Rossi: E-Cat Can Operate Beyond Melting Point of Nickel (Update #2 More on Intrinsic Safety)

UPDATE #2 (Aug 17, 2015) There has been some more comments on the Journal of Nuclear Physics by Andrea Rossi on the ‘melting point’ issue. Someone asked Rossi if the E-Cat X was able to operate above the melting point of Nickel, and Rossi affirmed that it was able to.

Later, he commented further saying, “The E-Cat is still intrinsecally safe due to the melting point of the charge, even if it is higher than the melting point of nickel.” I followed up with a couple of questions of my own.

1. Are you saying that it is not possible for your reactors to operate after the melting point of the charge is reached?
2. Has the charge changed due to your R&D process?

Andrea Rossi
August 17th, 2015 at 8:23 AM
Frank Acland:
1- yes
2- confidential
Warm Regards,
A.R.

This response implies that it is not possible for the E-Cat to operate in a molten state.

UPDATE #1 (July 29, 2015): I asked Rossi on the JONP about what he had said in the past regarding the E-Cat being intrinsically safe after melting point of nickel had been reached: “If the melting point of nickel can now be passed, is the intrinsic safety feature no longer valid?”

Rossi responded:

Andrea Rossi
July 29th, 2015 at 12:47 PM
Frank Acland:
I am very sorry, but to answer to this question I’d have to give confidential information. The principle of the intrinsic safety is still valid, though.
Warm Regards,
A.R.

We’ve been hearing from Andrea Rossi about how his latest version of the Hot Cat was recently able to run at 1380°C for ten hours — and this is quite close to the melting point of nickel — which is 1455°C. It has been stated by Rossi in the past that the E-Cat stops when the nickel powder melts, but today there’s quite a surprise in a comment from him when asked whether the E-Cat could “under special conditions, this temperature can be overcome (still working well), without destructive hot spots.”

Here’s the reply:

Andrea Rossi
July 29th, 2015 at 7:23 AM
Italo R.:
We can overcome that limit, for reasons I am not allowed to explain.
Warm Regards,
A.R.

So that’s a bit of a revelation. One thing that comes to mind is that Rossi has said that the E-Cat is ‘intrinsically safe’ since the reaction stops when the nickel powder reaches melting point — but from what Rossi now says, that would not be the case.

It’s been years since the original E-Cat was developed, and it would not be too surprising to me if during all the R&D, new discoveries about the E-Cat process, and new methods of exploiting the “Rossi Effect” had been achieved. But this news seems to take away some of the limits of the E-Cat, and it makes me wonder what this could mean for the future of this technology. 1380°C is certainly hot enough to generate supercritical steam — so important for electricity generation — but what could one do with even higher temperatures, and what’s the limit now?

  • Axil Axil

    lamp

  • Axil Axil

    New update

    Andrea Rossi
    August 18th, 2015 at 5:43 PM

    Curiosone:
    Update at 07.40 p.m. of Tuesday August 18.
    E-Cat 1 MW: downloaded to 750 kW of power for reparation of a reactor. Another working night looms up.
    E-Cat X: burnt, but we have understood well where is the problem, so we are making another one that very likely will be very reliable. I hope.
    From inside the plant,
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.

    Rossi might have found the method to control the E-Cat meltdown mechanism, The X-Cat might have destroyed the alumina tube by overheating. How hot can the X-Cat get?

    Rossi might want to try Yttria-stabilized zirconia (YSZ) (Melting point 2,715 °C (4,919 °F; 2,988 K))

    . This compound is a ceramic in which the crystal structure of zirconium dioxide is made stable at room temperature by an addition of yttrium oxide. These oxides are commonly called “zirconia” (ZrO2) and “yttria” (Y2O3), hence the name.

    It is difficult to solve the heater material problem because most heater elements will oxidize at high temperatures. This is not true for YSZ. Rossi could heat the YSZ tube directly.

