Rossi: E-Cat X ‘A Real Revolution . . . Very, Very, Very Good’ (Update #2 — AR Hopes for Home Heat and Power Next Year)

UPDATE #2 (Aug. 18 2015) The question and answer from the Journal of Nuclear Physics below is the strongest indication yet of the kind of machine the E-Cat X is:

August 18th, 2015 at 1:54 PM
Dear Andrea Rossi:
Will be possible within one year to buy an E-Cat to heat a house and turn on the lights ?
All for you, you for all!

Andrea Rossi
August 18th, 2015 at 5:25 PM
I hope yes. The E-Cat X promises well. I hope future will come soon enough, while we work for it.
Warm Regards,

At this point I would not set a huge amount of hope on seeing E-Cat X reactors in the stores next year, since there are are probably all kinds of steps to complete to go from a prototype to a final product, but this response by Andrea Rossi gives a clear sign that the E-Cat X is designed to be a domestic power product that can provide heat and electricity for homes.


Early Sunday Morning, Andrea Rossi reports that he restarted a rebuilt Hot Cat (high temperature E-Cat reactor) that he is calling “ Curie”. The first iteration of this new design was started last week, and apparently performed quite well, but broke after 10 hours of operation. Ross seems quite excited about the new version of this design. This is what he writes today:

About the direct production, I have news related to the new Hot Cat, named “ Curie”. I am working with it, it is a real revolution. Is important. Works very strongly and I am very optimist. Now we must test its duration. The performance is very interesting. I want to be clear: it is soon to give data, it could have problems, but what I am seeing now is very, very, very good. It could be the leader for the very massive production. We will go directly from our tests to the market. If goes on what I am seeing now, in October will be tried the safety certification. I am like a coach of tennis that looks at a kid 4 years old playing and says: ” this is the future Federer”. Big , big hope. The result of an enormous R&D, working 16 hours per day.

I’m not exactly sure why Rossi is so excited about this version of the Hot Cat, and how it differs from previous versions, but there has to be something about its performance that has been very impressive. We might get some more details as testing continues. UPDATE: Some more information coming from Andrea Rossi on the Hot Cat improvements. I asked Rossi some questions, and got some answers:

Compared to previous Hot Cat versions, does it have:

1. Higher temperatures AR: Yes
2. Longer periods of self-sustain AR: Yes
3. Higher COP AR: Yes
4. Better power density AR: Yes
5. Something else AR: Yes

Paul Asked: “Did you change the reactant mix from the last run to optimize direct electric production?” AR: Yes

This is very interesting — especially the part about optimizing the mix for direct electricity production. Since Rossi is hoping to find a way to generate electricity directly in the domestic E-Cat without using steam turbines.

UPDATE: (Aug 10, 2015)

Some concerns have been raised here about the chance that a new breakthrough will put on hold the current testing and plans for commercialization of the low temperature E-Cat technology being used in the 1MW plant currently under test. I asked Rossi about this just this morning:

Would a significant technological breakthrough with the Hot Cat, like the one you have described (F9) mean that your low temperature technology you are using with the 1 MW plant would be obsolete?

Would your plans to commercialize with your low temperature E-Cats be put on hold or stopped if this Hot Cat breakthrough is confirmed?

Frank Acland:
Absolutely not: the low temperature E-Cats have a totally different kind of employment that with the Hot Cat should not be possible.
The new Hot Cat will affect the domestic and totaly different kinds of application, while they are not idoneous for industrial applications or centralized heat distribution, which is the market sector of the 1MW low temp E-Cat.
Warm Regards,

  • Bob Greenyer

    hahah – we’ll see when the ash results come back.

    Next experiment expected to start 24th. Particulars to be published very soon.

  • Omega Z


    There was a post on JONP a long while back by Rossi that actually mentioned Tungsten. I don’t recall the particulars. I think perhaps it was something to do with the Hot-cat reactor core. There was some discussion about a double wall on Cobraf 1 of which involved Tungsten as the outer wall. I could be wrong. As I said, it was quite sometime ago. Note this was the Hot-cat with the open hollow center. It could also have been about using elements other then Nickel for fuel.
    Anyway, Rossi deleted that post very shortly after it appeared.

    • bachcole

      Rossi deleted that post very shortly after it appeared.

