Andrea Rossi’s Faith

Andrea Rossi has made no secret over the years about his belief in God, and how his faith has been an important aspect in his work. There are a couple of items today that provide a little more detail about the role that his spirituality has played in his life.

On the Journal of Nuclear Physics a read asked some questions on the topic:

Based on your communications, you seem to be a man of science as well as a man of God.

1) Do you reconcile the two philosophically and if so, how?

2) What kind of God do you believe in?

3) Could your spiritual beliefs be partly the reason why you have been attacked so much in your work?

Rossi responded:

1- “Science without Religion is lame. Religion without Science is blind.” ( Albert Einstein, from “Collected Quotes From Albert Einstein” )
2- I am catholic christian and every day I read by heart the New Testament, but I respect any kind of Faith and deem freedom of Faith a pillar of the peaceful convivence of humanity.
3- some imbecile has written that my scientific work cannot be taken seriously due to my religious point of applicaton, but, you know, the mother of imbeciles is always pregnant: they count as a joker in a poker contest. By the way: atheism is still a religion, as well as negative numbers are still numbers.

In a separate article, Vessela Nikolova, author of Andrea Rossi’s biography “E-Cat The New Fire”, has a post on her blog which discusses Rossi’s religious convictions. One of her readers noticed that in the recently released photograph of Rossi with his patent, there was an image of a Madonna in his day-planner. Vessela contacted Andrea Rossi and asked him about the Madonna.

He replied to her explaining that this was an image of the “Madonna delle Grazie”. He explained that after he was released from prison he immediately went to pray in the church of Santa Maria delle Grazie which was close to the prison. He wrote:

“I prayed in that church for my future life and prayed to make useful for something all the studies made in prison on the LENR. I have taken that day, in the same church, an image of St. Mary of the Graces, which is exactly the one that you can see inside my agenda.”

Rossi is not reluctant to share his convictions on many topics, and his religious life is clearly something that is an integral part of his personality, and seems to be a key element in his motivation to continue work on the E-Cat.

Obviously religion can be a controversial topic, and it is not normally not a subject of discussion on this site, but it seems to be relevant when we discuss the life and work of Andrea Rossi. In your comments, remember one of the commenting guidelines here is that “comments arguing for or against religious beliefs or practices” may be subject to moderation. So let’s not get too carried away with religious debates.

UPDATE: Another comment by Andrea Rossi here on the role of faith. A reader from South Africa commented on how he saw similarities between Rossi’s life and that of Nelson Mandela:

Brandon Hurd:
I remember when I was in prison and was listening the television news inside my cell ( 4 meters x 2 with 6 persons inside), listening that I was accused of tremendous crimes I never made ( eventually I have been cleared ” because the facts did not exist”, as the prosecutor himself wrote); imagine: you are closed in a prison and you listen at the television that you are accused of things you never committed and that you don’t even know exactly what they mean ; you listen that all your industries have been seized, closed , all your banks asked back all the money immediately, all your money seized and you can do nothing to react and fight because you are closed and insulated indide a prison for years, while in the meantime your industries go bankrupcy and you lose all what has been built through 3 generations from your family; imagine your wife asks diverce and your sons want not to see you again after what they learnt from mass media about you; imagine all your industries go bankrupt as a consequence of banks loans retrieve and of the fact that all your suppliers take advantage of your situation not paying what they owe you ( and later you will be convicted for these bankrupcies, so that the term you served in prison will have been justified); you know how I could survive all this and came out of this stronger? Asking God: ” OK, you are testing me: now, what can I do for you?”. As a matter of fact, whatever we do, we are born in this word starting from nothing, there is nothing special if we return to be nothing: that’s just an “epochè” that allows us to be reborn.
Thank you for your kind words, but Nelson Mandela is infinitely bigger than I am.
Warm Regards,
A.R.

  • cashmemorz

    Or by ascribing it all to the holographic universe.

  • cashmemorz

    Oh yes there are. They are called psychopaths. They know just enough to control others. And for that reason it is everything to them.

  • William D. Fleming

    I’m not very interested in afterlives. As I see it our true and higher selves are extensions of universal consciousness. There is no past and future except as a bodily illusion. We always have been and always will be. The chain of organisms can be thought of as a single entity.

  • William D. Fleming

    They claim to have science on their side. I guess they haven’t read Einstein, Planck, et. al.

  • Roland

    Reading the comments here reveal certain tensions in our online community that are fundamentally philosophical in nature and, perhaps, it would be helpful to address them from a philosophical perspective rather than a theological one.

    Let’s begin with the easy one, Scientific Materialism (SM). This doctrine arose in specific opposition to the Christian dogma that truth is revealed in divinely inspired subjective experiences and documents, the Bible’s description of the genesis of the cosmos and our place in it being the primary point of contention.