    Electroceramics is a class of ceramic materials used primarily for their electrical properties. YSZ is an Electroceramic; it conducts electricity well as an fast ion conductor ceramic that has been used in historically for the glowing rods in Nernst lamps.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e7/Nernst-lamp2.jpg/500px-Nernst-lamp2.jpg

    The Nernst lamp was an early form of incandescent lamp. Nernst lamps did not use a glowing tungsten filament. Instead, they used a ceramic rod that was heated to incandescence. Because the rod (unlike tungsten wire) would not further oxidize when exposed to air, there was no need to enclose it within a vacuum or noble gas environment; the burners in Nernst lamps could operate exposed to the air and were only enclosed in glass to isolate the hot incandescent emitter from its environment. A ceramic of zirconium oxide – yttrium oxide was used as the glowing rod.

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/80/Nernst_lamp.jpg

  • Axil Axil

    Over on the Rossi blog site, there has recently been a ton of questions asking Rossi what the E-Cat-X is all about. Rossi is silent on that issue. He is very protective about his new collections of IP secrets. And yet, he gave the Lugano crew the Hot cat to play with for a month. To completely give the Lugano testers all his treasured and hard won IP secrets is completely out of charactor. Rossi must have thought that the Hot Cat was a dead end. Try as he might, Rossi could not get the Hot cat to work, and he gave up on it. He never intended to give anybody the opportunity and the Know-how to replicate any of his work. Does a leopard change its spots? But when Rossi read the Lugano report, he saw something he liked very much, it was something he did not see in all his own extensive Hot cat experiments. He was very surprised, and he took advantage of this very good luck as he has always done. Those new insights that he gleaned from the Lugano report gave him inspiration to invent the E-Cat-X. The tantalizing question that we are faced with: what insight did Rossi get from the Lugano report.

    Maybe Rossi gave up on the Hot Cat because, try as he might, he could not get the Hot Cat to work well, So he intended to throw his competitors a curve by showing them a failed test. He used an old fuel load from one of his failed Hot cat tests knowing full well that the Hot Cat would not work to any great extent. But to his surprise, the Lugano crew got the reactor to work anyway beyond all his wildest expectations.

    The previously used fuel loaded in the Lugano test showed no build up of Ni62, just run of the mill nickel isotopes, but the Lugano rum changed the nickel powder into pure Ni62. We know that Rossi was very surprised by this strange turn of events. Rossi must have thought to himself, what could have caused that miracle? How come I could not do this thing and those Lugano testers could?

    Because they did not want to melt the hot cat down, the Lugano crew let the Hot cat heat for 10 days before they decided to up the temperature. In those first 10 days the Hot cat was a poor performer. Rossi never had the patience to run the Hot cat for so long, he did not have the patience to run such a non productive test for that long. But after those 10 days of gestation, the Lagano crew increased the power and the heat and the Rossi reaction took off.

    The power produced by the reactor showed a COP of 7 when the power was increased. Something must have been building up over those 10 days of moderate heat. LENR has always had a history of running for a long time before the reaction sets in. The Palladium guys thought ot was caused by loading hydrogen into palladium, but that was not the case.

    Nano-particles were being created slowly until their numbers reached a critical threshold for the reactor to take off. Without those large 100 micron nickel particles, the nano particle aggregation must be grown large enough to get the power of the reaction over a critical level

    Rossi said to himself, I can just add some of my potassium catalyst to the lithium aluminum hydride to get the nano particles to form faster. 10 days is far to long to wait to stat up the Hot cat. Then I could turn on the lithium powder very fast, and I do not need the nickel anymore.

  • http://renewable.50webs.com/ Christopher Calder

    Hank Mills – August 17th, 2015 at 10:23 PM

    For the record, if Nickel is not used in the E-Cat X, my guess is that the charge consists of lithium hydroxide and Tungsten powder. Tungsten has a greater electrical conductivity than nickel and a much higher melting point. This could allow for arcing between lithium covered particles to take place more easily. The arcing due to the electric field Iinduced by the squarewaves could ignite the lithium hydrogen plasma and induce fusion. The alpha particles produced could keep the plasma ionized and keep the reaction self sustaining. The removal of aluminum would allow for more nuclear reactions and hence more alpha particles. I think the aluminum is useless except as a getter for oxygen and other atmospheric gases.