      That is almost a certainty that it is true and important, too true for Rossi to allow the message to stay posted.

    • Obvious
      • Omega Z

        Thank you.
        I missed that one in my search, however it isn’t the one I had in mind.
        But still appreciated.

        • Obvious

          It is the only one I have, but I do remember him mentioning using a tungsten sleeve for a hot cat once.

  • Kendall Evans

    I would like to make a comment for the benefit of Stephen Taylor and other advocates of nuclear power using fission. He recommends fourth-generation fission reactors as an interim solution. Unless these 4th generation reactors produce virtually no long-term waste, they are a terrible solution. If we build lots of these, it will take off the pressure to develop clean energy, which seems to be progressing reasonably well. No one wants to store the long term waste, which lasts thousands of years. Far from being a “clean” energy source, nuclear is the dirtiest source of electricity available. Even without Chernobyl, 3-mile island, Fukushima, and the financial disaster at San Onofre, there is still the storage problem. No civilization on Earth has lasted as long at the radioactive problem would last.

    • wpj

      I will have to disagree on some of this.

      There is a lot of effort to clean up all the radioactive waste which comes from these reactors. Once you have recycled the Uranium and plutonium then there is a few percent of very “hot” material with a half life of 10,000 years+. However, if you separate out the lanthanides and actinides, you can then bombard with neutrons and the half life is reduced to about 30 years.

      This is not a cheap process (especially given the prices that the companies are paying for the required chemicals- albeit on a small lab scale presently) but they are being pro-active and doing the research BEFORE the new reactors are being built.

    • Stephen Taylor

      With the right choices modern fission reduces the wastestream by a factor of 10 and increases the fuel supply into the +thousand year time frame. The volume of total waste is football stadium size which should be manageable. The mortality rate associated with fission energy is much lower than other energy sources. Not an ideal solution but available and can be very big in short time if politics change.
      More interesting for some is aneutronic fusion on small platform such as Helion Energy and others. These sadly are not yet available. Perhaps battery technology and solar conversion efficiency can help but I don’t think the size can be enough to power China, India, and then Africa and all of the rapidly developing world. The need is so huge it is difficult to comprehend. Now we need no burning things to generate this energy.
      If our society can survive the many challenges of the next quarter century we may thrive.

  • Ted-X

    In my HUMBLE opinion, eCat-X is a tribute to my contributions, since I posted under the pen-name of Ted-X 🙂
    Maybe Rossi noticed MY postings, which are not commented by nearly anybody. To be short, the process is mediated by nickel carbonyls, creating nano-particles of nickel in the vapor/plasma phase, as the temperature oscillates up and down. The Ni-nanoparticles are known to provide the LENR-effect (Ted-X-effect? 🙂
    The change in the composition of the eCat-X is addition of lithium carbonate, to enhance the formation of the carbonyls. Rossi might have also used the transformer principle, which I suggested some time ago. Maybe my HUMBLE posting will now get noticed at this time.
    I hope that people here need some lighter postings as well.

  • Stephen Taylor

    The most discouraging news of the year has been the lack of even modest success to replicate Parkhomov. If only someone can make a reliable reactor of even 1+ COP then progress can be hoped for and worked toward. Until this is achieved we have nothing. How are you replicators coming along in your works? Please give us something, any news is like water for the parched desert traveler.

  • Fibber McGourlick

    The emotional excitement that Rossi displays with his announcements rings true to me.
    I believe these additional discoveries and advances are real and exciting—so much so that he can’t resist the impulse to pass it along. It must be fun for him to make these advances
    and announce them.

    I just wish he’d shorten the test time on his (conclusive) current 1 Megawatt test as
    the scientists did in their Swiss tests of his reactors. What is the point of continuing something like this for longer than six months when the breakthrough is already obvious?

    The credible revelation that there has been six months of excess heat production
    by Cold Fusion will turn the world on its head and provide Dr. Rossi with unlimited help and resources, not to mention and honors on a scale previously unseen.

    There’s simply no need to postpone by six months the knowledge that there’s a demonstrated,
    near-term prospect of cheap, clean energy in abundance for the world. The benefits of an earlier disclosure are many and varied—and huge. For example, coming six months sooner than would otherwise be the case, the exultant knowledge that through Cold Fusion cheap, clean water (from seawater) will soon come everywhere and that the empty deserts can bloom may forestall the growing religious war in the middle east–not to mention that most fossil fuel pollution will end six months earlier than would otherwise be the case and that the world will that much sooner enter an era of unlimited prosperity.

