Rossi: UK to Get first Industrial E-Cat X Plant

Thanks to artefact for posting this on another thread. I have to say I get a bit excited to think that my mother country will be the first country to get the first E-Cat X plant. Maybe it will be motivation enough for the British government to stop thinking about the new nuclear fission reactor they have in the pipeline at the Hinkley Point nuclear power stations:

“jimmy February 26, 2016 at 12:20 AM
Dr Andrea Rossi,
In which Country is the customer who bought the first industrial E-Cat X ?
Thank you if you can answer,
Jimmy

Andrea Rossi February 26, 2016 at 9:51 AM
Jimmy:
UK
Warm Regards, A.R.”

It sounds to me that this will be built by Leonardo Corp. which is going to operate in Europe. Hydro Fusion, although run by Swedes, is actually incorporated in the UK.

  • artefact

    On JONP:

    “Amos February 28, 2016 at 5:51 AM
    Dear Mr. Rossi,
    Is the energy density & power density of the E-Cat X the same as the E-Cat? Also, is it possible for the E-Cat X to produce only electricity and no heat?
    Thanks, Amos.

    Andrea Rossi February 28, 2016 at 7:42 AM
    Amos:
    1-The Ecat X has a higher power density
    2- Yes, but in this case the efficiency is lower.
    Warm Regards
    A.R.”

  • Iggy Dalrymple

    Is the 250 KW E-CatX module a single reactor or a bundle?

  • Alan DeAngelis

    When Los Angeles is powered by E-CatXs, we might read about it in a side bar to yet another article about hot fusion being just around the corner.
    https://i.ytimg.com/vi/K-2B8H5_lTU/maxresdefault.jpg

    • http://renewable.50webs.com/ Christopher Calder

      After years of not even having a publicly available phone number, Tri Alpha Energy now has a cool new website and video. Their reactor design has the advantage that you do not have to shut down and tear the reactor apart to refuel. Thus, it might be a better choice for powering a spaceship or a naval vessel.

      http://www.trialphaenergy.com/

      If the E-Cat X does produce electricity through creation of Alpha particles, then both companies are working on the same problems through different routes. I say do not prejudge because neither company has a commercially available product. Both may work and have special properties that will find a specific use.

      Lockheed Martin, I suspect, is further along than Tri Alpha, but I am not sure.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UlYClniDFkM

      We should wish them all the best of luck. They are all using private funds and advancing basic science along the way, so taxpayers have no reason to get upset.

  • AdrianAshfield

    As Woodford Patient Capital Trust invested $49 million in Industrial Heat, it is no surprise the one of the first plants would be in the UK.

    • http://lenrftw.net LENR G

      Ooh. That exact figure is news to me — must have missed it. Do you have a source?

      And really why not $50M? Is that a threshold of significance in the finance world or something?

    • psi2u2

      When I tried to edit Rossi’s Wikipedia page to document that Cherokee IH had acquired rights to the technology, my edit was immediately reverted. Thanks for the update/reminder that it is more than Cherokee’s ~12 million that has been put to work for the big rollout. Poor wikipedia.

      • Zavod

        I have tried to edit that article for years but have been repeatedly driven off by a cabal of anti-Rossi-coldfusion-ecat fools. It is hopeless

        • psi2u2

          Well, we fought the good fight. Wikipedia is going to have mud on its face for this one (among others).

  • georgehants

    Mr.Rossi has not said, subject to safety certification being obtained, so either it has been obtained, unlikely in the few months since discovery, or it must be covered by the certificate from the original E-cat.
    So what ever the improvements of the X must be they in no way altering the basic design of the Cat.

    • Ophelia Rump

      Hi Georgehants, I believe you are precisely correct. If I am not mistaken Dottore Rossi himself stated explicitly that the Ecat-X falls under the patents.

      It amazes me that the patents are broad enough to allow that. No doubt there will be more patents too.

  • http://www.health-answers.co.uk Agaricus

    There’s no built-in way to ‘up-tick’ Admins comments, but I’m doing so now for “Maybe it will be motivation enough for the British government to stop thinking about the new nuclear fission reactor they have in the pipeline at the Hinkley Point nuclear power stations”.