    _______________
    Interesting stuff, Hank.

  • GordonDocherty

    Maybe he is no longer using Nickel…?

  • Observer

    Three major events occur when the temperature continuously rises:

    > Particles of metal melt and combine into a single slug, greatly reducing surface area.
    > Metal is no longer in a crystal lattice.
    > Reaction containment chamber eventually fails.

    We do not know how the first 2 effect the reaction.
    The third definitely is a show stopper.

  • julian becker

    i dont know if this question has been raised, but could this extreme temperature beyond the melting point of nickel be related to the effect fleischman & pons observed in their laboratory when the charge burned a hole in the table and the floor? so something they referred to as “beyond cold fusion”? meaning creation of strangelets or singularities. i remember to have read about this before. i mentioned it to rossi years ago, but he said their theory is different….

  • US_Citizen71

    Maybe the new reactors simply operate at extreme pressure.

    Graph of nickel melting point vs pressure.

    http://journals.aps.org/prl/article/10.1103/PhysRevLett.95.167801/figures/3/medium

  • Axil Axil

    In May 2008 Japanese researcher Yoshiaki Arata (Osaka University) demonstrated an experiment that produced heat when deuterium gas was introduced into a cell containing a mixture of palladium and zirconium oxide. In an August 2009 peer reviewed paper Akira Kitamura (Kobe University) et al. reported about replication of this experiment. Replication of earlier work by Arata had been claimed by McKubre at SRI.

    Miley’s device, does not require an external heat source, relying on the chemical reactions within it to produce the heat energy needed to run the unit. The fuel is ZrO2 (zirconium dioxide) and deuterium pressurized to 413 kilo pascals (60 psi).

    Why do these compounds work as a LENR catalysts?

    http://www.pnnl.gov/science/highlights/highlight.asp?id=803

    Superatoms are clusters of atoms that mimic elements through isoelectric configurations of their valence electrons.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Superatom

    Element replacements

    Titanium monoxide (TiO) => nickel

    Zirconium oxide (ZrO) => palladium

    Tungsten carbide(WC) => Platinum

    • Warthog

      “The fuel is ZrO2 (zirconium dioxide) and deuterium pressurized to 413 kilo pascals (60 psi).”

      I don’t think so. The ZrO2 (zirconia) in Miley’s “fuel” is simply an inert ceramic support for the palladium reactive substrate. The “fuel” is deuterium, and the “ash” is He4.

      But you are missing the most likely candidate…….Al2O3 (aluminum oxide or alumina)….if you recall, Rossi’s hydrogen source is LiAlH3 (lithium ALUMINUM hydride). If there is any oxygen around at all, the aluminum will strongly bind with it to form alumina….thus acting as a gettering agent for oxygen while simultaneously releasing hydrogen and lithium. And perhaps also providing a thermally inert lattice that stabilizes the nickel reactive substrate in a manner similar to zirconia for Miley.

  • Andrew

    I wonder…. Could Rossi simply be using a modified form of Raney nickel? Powdered, extremely high surface area, porous and thermally stable.

  • Axil Axil

    http://www.pnnl.gov/science/highlights/highlight.asp?id=803

    An Alchemist’s Dream: Superatoms Mimic Elements

    Titanium oxide (Melting point1,750 °C (3,180 °F; 2,020 K))

    is a high temperature subsitute for nickel.

    http://www.novarials.com/images/NovaTubeTiO01SEM.jpg

    http://www.pnl.gov/science/images/highlights/cmsd/superatoms.jpg

  • Paul

    The melting point of the charge depends on the powder mix. The fact that it is higher than nickel melting point gives some information about one of the powders added.