    • Paul Smith

      “August 3rd, 2015 at 7:21 AM

      Dear Dr. Rossi, I think that now it would be possible interrupt the test period of the plant. You have already collected a lot of data and already proved beyond any reasonable doubt that the Rossi effect is real. That is because the world needs you now….”

      “Andrea Rossi
      August 3rd, 2015 at 7:32 AM
      Italo R.:
      No, it is not possible to modify the terms of the test and still I must add that the results at the end of it can be either positive or negative.
      Warm Regards,

  • Bob

    ecat X —– “I want to believe!” from the “X files” tv show!
    I really hope this comes to fruition in the time frame he states, but I am quite perplexed.
    Rossi’s own words stated that in 2012 he was ready to mass produce in his “robotized” factory, thousands of home eCats for Home Depot. But then that date was missed because certification could not be gained.
    He then stated that domestic eCats would not be available until safety certification and the only way to do that was via the industrial road. Make industrial units that would provide a history of safety for the domestic units to be certified.
    Now it appears he is stating that he will go into mass production with home / domestic units before the release of 1mw industrial units? I am not sure what has changed.
    The majority of Rossi’s announcements usually come true, relating to tests etc. The results are normally quite different than what is often expected or perceived. A major partner, which many thought might be GE, Seimans, etc. turns out to be Industrial Heat. A company that was solely created for the eCat, with no history nor even employees. Hardly a major company, but not insignificant in itself. Touted certification did become reality, but it was only a certification stating that a piece of equipment did not produce harmful effects. It did not certify that it was even operational, much less over unity. Test results by independent, third party that would be published in a journal, while I believe the tests were significant, they were only put on Arvix, not a published journal. The first test was not really independent, while the second one was much more so. In any case, questions about these tests have been answered by none of the testers.
    So my point is, regarding some posts, Rossi has been very good about producing the goods. Even if some state that what he said and what he delivered is quite different. However regarding production dates, factories and customers, he has been batting zero. Only two units have been reported sold. One unconfirmed to the military (Navy?) and one to a secret customer, which almost certainly is Darden himself, yet still unconfirmed. In any case, we know really nothing about sales or customers. At one time 13 units were sold, but that seems to have not been correct.
    As others have posted, I am not holding my breath for a domestic unit of any type within the next 5 years. I had was excited in 2012, but I have learned my lesson. If I am wrong, I will be exuberant. If I am right, I will now not be disappointed because I thought as such. If Darden / IH makes any type of positive announcement within the next few months, my opinion could be dramatically changed. At present their silence is deafening!
    Good luck Dr. Rossi. God speed and I wish you the most success as it will surely be a boon to us all. However, while I really would like the flying car promised in the 1950’s, I am still waiting on that along with an eCat!

    • Albert D. Kallal

      I think many are miss reading Rossi here. He says “I hope so”.
      You should be aware of how such people tend to think about things.

      If we ask Rossi do you hope that the e-cat could be on
      sale next week, he would answer a resounding yes, I hope for.

      So the fact that one desires and “hopes” for such an
      event has VERY little meaning in terms of such an event being practical.

      So when someone says they “hope” they are much meaning
      they wish for, but including the word “hope” really amounts to that like
      everyone here, we wish, and we hope and we “want for” a consumer e-cat next

      Everyone here hopes for and wish for an e-cat next year
      (and so does Rossi). Honesty, I willing to bet WE ALL HOPE for a consumer e-cat
      next year! So yes, we do – so does Rossi.

      However such a statement from a practical point of view
      means very little. Besides, such home units would need a year or two of testing
      BEFORE going into production.

      I sure everyone is aware that if a design flaw or issue
      were to occur with such a consumer device (just like for the auto industry)
      then such a large re-call would not only damage the reputation of a company,
      but also often can bankrupt a company.

      In 2007 1 million Easy-Bake ovens were recalled due to
      children being burned (and one child requiring a partial amputation of a finger
      being badly burned). And that is a toy baking oven and not a home nuclear

      So anyone here with a “basic” functioning brain and an IQ
      over that of a 6 year old (and that includes Rossi) VERY WELL understands these
      basic types of issues. In fact Rossi likely has HUGE difficulty grasping why such
      issues are not obvious to a 6 year old let alone adults asking such questions! Rossi
      thus gives his reading public FAR more credit in terms of what he assumes 6
      year old child would know without question!