    Despite vast gifts of UK taxpayer and consumer money, huge amounts of government propaganda and misinformation, a total re-write of UK planning law to make local objections moot, additional loan guarantees, and Chinese investment money (to get a foot in the door of the UK ‘nuclear renaissance’) EDF can’t seem to get this unwanted white elephant off the ground, or even complete the two other EPR projects (Olkiluoto, Finland and Flammanville, France) it has in hand in Europe.

    Despite this huge steaming pile, Osborne, Cameron and their hangers-on don’t seem to be capable of letting the project go, for reasons of face saving and possibly others that are not in the public domain, and if it comes in time, the arrival first cold fusion reactor in the UK may provide the means to finally put the Hinkley C monster out of its misery.

    • georgehants

      Peter, until a return of a free media is possible, not owned by a few capitalist dictators spewing out biased and censored rubbish, including the establishment hugging BBC, then democracy in the West is ended.
      The voters have basically two party’s in this sham of democracy, both following the same paths and if a new face shows up such as Jeremy Corbyn, then he is immediately destroyed by that said capitalist controlled media.
      As you point out, no care for people, etc. in this cleverly controlled dictatorship.
      What is the answer?

      • http://www.health-answers.co.uk Agaricus

        Morning George. All agreed, there is not much democracy left here, and what little remains will have gone by the time the Tories are heaved out. We just have to pray that non-establishment voices like Corbyn prevail in the end I suppose.

        http://www.thecanary.co/2016/02/26/blairites-may-hate-corbyn-loves-matters/

        • georgehants

          Good link but it misses the Fact that much public opinion is controlled by a media owned by the rich.
          Unless this is changed I can see no hope for “democracy.”

      • Roberto Siquieros

        JC isn’t written off yet despite the media’s best attempts.

      • oldrolledgold

        Capitalism hasn’t been tried for 200 years.

    • Stefenski

      There is only one Green MP ; probably the most likely to bring this to attention.

      She is likely to have mainstream dogma science advisor’s though, otherwise they should have spoken up before now.
      I have emailed various parties, & individual MP’s

      lots of the posters will be acting similarly, maybe it will sink in , & if we can get the newspapers to report some actual news, instead of Kardasian’s proportions, who knows.

      • http://www.health-answers.co.uk Agaricus

        Not until an actual unit is operating and can be confirmed by some reputable third party. Even green MPs will be pretty thoroughly conditioned to go into ‘conspiracy loon’ mode as soon as the topic of cold fusion is raised.

        Like many others who post here, I learned quite quickly not to bother mentioning the subject, even to my immediate family, and will keep quiet until the evidence is rock solid. You can’t overcome a Pavlovian reaction with soft evidence.

    • BillH

      Nothing constructive being said by you as usual. Get off your soapbox, and stick to the subject. Insulting four countries, their governments, an energy company, it’s easy seen you’re anti everything.

      • psi2u2

        I didn’t get that feeling at all. Agaricus presented a fully coherent critique of the problems of the Hinkley Stations as he sees them. Such delays and problems are well known to those who have followed the history of fission as a power source. Its yesterday’s solution and should be phased out as quickly as possible the world over, replaced by LENR and a mix of renewables suitable to local opportunity.

    • bkrharold

      I understand that Britain was making great progress rolling out offshore wind power, before the Conservatives took over. I hope they can get this effort started again, once the CameraOn Government is booted out.

      • Roberto Siquieros

        Yeah but it takes 10,000 BIG turbines to make one Sizewell B. Then there’s the whole base power issue. Having said that CAT’s Zero Carbon Britain report shows how it can be done with existing renewable tech and ‘power down’ strategies. LENR would make it all so much more simple though.

        • bkrharold

          Wind turbine technology has improved dramatically in the past few years. A large team of researchers from the University of Virginia, Sandia National Laboratories, University of Illinois, the University of Colorado, the Colorado School of Mines, and the National Renewable Energy Laboratory are working together to build a low-cost 50-MW wind turbine for use offshore.

          http://www.treehugger.com/wind-technology/giant-offshore-wind-turbine-will-feature-blades-longer-two-football-fields.html

          Before the conservatives ruined everything Britain led the world in offshore wind turbine energy generation. I agree the ecat is superior, but it still faces stiff resistance. Consequently its adoption will be a long uphill battle. In the meantime we must reduce our use of fossil fuel.