    • http://www.lenrnews.eu/lenr-summary-for-policy-makers/ AlainCo

      +1
      that is my bet.

    • Sanjeev

      Its a big clue.
      Also settles the debate about why we see temperatures around the melting point of Ni in Lugano report, while it still worked.

  • Gerard McEk

    I guess we must make a difference between the charge and the nickel. If AR uses a metal with a higher meltingpoint than nickel e.g. Tungsten and that metal is also able to support LENR (maybe at elevated temperatures) then the LENR process may still continue. Nickel may be used for lower temperatures and to reach higher temperatures tungsten jumps in. Maybe the reactor tube is made of tungsten now. To restart, maybe nickel powder is required. If tungsten would melt, the process would stop (if would melt to nearly everything though).

  • Stephen

    I wonder if the “Charge” which does not melt is the nickel (or its equivalent) or some other component or material state that exists in solid or crystal form at these high temperatures. I suppose the former is the most likely.

  • Redford

    “So that’s a bit of a revelation. One thing that comes to mind is that
    Rossi has said that the E-Cat is ‘intrinsically safe’ since the reaction
    stops when the nickel powder reaches melting point — but from what
    Rossi now says, that would not be the case.

    Are we sure he’s saying that ? From my laymen POV he could mean that for some reason nickel doesn’t melt in hot cat at the usual temperature, hence that they can overcome that limit. Is that conceivable ?

    • Axil Axil

      No, nickel will always melt at a definite temperature in all cases, forever. Rossi also uses the same commercial cataleptic COTS product. This has not changed. He does not use a different type of powder. This is my opinion.

      • Eyedoc

        so then LENR is occurring even with the nickel melted ??? How can that jibe with the theories (ie lattice etc) and safety claim ?
        Sorry , now I see your comment below 😉

      • Warthog

        PURE nickel always melts at a definite temperature. Addition of “other things” changes the melting point. To what extent the melting point changes is one (rough) method of determining purity. And Rossi has NEVER used pure nickel…once the E-Cat has gone through even one cycle of elevated temperature, whatever the original concentration of nickel present started out as is no longer so.

        • http://www.lenrnews.eu/lenr-summary-for-policy-makers/ AlainCo

          what about iron?

          I found that
          http://www.calphad.com/iron-nickel.html

          • Warthog

            Well, this is pretty much my point. There are probably hundreds of nickel alloys with various things possible. The absolute melting point of nickel is pretty much irrelevant, except as an arbitrary reference point, as we have zero “real” knowledge of what comprises the NAE in Rossi’s system(s).

            I would say that the sole real datum that we have is that “whatever” he is using is NOT pure nickel at any time other than prior to initial heatup.

            • Obvious

              Good points. I suspect the heater coil is the nickel-bearing weak link in the temperature chain.

      • Job001

        Nickel oxide melts 1955C while nickel nanoparticles melt at lower temperature than bulk nickel. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melting-point_depression
        See the nanoparticle section.

        • Sanjeev

          In Lugano report, the particle sizes of fuel are of the order of um.
          That should not change the melting point of Ni itself. Something else must be added to raise the melting point. The report has some info.
          Anyway, good info about relation of nano size and melting point, should be useful for those who are using nano powders.

  • Axil Axil

    Let us consider the question of intrinsic safely.

    If the “mouse” controls the E-Cat, and if the mouse is still subject to failure due to nickel melting if it exceeds 1450C, then control is never lost do to overheating.

    If the “Cat” is setup to exceed the 1450C nickel melt limit since it does not depend on nickel powder to produce the LENR reaction when stimulated by the “mouse”, then the new Hot cat design can exceed the meltdown temperature and still be intrinsically safe with no danger of the loss of control due to overheating.

    In summary, the Cat could be using lithium only to produce the LENR reaction whereas the “mouse” still uses nickel to produce the LENR reaction.