      And as I pointed out large outlays of capital are
      required for any kind of mass manufacturing. And toss in the issue of being a
      consumer product? Well then we have a VERY DIFFERENT ball game – safety issues
      are very important!

      However, to be fair and not be someone trying to throw
      cold water on the fun party here? One can reasonable admit that Rossi is “planning”
      and thinking and hoping to build mass produced LENR devices – and clearly Rossi
      wants this to occur ASAP. And clearly everyone (including Rossi) hopes for next year, but it not a practical view – only a hope based one.

      Albert D. Kallal
      Edmonton, Alberta Canada

      • Omega Z

        “I think many are miss reading Rossi here.”

        Agreed. It happens very often. People let their imagination carry them away.
        I agree with you full post.

  • Manuel Cruz

    Rossi went for industrial applications when it became clear he was not going to have home safety certifications approved for untested nuclear technology that we do not understand and science cannot explain.

  • Bob Greenyer

    You can light an average european house with 100-150Ws of LEDs these days – You can get a few solar panels and a battery to run them – not really a reason to hold back a Minimum Viable Product or even to get that excited about it, IMPO.

    Heating, cooking and cooling are the really demanding uses of power in a home.

    I’d like to see a LENR module that drops into AMPLE space inside a solid fuel AGA for instance – oven, cooking, heating and hot water.

    • ecatworld

      I like the idea of an LENR AGA.

      • Stephen

        Hmmm I wonder if it could do microwave and/or water purifying too. That would be some AGA.

        • Bob Greenyer

          Of course it could do water purifying, microwave, hmmm.

          • Omega Z

            Building an underground home can easily eliminate 75% of ones energy use. You merely need to condition the fresh air intake some of which can be accomplished with a simple exchanger with the exhaust air.. Light can even be piped in with tube lighting.(Not to be confused with skylight technology)

            The fresh air circulation can easily be done with a 10 watt fan/blower system.
            It’s My opinion that we need to work on both ends. Cheaper energy with reduced need using efficient products. LED Lights, Video screens, Refrigeration Etc,,,

            Just because you come up with cheap efficient plentiful energy is no excuse to waste it. The Previous generation already did that. As In- Coal & Gas is to cheap to justify insulation. Lets not repeat history. Learn from It…

  • Bob Greenyer

    1. When I was studying furnace elements on behalf of the MFMP, I noticed that one Japanese seller touts the USP of their SiC element as being its ability to be 5% more efficient than the best of the rest.

    2. In the Condensing boiler market – 5% efficiency gain is a big selling point.

    3. In the Solar Panel market 1% more than you competitors gives you a huge advantage.

    4. A car that does 2 more miles to the gallon, that can be a HUGE advantage

    There is such a thing as Minimum Viable Product – in the use and production of energy in long term installations – 5% or less in favour of the customer is a BIG win. And here is the crux of the “Long Term Test” a solar panel is often guaranteed for 20+ years, a domestic boiler now for 10 years. That makes it worthwhile having an understanding of the reliability to ensure the %age gain is realised – but this need for certainty of longevity depreciates as the efficiency gain of the device increases.

    When you are talking about a heating device that is at a COP of 6 – as long as it has no harmful emissions, or has emissions that can be easily nullified and therefore get safety certification, the need for waiting and waiting for COP to go to 7, 8, 10, 50, 100 becomes moot. 6 is more than good enough.

    4 weeks ago, when it was 37ºC here in Czech – the CO monitor sat next to my gas combi boiler in my house, which is 7 years old and not still under warrantee, suddenly started screeching out and reporting 40ppm. Within 3 days, a 3 minute shower would have it at 430ppm. Needless to say with two babies in the house, we opened all the windows and stopped using the boiler. CO and Gas are SERIOUS risks already in peoples homes all over the world that kill frequently and cause other sufferring.