          • Roberto Siquieros

            Thx for the interesting link. I wonder what kind of EROI we could expect from these beasts .. are they better, or just bigger?

            • bkrharold

              The new blades will be larger, but much lighter and cheaper due to a more rational design, that works with, rather than against the wind. This design should have superior EROI compared with conventional blades. A blade with the proposed dimensions of 650 feet, will be two and half times longer than any existing blade, and would be impractical using conventional blade designs.
              The research team are taking a novel approach, using an example from nature. The team is focusing on a new design that mimics the way palm trees respond to extra strong wind. The Segmented Ultralight Morphing Rotor (SUMR) turbine responds to wind strength by changing the direction the lightweight blades are facing. In very high winds, the blades bend and align with the wind direction, much like a palm tree in a hurricane, which reduces the risk of damage. When the wind is blowing at lower speeds, the blades spread out to maximize energy generation. The new blades would be manufactured in segments, which would make them easier to build and transport and also save money.

        • DrD

          Yes, and don’t forget the energy and carbon foootprint that goes into building them, installing them and maintaining them. Because of that, the power they generate is not cheap.

    • Gerard McEk

      Rossi did not want to say anything about what the plant is going to produce (heat, electricity, or light or a combination of it). That gives me the impression that it might be a military customer again. It will be equipped with extensive metering though.

    • DrD

      Just imagine the embarrassment. IF enough of us in the UK (industry included) generate our own electric. What will they do with all that excess capacity they’re about to “borrow” with a long term loan from China and France.
      I wonder if they see it coming and that’s why they’re stalling? Nah, they couldn’t be so astute.
      I suppse they could but bariers in our way.

  • Gryphon

    I guess if you’ve made one you’ve technically started…

  • Alan DeAngelis
  • Josh G

    I remember that Darden/Industrial heat got additional financing from an investor. If memory serves, weren’t they located in the UK?

    • Mats002

      Yes, Woodford Patient Trust Capital, WPTC.L

      • LarryJ

        Typo. The symbol is WPCT.L
        Woodford Patient Capital Trust

  • Zephir

    /* we have started the production of 1 million pieces */

    IMO this is simply BS, as Andrea Rossi still spends his days and nights in his first 1MW container

  • EEStorFanFibb

    LongtimeLurker… that’s good handle for a guy that screams at the hardworking and self-sacrificing Bob G.

  • Bob Greenyer

    Yes boss

    • Omega Z

      Definition of: “LongtimeLurker”

      Someone who
      spends all their time watching others do the work.
      complains you are doing it wrong in a non constructive manner.
      complains you are taking to long.
      are the 1st to walk away when offered the opportunity to help out.

  • Stephen

    I can imagine all kinds of inovative projects in the UK that could benifit hugely from integrating e-cat X with their technology. But even if it’s just as an energy source it’s still great news. Good luck to who ever they are. Will be great to see it some day. I hope we can.

  • Ged

    So, how much of a salary do you pay him, for how many hours a week is he on your dime, and for what window of working hours?

  • Gryphon

    Here’s hoping it will be somewhere close to where I live and will be open to the public

    • http://www.health-answers.co.uk Agaricus

      If the location is made public I’m sure that one or other of the Brits posting here will be close enough to take a look and report back.

      • georgehants

        Morning Peter, if it turns out to be Penzance then I will happily take a look, but going by experience up to now it will probably be located in the vaults of the fortress like Lloyd’s bank here.

      • Jas

        Ive got Bristol covered.

  • Mats002

    Those kind of statements from Rossi that have not yet materialized after 4 years add to the sceptic side.

    He is obviously over optimistic about production and time to market.

  • bkrharold

    As an expat Brit, I am thrilled that the ecat is going to the UK. Lately there has been a lot of disturbing news about fracking in the UK. Helpfully this will put a stop to it.