    The strongest argument in favour of SM is that truth is revealed by observation and experimentation; this forms the foundation of the scientific revolution that is the basis of our current civilization, for better or worse. The weakest aspect of SM is a narrow definition of what aspects of reality are amenable to it’s methodology and a body of 18th century dogma that is demonstrably false based on experimental results from the physics of the 20th century.

    It is notable that Quantum Mechanics experiments, far from excluding that the cosmos operates as a ‘thing’, reveal that the ‘particle zoo’ consistently demonstrates that ‘consciousness’ is an integral aspect of reality right down to blurry line between ‘stuff’ and energy.

    It gets worse, in a clever attempt to re-establish a materialistic explanation for our presence here a group of quantum physicists and cosmologists decided to settle the argument by performing a probability analysis of the Big Bang forward to the establishment of the known universal constants. It didn’t produce the expected result of showing a very high probability for the cosmos we inhabit; one of the fundamentals agreed on at the beginning of the process was that the unique properties of water are critical to the the development of any form of advanced intelligence, or even life itself. The probability of water, with all its critical characteristics intact, arising is 2 trillion to 1 against; the final conditions required to arrive at anything like us is 6 trillion to one against.

    An organising intelligence underlying the cosmos seems inescapable; hence the views of Einstein et al.

    The real debate is about the exact nature of the cosmos in all its aspects, and the closest point of departure that fits what we do know about the whole cosmos has probably been given us by David Bohm with his concept of the explicate and implicate orders. The explicate order being the one we apparently inhabit as ‘things’; and an implicate order underlying ‘reality’ that is the stubborn subject of a new generation of experimentalists, possibly including Rossi.

    I’ve been writing an essay on this topic, in conjunction with thinking about LENR, and if there’s a broader interest in kicking these concepts around in this forum I’ll post it, with Frank’s permission, as it bores right in on the blurry borderland we’re trying to understand in service to LENR.

    • ecatworld

      Feel free to submit the essay at the link on the top of the page, or send me an email.

      • Roland

        Thank you Frank, I have my plate full for the next few days, then I’ll finish it.

        • cashmemorz

          Re: the Holographic Universe. I wonder of the implications that it indicates that there may be a reality higher than the one we see or seem to live in. What I mean is, if the data of the shell of the universe gives rise to our perceived cosmos, then we and that cosmos are not as real as that which gives rise to it or its perception. This apparently is similar to what a photographic hologram does: it is used to create an image that is not there in the same sense that the medium producing the image is really or physically there. The holographic image is visible when a light specific to the photographic films encoded data is turned on. Similar reality perception in our “apparent” cosmos.

          • cashmemorz

            Edit: Maybe its my religious upbringing that is talking or conceptualizing the following but here goes: Since we,(we meaning everything in the cosmos) as an image of the data in the shell of the universe, then it seems like a parallel concept to the bibles genesis story where god created man in his image. This parallel would make the shell into god or a god-like agent. Taking another point from the genesis story about the fruit of knowledge and evil in the center of the garden, the stuff inside the universe where we are located as contrasted by the shell that gives rise to our reality, then we are in the center of what could be termed a garden but we cannot get true knowledge of what is in that center since it does not exist as the ultimate reality or knowledge of ultimate reality in that part of or center of the universe. Where the ultimate knowledge or data exists is in the shell and that part is forbidden to physically reach since we are only an image produced by the shell. It would be like the image, produced by a holographic film, trying to understand the film that produces the image. A circular concept that may not be attainable, hence forbidden, in more than one sense. It is relatively trivial to draw more such parallels between the holographic universe and what the stories in the bible tell. The shell may be heaven or god or the road to wards them. The holographic agent may be gods way of creating the universe. And heaven or god is another layer up from there inasmuch as a photographer is much more than the holographic film that the photographer makes or creates. Or maybe, more realistically, the shell is the outer part of a black hole that we inhabit. We, the inside of the universe is created as a multi -dimensional reality that is simply encoded by the shell, as the theory simply indicates and not much more than that. Whether there is anything to drawing such parallels to religious stories, I do not know. Just compelling parallels that I seem to see in this theory.

  • William D. Fleming

    Hard to define. I feel that I have awakened to a wondrous, beautiful realm which I do not understand. Deep conscious awareness is somehow involved with reality. “That which is” comes to mind but then, what is the definition of “is”?

    • bachcole

      It may sound funny, but ‘is’ is not the same for everyone. And I don’t even care so much for the word “define”, which seems to put a perimeter around whatever “define” is applied to. With ‘is’, ‘is’ is whatever a person experiences. But some ‘is’ is more rewarding than others. For example, the ‘is’ for a person who shot-up heroin 5 minutes ago is delightful beyond words. 10 hours later that person’s is is not so much fun.