    MAYBE – Rossi has found that the Hot cat does not need nickel to maintain the LENR reaction. This might have been the surprise that he received from his latest research.

    • Obvious

      Then his patent (application) is toast.

      • Eyedoc

        Seems true, he would have to amend

      • http://www.facebook.com/ian.walker.7140 Ian Walker

        Hi all

        In reply to Obvious’s point they have probably already amended the patent application or added another (even better). I am almost certain IH and Leonardo Corp have tens if not hundreds of Patents. The whole thing about patents and the coming patent wars is ammunition. The more patents you have, then the more ammunition your lawyers have. Ideally they should be overlapping, some will be tiered so that as the first patent begins to go out of date the next begins to apply.

        Kind Regards walker

  • Ted-X

    LENR operation with melted nickel strongly indicates that the reactions are taking place in the vapor phase, perhaps on the surface of “mixed-Ni-Li” Rydberg clusters or some other form of nano-particles. The carbonyl theory of the formation of nano-particles (via nickel carbonyls and the up-and-down cycling of the temperature) is becoming stronger with this molten-Ni-LENR process. This indicates that carbon and oxygen might be playing a very significant role of catalysts in the LENR effect. Lithium or potassium might also be essential. Lithium carbonate could be an easy to try catalyst (mixed with LiAlH4) – particularly for the high temperature LENR process.
    ——————————————————————————-
    The welding-transformer concept (even at 60 Hz) could easily bring the temperatures of a “closed-loop” reactor to the temperatures above the melting point of nickel without high-temperature-resistant heating wires. (This part is “pro publico bono”, for experimenters).

  • peter gluck

    Actually- if this means “the heat release reactions” can take place
    with molten metal- than this is a fundamental issue- change of vision.
    Two classes of flawed theories “reactions in the lattice” and
    “reactions in nano-cracks” will be drowned in the moltedn metal.
    And it will be a confirmation of reactions taking place on the very surface, by surface dynamics via nano-plasmonics -, nano-vortices as i think.
    I hope Rosssi will say in a way not hurting his IP what this revelation really say about molten Ni.
    Peter

    • Gerard McEk

      You are right Peter, if the total fuel mass is molten. No lattices anymore it seems. However if the fuel mix still has some not molten ingredients where the LENR reaction takes place, than the W-L and the Storms theories may still hold. Intriguing!
      AR can still control it, it seems, so he must have other means than temperature control.

      • Bob Greenyer

        It does not invalidate Piantelli theory. Especially since the critical H- is carried in ionic LiH solution.

        If it is intrinsically safe – then it must be that an external stimulation is needed – some sort of EM, like Magnetic or RF signal, is needed for the triggering in addition to heat.

        1. If there is a core breach due to over temp, it cools > Fails safe.
        2. If the trigger fails > fails safe after end of SSM or because of 1.

        • Axil Axil

          The electron(s) associated with the H- cannot enter the nucleus unless their energy is greater that 20 MeV due to the uncertainty principle. An electron in a H- orbital cannot be that energetic since it would shed that energy through the production of an x-ray photon as the H- seeks a state of minimum energy. Such an energetic electron is relativistic and free. Erg, the H- theory is wrong.

          • Bob Greenyer

            According to Piantelli, the electrons don’t (moreover, they aren’t quite what they were), the protons do or don’t – one leads to transmutation of the Nickel – or more specifically “nucleus reorganisation” the other leads to ejected protons.

          • Job001

            Within a nickel or palladium lattice the compressed atom radius is lower, thus Bertozzi numbers are not correct for lattice conditions. 20 MeV would be for uncompressed hydrogen atoms only.