    • Ophelia Rump

      Do you expect the UK to be as closed minded as the US when it comes to people hearing about the plant and the technology?

      • bkrharold

        No I’m afraid not, however there are a few crackpots like me still left over there who might light a fire under the hidebound conservative government. Having a working ecat will help convince the doubters.

        • http://www.health-answers.co.uk Agaricus

          ‘Hidebound’ seems a rather generous interpretation of their actions to date.

          • bkrharold

            Of course there are many other less polite descriptions I could have used, I wanted to keep it family friendly

    • http://www.health-answers.co.uk Agaricus

      Just like ‘new nukes’ the current government is going all out to get fracking going in the UK, as if the US experience has just sailed over their collective heads. There is something seriously wrong with these people.

      http://frack-off.org.uk/fracking-hell/

      • bkrharold

        It is especially disheartening to hear of this giant step backward. When I was a young boy my brother sister and I used to go for long walks in the beautiful British countryside. We used to walk for miles, enjoying the fresh air and natural beauty. I remember those days with great fondness. I see the damage that has been caused by fracking here in the USA, and it is truly heart breaking to think of this happening in England too. The world has gone mad.

  • Ophelia Rump

    Perhaps Dottore Rossi will be living in England for a while with this plant.
    I expect that this is another extended test plant which is being referred to.

    • bkrharold

      He will not enjoy it too much, If he is confined inside a shipping container most of the time.

  • Albert D. Kallal

    Where is the word plant used at ANY
    point in time in Ross’s response?

    The simple question where does the first
    customer for the e-cat-x (industrial version) reside?

    There nothing that hints, suggests, implies
    or advises ANYTHING about manufacturing, or anything about the location of the
    first manufacturing plant and location.

    How one goes from a simple and crystal
    clear answer to where some first customer resides as to then some MASSIVE stretch
    that this somehow by some sort of twisted logic suggests ANYTHING about the
    location of a manufacturing plant.

    I see nothing in the question nor the
    answer that pertains to location of a plant, but only where does the first
    customer reside who placed a order for the e-cat-x.

    Regards,
    Albert D. Kallal
    Edmonton, Alberta Canada

    • Ophelia Rump

      Lighten up, he merely conflated distribution with manufacturing. The fact that you can see the difference should negate your horror.

      • Albert D. Kallal

        Of course, it is a bundle of joy
        watching people stumble over each other like penguins on ice while they respond
        to something that was not implied!

        So a fun and enjoyable tone here is great.

        The flip side is Rossi already has credibility
        problem, so spreading falsehoods about Rossi has risks, and then those same
        people turn around and wonder why so few believe him?

        It can make our job harder spreading the
        LENR story to the world.

        Interestingly, I would say that “confidence”
        levels about LENR are near weekly reaching new highs – we probably don’t have
        to worry much about Rossi’s credibility anymore!

        So yes, do have fun with this thread!

        Regards,
        Albert D. Kallal
        Edmonton, Alberta Canada

        • Slad

          “Plant” can refer to a both a manufacturing facility or a piece of apparatus

          • hempenearth

            Or something growing in your back yard

        • LarryJ

          Rossi’s credibility, our job spreading the word and rising confidence levels are all moot points once we have products in the market. Until that day Rossi’s credibility will always be questioned, the general public will at best, ignore us crackpots talking cold fusion and LENR confidence levels although rising will remain minuscule in the big picture.

          I have no more ability to convince people that cold fusion is real now than I did 4 years ago and the people I told 4 years ago just roll their eyes. As for rising confidence levels, even if the number of believers doubled overnight we would still be a very small drop in a very large bucket. Until we see products in the market cold fusion will remain pie in the sky to normal rational people. In the public view it is simply too good to be true which is the nature of a paradigm shift.

          My personal confidence that we will see products this year is rising but I think it all depends now on how fast IH moves. As I understand it, the industrial low temp ecat is currently the only product and Leonardo appears to be focused on the ecat-x and hope to build a single ecat-x prototype industrial plant this year so it is up to IH to start the low temp industrial ecat product ball rolling. They may announce something when the next report is released but what would be the point. Talk is cheap but actions (ie products) speak volumes. Marketing is a non issue for this product so talking about it is a waste of time and might even provide a rallying point for the opposition.