      • William D. Fleming

        Those times of pleasure and pain seem to be part of the bodily experience. They come and go, as do bodies themselves come and go. I lean toward the idea that in a higher realm there is only continuous harmony and joy, and that personal identities are merged. “We” are in that higher realm right now, if we could only see it.

  • William D. Fleming

    Actually, what they are preaching is more than just atheism. Their statements of disbelief in God represent a defensive reaction to what they do believe. Generally atheism is a cover for a deeply held belief in the doctrines of materialism.

    For example, some of them assert with absolute certainty that conscious awareness arises from electric/chemical nerve impulses and that as machine-like beings we have no free will. They believe that reality is composed of matter moving in space and time and that our sensual interpretation of that reality is a more or less accurate picture of all that exists. These crude and immature materialist beliefs are based on pure faith–thus Rossi’s depiction of them as “religious”.

    Besides coming out as atheists, materialists frantically try to prop up their tottering world- view by going around debunking everything from ESP research to reincarnation, and even sometimes cold fusion.

  • http://magicmusicandmore.com/ Barry

    I can understand being an agnostic, but to say there is no God one has to throw out all of the more expanded definitions like Einstein’s (Spinoza’s) God. To say there is no God is a statement of unknowable faith.

  • Omega Z

    Sandy,
    Probably, It’s just not yet ready for mass production. The only thing close is the Lt-cat. The Ht-cat is still very much in R&D. Not even ready for a pilot test.

    Beyond that, I have seen nothing to date that says this will have any real impact on Oil for some time to come(Around 20 years). Even the impact on coal will take time. In fact coal is more at risk from Natural Gas at this point & that will take at least a decade to convert existing coal plants.

    Rossi has mentioned a facility producing 1 million reactors a year. That is just a small beginning. At least 1000+ such facilities will be required for world transition in a 40 year period. Given the likely life cycle, at that point it will be time to replace those already built. A never ending loop.

  • http://magicmusicandmore.com/ Barry

    I like the Einstein quote. He sided with Spinoza who didn’t differentiate God from nature. Divinity is a perspective. If one said that tree is divine and someone else said it wasn’t they could both be right, just different perspectives. That’s how both see the tree. When Einstein looked through a telescope at the universe he saw divinity.

    I always found the idea of a blind and random universe sad and hard to believe. On the other hand, in an age of science the idea of God has to be scrutinized and looked at anew. That’s our challenge. Maybe this is what’s meant that “We cannot put new wine in old wineskins”.

    It’s interesting that an intelligent intuitive like Einstein sided with a perspective of divinity from a man who lived in the 17th century. Spinoza seemed well ahead of his time.

  • William D. Fleming

    –Atheists who reject the existence of supernatural beings (gods, angels, demons,etc.) are not practicing a “religion”.–

    Is that the definition of atheism or is it a straw man argument? According to your definition I’m an atheist. The dualistic concept of supernatural vs. natural seems totally bogus, and the idea of human-like gods, devils, and angels seems childish IMO.

    There remains a deep awe and respect for the enigmas of reality; the mystery of personal identity and free will, the miracle of conscious awareness, and the overpowering fact that anything exists at all. Religion is not about knowing the answers. It is having deep awareness of the questions.

    • http://magicmusicandmore.com/ Barry

      Robert Johnson, a Jungian psychiatrist said “90% of the energy is in the questions”.

  • Omega Z

    “irrational” according to who’s opinion. Perhaps those who believe in a higher power “are trying to rescue other people from the mind-destroying effects of irrational belief systems.”

    You believe there is no God or higher power. Your belief is also of blind faith. When you build a church, preach atheism & file for tax exemption. Sounds like every other organized religion to me. You as well as everyone else believe in the unprovable everyday. You merely take exception to belief in a higher power.

    IMHO, Most everyone is born instinctively knowing there is something more then what is visible in everyday life. However, we do not trust our fellow humans & by extension, tend not to trust organized religion.

    Atheism is primarily of an age of 25 & under. The age of rebelliousness & distrust of the elders. After 25, a gradual transition takes place. You become the elders. Even the grand popah of Atheism in the U.S. has opened the door to the possibility of a higher power. Is he now an

    agnostic theist?
    YOU invite this higher power to materialize before you. You totally misunderstand the intent. It is YOU that is being tested. You have been given Free Will. It is easier to do what is right when that higher power is standing over you or you have proof positive it exists. The question is can you do the right thing without solid evidence of a higher power.