    Two days later, a gas certified plumber came to visit, after 10 minutes looking at it and pulling it apart, he asked me to sign a document to say I was never to use it again. In addition, it turns out that our flue – which is about 60+ feet high, is lined with now illegal aluminium and we must replace that with Stainless Steel and get it approved BEFORE we can have a new boiler installed. Total cost northwards of $5000. We don’t have the money, and in a few months we’ll be in a the depths of the cold central European winter, famed for high demands on gas.

    Because the building I live in is 115 years old, I can ONLY use this chimney and site a new boiler in the current location, because the boiler needs fresh air – I have to have air coming into my hall for burning – this air is cold from outside.

    Right now a LENR boiler would

    – Not produce CO
    – Not have natural gas leak risks
    – Not require an expensive flue relining
    – Allow me to seal my hall and keep our Flat much warmer with lower heat generated by a boiler
    – Not require a gas certified installer
    – would not need $170 gas a month
    – would be significantly smaller than current boiler
    – would be significantly cheaper than what I am currently faced with

    If the heat module was swap – out, I would only need it to last 6 months this year – but would be happy to change it monthly for the advantages I have listed. Later, when the hardware is better, a new module could be swapped in and the control software patched.

    COP of 6 – no problem, even a COP of 3 – because, I cannot use a heat pump due to the historical nature of my apartment.

    If we can find the money, we may be forced to install a terrible, expensive and continuously dangerous old heating technology in our apartment and its associated infrastructure which will become redundant in its lifetime, and right now an understanding of Minimum Viable Product by key claimants in this field would be a real blessing.

    As a side note – if you do not have a CO monitor by your boiler, get one, if we had made it to this winter, the constant heating would have surely resulted in lethal doses of this pernicious gas and I would have lost my young family had it not been for this inexpensive device that sat there and did nothing for 7 years previously.

    • Omega Z

      “2 more miles to the gallon”
      Huge when you consider 1 Billion+ vehicles in use.

  • oceans

    Great News and in that Rossi is in the late stages of his research and the one year test we can expect to see Home eCats in the first part of 2016, you do not have people like Darden sitting on the sidelines waiting for others to lead the way, they are very active preparing for the introduction of eCats to the World.

  • Gerrit

    I am very confident that we will not be able to buy ecats for home use within the next year.

    I may change my mind if I see results of the 1MW plant early 2016.

  • PappyYokum


  • Stephen Taylor

    Seriously, given the enormity facing us we might want to focus on reality here. Fourth generation fission is the best availab!le and a damn good interim solution. Let’s just consider the possibility that Rossi and Mills may be wrong and think where do we go?

    • Observer

      What’s your time frame for your “interim” solution. It takes years just to get past the regulatory hurdles for building a fission plant.

      Before you break ground, the e-cat will be available at Home Depot. (providing F9>0)

      • Stephen Taylor

        The interim solution for best available fission technology gets us through the next thousand year time frame. It is available now but for political opposition. We need to get real. Surely one hopes for Rossi or Mills or small aneutronic fusion but we need to focus on engineering something real. Changing course for the better is easy. We need a real answer right now!

        • Manuel Cruz

          The problem is that the political opposition comes from the political faction that through corruption, terrorism, military actions and coup d’états has created a perfect cartel on oil production, to be precise. They will oppose and demonize with virulence not just nuclear fission, but any energy technology that could seriously compete with their monopoly.

    • Gerard McEk

      Stephen, if you refer to the thorium reactor or the travelling wave reactor, than you may may be right, but if AR can proove that it works (and that will be within a year) than I think those fission reactors do not make any chance, because for those reactors it takes at least 10 years (but probably 20) to get them designed and certified. If Andrea proves his 1MW plant or hot cat does what he is telling us now, than oil-, gas-, fission-, hot fusion-, solar-, wind and wave energy plants will be relics in 50 years.

      • Stephen Taylor

        Gerard, you are right and we have watched and hoped for this to work now five years. Maybe it will work some day or not. If we put one in a room and we put a simple electric heater of same input power in a similar room which room will be warmer. How easy it is to prove but instead we wait and hang on every word of Rossi. We have not time left for so much waiting. Really big clean power must come on line if we are to leave coal in the ground. I support nuclear because now there is nothing better that is big enough to save the day.

        • Gerard McEk

          At least there may be a future backup fission energy supply, so our childern and grandchilderen will not be left without energy in a world fighting for the last bit of oil, and that is good!