  • wpj

    As an aside, what size will these industrial C-Cat Xs be? I thought that they were pretty low power of 1kW.

    • Frank Acland

      Rossi has said that they are modular, meaning they are built up by combining small E-Cat X units to whatever size is needed.

      • wpj

        I understand that, but it seems that 1000 of these units gives a lot to go wrong on the control aspect even if it is 50 cigarette pack’s worth.

    • pg

      ??

    • artefact

      1 KW the size of one ore two cigarettes.

    • Gerard McEk

      I guess, the UK can’t stand more than 1 kW. Well, a bit more than 1 kW may not overheat the UK, but you know it isn’t as big as the US, so Rossi is careful. 😉

      He once mentioned the Ecat X is about 20 kW and has the size of a sigaret package. But it can be scaled to any size. He is talking about a plant, multiple Ecats: any size.

    • Omega Z

      Dear Andrea Rossi:
      The 1 MW plant made with the E-Cat X has the same dimensions of the E-Cat that made the 350 days test, or smaller?
      Regards, Josh
      ———————————————
      Much smaller. Very much smaller.
      Warm Regards, A.R.

      • artefact

        Nice 🙂

      • C. Kirk

        toussaint February 27, 2016 at 3:47 AM
        Dear Andrea Rossi,
        The industrial E-CAT X your are planning to buid, will it have the same power as the
        older E-CAT industrial plant ?

        Andrea Rossi February 27, 2016 at 8:27 AM
        No, it will be 250 kW. Warm Regards, A.R.

        So 250 1kw reactors ( each reactor the size of a pencil plus associated eqpt ) ?

  • wpj

    I doubt if we will ever see these reactors; the builds in several other countries are many years behind schedule and not a single one of these new French designs is actually operating. I believe that they have already spent £2 billion in the preparations so far.

    We took the energy industry out of pubic ownership only for it to go back into public ownership in other counties who are making the profits. Beggars belief!

    • pg

      ???

      • Gryphon

        I believe wpj is referring to the Hinkley Point fission reactors

        • pg

          Yes but in what context?

          • Gryphon

            Just that things are not going smoothly for them regardless of any impact on the traditional nuclear sector which the ecat may have. If you’re not familiar with them they are a messy PFI project involving French reactor designs, Chinese investment and a promise by the UK government that the operators can charge a ridiculous premium for the electricity they produce.

            • pg

              I know about it, it s Cameron’s retirement plan, just the whole sentences are disconnected from any context. Anyway, no worries.

              • wpj

                It seems that we had to take the gas/electricity/water industries out of state ownership to make them more efficient and competitive; it now seems that we have sold them out to other state industries (of other counties) which are just as bad, but they are getting the profits and not us.

                Maybe not explained as well as it ought to be above.

                As far as I am concerned, the fission industries can do what that want as I produce chemicals to help clean up their mess, though there is enough there already to keep me going until retirement!

            • Omega Z

              You stopped short.
              “a ridiculous premium for the electricity they produce.”
              Even should it not be needed.

              • Gryphon

                Indeed 🙂

    • Omega Z

      Nissan manufactures in the U.S. so they can sell product cheaper.
      Ford manufactures in Mexico so they can compete.
      Many of the Mega Solar & Wind projects in the U.S. are Foreign owned.
      Welcome to the New World Order.

    • http://www.health-answers.co.uk Agaricus

      Almost as successful as selling off the country’s water supplies and railways then – and soon the NHS.

  • Shiv

    Please ask for specifics.

  • Mats002

    Bye Bye Nukes!

    • http://www.health-answers.co.uk Agaricus

      If only.

  • Dods

    Shape of a giant tea pot please Andrea. Those skeptics love a cup of tea. 😉

    • georgehants

      Dods as Capt. Picard would say, Earl Grey hot

    • Michael W Wolf

      Yea, to wash down the crow.

  • Bob Greenyer

    Wahoo