      • peter gluck

        Dear Gerard,
        Fe – also a transition metal melting at 1538 C is a possibility if you are right but now too many data are missing. My personal bet is on reactions
        taking place in molten Ni more precisely on its surface.
        This goes well with my agenda of radically re-thinking LENR see Ego Out..
        Greetings,
        Peter

        • Gerard McEk

          Dear Peter,
          I agree that a re-thinking of the LENR theories should be done if Andrea Rossi proves that stable LENR temperatures can be achieved in excess of the nickel melting temperature. Your thought about Iron is should surely be considered. Can nickel atoms, become part of a surface polariton and entangle with photons like the lithium atoms and the protons of the hydrogen. Can it be a three stage rocket? Was the ‘mouse’ the lithium until now and can it be lithium and the nickel in the future?
          I further believe that we must seriously consider pre-loading of the nickel. It seems quite effective as the latest test of Songcheng Jiang and maybe also the latest Russian replication proves.
          Kind regards,
          Gerard

  • Independent Experimenter

    What I want to know is if the E-Cat can operate as a plasma, i.e. high power electrical discharge through the fuel. I understand this would make an impractical reactor but it would make a compelling demonstration, removing all doubt.

    • Axil Axil

      I believe this idea is a good one. The issue with the idea is control. The control of the spark is not going to be easy.

    • Warthog

      See other LENR researchers working in “glow discharge” regimes. Lots of work has been done on such systems. I haven’t followed it all that much, but there is information.

  • tobalt

    just a quick thought: both the Ni-Al phase diagram and the Ni-Cr phase diagram (and many other binary nickel alloys) contain compounds which are solid at temperatures greatly exceeding the melting point of pure Nickel.

    He didnt tell, they can surpass the melting point, just that they can surpass “that temperature”. Maybe send another question to clarify this.

  • Robert Ellefson

    As long as Dr. Andrea Rossi is happy and making good progress towards his Ultimate Success, then the rest of the world can just go and pound rocks. Who cares how long it takes for him to reveal the secrets of his history-changing discoveries? In the end, little matters other than Rossi succeeding in his personal business ambitions. That will make a perfect ending to this amazing story, which all started with a little boy who ran extra-long marathons, bless his heart. I hope that his statue is the biggest in all of the world, even bigger than the glorious statues that Joseph Stalin and Saddam Hussein commissioned for themselves.

    • LilyLover

      Rossi is not that kind of a person; but yet if wanted to accuse him of ego, you could have said – statue bigger than mount Rushmore. 🙂

      This is merely the repeat hereafter… Our good doctor is smart enough to reveal such a “safety” concern only
      after he has developed demonstrably more effective non-passive and
      passive control system to tame the Hot Cat.
      I.e. most likely the new
      knowledge that allows him to stretch the limits must allow him to wield
      greater control over the operational safety.
      Since “Safety” is the
      reason to curb the Cats in Patent offices or UL certifications, by
      exhibiting this vulnerability he is making their case for them – just to
      defeat their hypothesis by demonstrating safety characteristics when
      legally required thus securing the UL certification.
      Some will argue
      that Rossi is now attempting to move to the exclusively “sell
      electricity” model, based on this revelation; but I contend that this
      will only accelerate the Hom-E-Cats producing direct electricity and
      mini-Cats for Cars.
      Congratulations to Rossi and ourselves!!

      • Agaricus

        Electricity and heat. I’m reasonably certain that IH never had any other plans.

        Domestic heat, steam ships and ground vehicles etc. will probably depend on how long it takes for 3rd parties in the BRICS countries to replicate the technology.

  • Axil Axil

    The Hot cat is the reactor type that this over temperature process applies to. It does not apply to the “Mouse” because the mouse is maintained at low power with a COP just above 1. The “Cat” must be the reactor component that produces the LENR reaction in the vapor stage. We know that the Rossi reactor can function at temperatures of over 2000C when it is in meltdown. Rossi has said that the Cat will meltdown if the “Mouse” drives it too hard. Inductral Heat might have found a way to get the “Cat” into the vapor stage where nano particles carry the reaction forward while keeping the “Mouse” just below meltdown temperatures. . For the Hot cat, those nano particles are lithium. IH has found a way to carry the LENR reaction in the “Cat” just by using the lithium nano particles that condense out of the plasma produced at high temperatures beyond 1450C.