  • Stephen Taylor

    Well, this is all fine, but how much trouble would it be to just hook one up to a water circulator and measure the input and output with mass balance? Be done with speculation and fantasy! Prove it! It would be so easy if it were true!

    • Observer

      The E-Cat X produces electricity (directly). He has made the relevant measurements, and has rebuilt the unit (multiple times) when components fail. Rossi is not living in a world of speculation and fantasy, YOU are. The E-Cat X has to prove something to Rossi. Rossi does not have to prove ANYTHING to you. Rossi’s end game is a viable product, not acceptance from the peanut gallery (US).

      • Stephen Taylor


      • Jarea1

        Really, do you really think that he only has the ecat for himself?.he has a lot of things to prove. Besides,that is good because he has the first LENR product. The thing is that he already said that the market next year will proove he is right. So step by step and patience

      • I have not read that E-cat X was producing electricity “directly”.
        as I understand it is more like a CHP.
        Rossi just works scientifically on direct conversion, but it seems mostly based on tiny observes anomalies…

        Maybe one day EM field harnessing, betavoltaic, will allow direct conversion..
        Today as he says “Carnot Cycle” seems the best way.

        note that as I read him, “Carnot Cycle” is any thermodynamic cycle, like Carnot (Stirling), Brayton, rankine… as exploit turbines and piston engines, but also TEG and thermoacoustic engines.

    • bachcole

      I see that you have a need to have it proven. However, Rossi doesn’t even know you and doesn’t care what your needs are.

      I would imagine that Rossi may be thinking along the lines that I am: Let’s make a revolution in thought and spring this baby on the academic elites fully matured, like Venus was born.

  • Patrick Ellul

    Dear Andrea,

    Regarding the “something else” that you mention that E-CatX has over the other cats:

    Does it make it easier 1) to manufacture? 2) to certify? 3) to protect its IP?

    Is that why it makes you more optimistic about the timeline for it going on shelves? F9 of course.

    Patrick Ellul:
    I would say all the three. F9 of course.
    Warm Regards,

  • Stephen

    Thanks Bachcole.

    I think there are a lot of concepts considered in LENR that are new to a lot of us even if we know some Physics, LENR touches on so many aspects I suspect very few have a grasp of everything. It amazes me how just as I feel I understand something in LENR something new comes up that gives an entirely new perspective. Its a real puzzle trying to find the right combination of pieces in a system of diverse ideas that makes it work but it makes it fascinating to follow too. Taking a step back and looking from your perspective is very wise too.

    Muon catalysed fusion is new too me too its an amazing phenomena I think and could well have a part to play in LENR.

    Jones Beene just started an interesting thread on the Vortex-l mail archive that touches on the subject too. I found it fascinating:

    https:[email protected]/msg104168.html

    I wonder if there is a good source for the muons?
    I wonder if their lifetime can be extended and if they can be ejected instead of gamma as Jones Beene suggests.

    According to the wikipedia link muons eventually get “stuck” to Alpha particles. I wonder if they eventually decay to electrons once they are stuck or if there is a way to prevent the sticking so they can sustain more fusion reactions?

    I’m looking forward to see how this idea develops

  • GreenWin

    Gosh Bob, you’re asking lots of questions. Granted it can be frustrating for those who want answers on their timeline. You might try posing these questions to Rossi yourself. See what response you get, and report back here.

  • psi2u2

    Thank you, clovis, for clarifying that. I would add that the off-color, highly emotional language of “mumbo jumbo-tango” (complete with its compounded appeals to cultural prejudice of one kind or another), phrased in such a rhetorical question, either indicates a newbie or someone with an axe to grind – I don’t profess to know which.

    • Uncle Bob

      The reference to “mumbo jumbo-tango” is a direct quote from what Mr. Rossi used in his blog when he said he wasn’t going to bother with all the “mumbo jumbo-tango” involved with a demonstration of the new Curried-cat. He said he would be going straight to production.

      I would be really impressed with this but it has strong echos of the original and very similar proclamations in 2011, along the lines of having products ready for market.
      “We are not making idle chatterings. We are making products”.

      • psi2u2

        It sounds more credible from him . He is working. He has no obligation to tell anyone anything.

  • Patrick Ellul

    From know on it shall be referred to as “E-Cat X”, says Rossi.

  • The update answer doesn’t sound like Rossi. Perhaps some PR person is polishing the answer.