    IF, that entity should appear before you, there is only one thing left to say. Oh crap, Because at that point, the test is over. What’s your GPA.

    • cashmemorz

      Yes, I often have felt there is something more than this existence. Now the holographic universe shows me what it is. The shell of the universe where all data about the universe is contained. It is information, smeared across the shell to be forever beyond our reach inasmuch as a photographers construct of a holographic film is forever beyond the reach of the image that is seen outside the film.

  • Robert Ellefson

    My upbringing in the Roman Catholic Church taught me many valuable lessons that I still hold dearly, and strive to practice daily, even though I now consider myself agnostic. The lessons that matter the most, involving compassion, love, and caring for those in need, are the ones that Rossi appears to be most notably ignoring. He is portraying his greed-driven approach to maximizing his own profits as necessary and unavoidable, even though it comes at the expense of the billions of people whose lives would be profoundly affected by the mere affirmed knowledge that this salvation is at hand, not to mention the effects of accelerated deployment of useful applications of this technology that could be saving many lives right now.

    To emphatically state that any form of sharing his technology for others to develop upon and deploy as quickly as possible for the benefit of all life on earth means giving away his technology for free to his competitors is nothing more than paranoid delusion, and blatantly false. There are many ways he could be allowing this technology to see the light of day right now, and to change the world for the better, while still earning healthy profits. Since he apparently cannot personally envision how this could occur without him being left in ruins, we are instead left with the consequences of his paranoia and greed, which is untold avoidable suffering and death worldwide.

    The notion that he cannot in good conscience release the technology until it has been thoroughly certified as safe is utter nonsense. I am a product design engineer, and I have a lot of experience with getting products validated and certified for consumer use. There are millions of people who could be accomplishing these validation tasks rapidly in parallel with him right now, instead of Rossi’s slow, paranoid-recluse solo efforts, and the outcome would be far, far more robust and safe than anything Rossi can hope to accomplish on his own. It is ego, paranoia, and allegience to the oligarchs that is causing the tragic delays we are witnessing in the delayed release of this technology, not some form of noble intent from a deeply pious soul.

    • TomR

      I have to disagree with a lot of what you say, Robert. If you had been through all the pain and suffering that Andrea Rossi has, at the hands of government people, I think you would not trust anyone else to bring the E-Cat to market either. The PTB in the USA are not that much different than the ones in Italy. I believe that Andrea has been given some kind of signal from Obama that he is not going to resist the coming changes. If the certification of the domestic E-Cats doesn’t come this winter, I might have to change my mind about Obama.

      • Omega Z

        TomR
        I do not believe it depends on Obama. There are other powers at play here.

        I believe it’s up to the Philanthropists & Business interests. All the green energies proposed to date indicate a reduction in the world standards of living for everyone. Including the well to do.

        Cheap energy can maintain & improve those standards for those in the developed world & bring the less developed to parity with the rest of the world.

        Note: I actually agree with many of the things TPTB want to achieve. It is the means they choose to get there that I disagree with.
        Their means is to slightly raise the bottom up while drastically lowering everyone else. A Leveling Down. Cheap energy changes the metrics. We can level everyone UP.

        Just keep in mind, it will still take a long time, but at least it will be in the right direction. Improving.

    • William D. Fleming

      I do not judge Rossi Ill. The human race has gotten along for a few hundred thousand years without ecats. A year or two more won’t matter that much. Besides that I can’t think of anyone more qualified to carry out the task. Mainline science won’t even look at ecats and governments screw up everything they touch.

      I say GO ROSSI!!!

      • Omega Z

        I agree, and beyond that, the quickest way to spread this technology is the market. It will be cheaper, better & faster then any other means.

  • Sandy

    If there is a supernatural entity that wants me to pray to him or her or it then that entity is hereby invited to materialize (with gold and silver sparkles; Star Trek style) in my presence and to ask for my allegiance. Until then, I am not going to subscribe to the existence of any supernatural entities. At this point, I have zero data which indicate that supernatural entities exist.

    • http://magicmusicandmore.com/ Barry

      Data can be arranged in a lot of different ways for or against, but it’s just headstuff. There are brief (and rare) experiences of transcendence that go beyond the mind and alter and help to define our perspective.

    • William D. Fleming

      Sassy ain’t you? 🙂

  • Omega Z

    “atheism” as “practiced” by most is a Religion. i.e., they don’t just not believe, they actively preach. Some have even opened up their own church. I call that a religion…

  • http://www.libertynewspost.com/ Liberty Newspost

    Did anyone of us have any say in our existence or about anything in creation? Everyone believes in something they cannot prove or necesarily see, thats faith. People who think they know everything are obfusco about faith and the thought of God.