results to induce significant investments form the likes of Woodford. I must say, my initial reading of Mr. Darden as being an enlightened individual out for the greater good seems to have been way off.

        • e-dog

          Its a farce. Rossi is not a good business man but he thinks he is.

        • Omega Z

          IH obviously signed on the dotted line.
          However, If they didn’t, why would they accept $1000 a day for the sale of heat from the customer ???

      • Bernie Koppenhofer

        I am sure they tried, very few have 100 million in the bank for such purpose.

  • Obvious

    Andrea Rossi

    April 7, 2016 at 8:32 PM

    Hank Mills:

    They prepared everything, the charges, the body of the reactor EVERYTHING !!!.

    I just teached to them what to do.

    They never used anything pre-prepared by Leonardo Corp.

    Now, let me talk to you of a very singular coincidence: Brillouin has
    always made only electrolytic apparatuses: go to read all their patent
    applications made before their agreement with IH, and you will find
    confirmation of what I am saying ( I know their patents by heart,
    because I have studied them and probably I know them better than
    themselves : I wrote about 100 pages of notes about their patents ). And
    now the singular coincidence: they make the agreement with IH in April
    2015, and Voilà, they made a public demo in Capitol Hill ( Washington,
    DC) with a device that is the Copy-Cat of something I am familiar with.
    Nothing that Brillouin has ever made before the agreement with IH. What a
    coincidence !!!

    Warm Regards,

    A.R.

  • e-dog

    I remember reading this… can remember I felt good! Rossi had told other people the secret… things were moving forward…
    Damn