    But once this over temperature state is achieved in the “Cat”, can the temperature of the “Cat” drop under 1450C, and then be reactivated by the “Mouse” to regain that high temperature level again? Or are we just dealing with a sustained meltdown condition of the “Cat”. that can last for some extended period beyond 10 seconds?

  • Billy Jackson

    this is a lot like being given a candy bar and finding out that all you got was the wrapper 🙂 I want more info!!!!!! 😛

    • blanco69

      Agreed. This will have the theorists cocerned. How do you begin to sort out a potential nuclear theory in a chaotic molten environment. I’ll be even more flabbergasted if Rossi pulls this out of of his Wizard hat. I’m reserving any gasting of flabber until the day Rossi proves his original claims. A molten nuclear ecat sounds like a gast too far.

  • GregL

    I suspect that the main energy transfer is by gamma rays, which are then absorbed by the outer ceramic material to make it hot. Quite feasible that the nickel nano stuff, generating the gammas, could therefore be substantially cooler than the heat sink.

    • Obvious

      A supraradiant event (not superadiant) may exchange all of the kinetic thermal energy of a particle to fill a gap in a collective radiant emission energy level, leaving such a particle at near absolute zero. This would prevent the fuel overall from overheating, and may explain why adding heat is required to keep the reaction going. It also keeps particles from melting, explaining that mystery. Additionally it means that it would be true that the reaction would stop if the nickel melts, although in a proper reaction system this would probably never come close to actually happening except for mechanical reasons.

  • US_Citizen71

    Higher temperatures would be ideal for rocketry and aviation. The hotter the exhaust gases are the higher the pressure, resulting in higher thrust.

  • Herb Gillis

    He must be using a refractory support of some kind. A higher melting particulate material onto which the molten Ni and Li adsorb, probably at the surface only.

    • Mytakeis

      Maybe a non-physical refractory support, if such was coincidentally stumbled upon?

  • Rasper Helpdesk

    Sounds like it is operating at above 1 atmosphere of pressure. Increasing the pressure on a substance raises the melting point since it creates more resistance to the expanding that takes place during the transition from solid to liquid. It would also make for a fairly easy “kill” switch as opening a pressure valve would allow for the melting point to return to normal, causing it to melt immediately and stop the reaction.

  • Gerard McEk

    That is a revelation indeed! However, now I think about it: Also lithium reacts while in liquid or in gas state, so why not nickel?
    You are right Frank, the intrinsic safety statement is now undermined, which has huge safety implications in case LENR has a positive temperature response (higher temp -> more energy), which I think it has. Frightening …..

    • LilyLover

      Our good doctor is smart enough to reveal such a “safety” concern only after he has developed demonstrably more effective non-passive and passive control system to tame the Hot Cat.
      I.e. most likely the new knowledge that allows him to stretch the limits must allow him to wield greater control over the operational safety.
      Since “Safety” is the reason to curb the Cats in Patent offices or UL certifications, by exhibiting this vulnerability he is making their case for them – just to defeat their hypothesis by demonstrating safety characteristics when legally required thus securing the UL certification.
      Some will argue that Rossi is now attempting to move to the exclusively “sell electricity” model, based on this revelation; but I contend that this will only accelerate the Hom-E-Cats producing direct electricity and mini-Cats for Cars.
      Congratulations to Rossi and ourselves!!

    • Warthog

      Not necessarily. “Operating above the melting point of nickel” does NOT mean that the support melts at that temperature. Nobody knows what the exact metallurgical state of the support is….it may well allow the reaching of temperature(s) above the melting point of pure nickel.

      And there are almost certainly other metals (and alloys) that will exhibit the “Rossi Effect”. If I were IH/Rossi, I would be doing a LOT of screening experiments of other substrates.

      My own hope is that tungsten will show the effect…………..