1MW Plant and Hot Cat Continue Stable and Self-Sustaining: Rossi [Update: July 9, New data point]

A pattern of questioning has emerged on the Journal of Nuclear Physics which is perhaps the most accurate way for us to presently gauge how work is going on the ongoing E-Cat tests taking place in the shipping containers where Andrea Rossi is currently working. A reader will typically ask what is the status of the E-Cat test at the very moment the question is asked — and Andrea Rossi does not seem to mind giving the latest update.

Here are the most recent three entries from Rossi when asked this question:

Jun 25, 2015:

In this moment it is 07.40 p.m. of Thursday, June 25.
The MW E-Cat is in ssm and stable.
The Hot Cat is in ssm too, stable.
Fingers crossed. F9.

July 2, 2015

11.45 a.m. of July 2nd: situation substantially stable, in this moment we are in ssm both with the 1 MW E-Cat and the small Hot Cat. I am finishing my working shift, will return here at 6 p.m.
I go to sleep.

July 4, 2015

It’s 3.48 p.m. of Saturday July 4th ( Independence Day for the USA). The 1 mW plant is stable, in ssm, the Hot Cat is stable and in ssm too. In this moment we have not particular problems, just stay alert.
Warm Regards, from inside the computers container

It’s important to remember that there are now two tests running concurrently: the 1 MW low temperature E-Cat plant which started about six months ago (by my estimation), and the Hot Cat (high temperature E-Cat) reactor test that Rossi says began more recently.

These brief updates lack many details, but they may be the best information we can get for now regarding the performance of the E-Cat. I think it’s significant that all mention “ssm” (self sustain mode) for both tests; Rossi has said that both the Hot Cat, and low temperature E-Cat can operate in SSM for very long periods of time now. Andrea Rossi has said that we will not get precise data on the testing until it is completed, but these occasional glimpses that he provides opens the window a little bit into what is going on at the customer site.

It’s also interesting that there have been sources other than Rossi who have confirmed to Mats Lewan, Torkel Nyberg (Sifferkol), and the Norwegian newspaper Aftenpost that testing is going well. This all adds up, in my opinion, to a picture of something potentially historic taking place, as we speak, inside two shipping containers somewhere in the United States.

UPDATE: A new data point has been given today by Andrea Rossi:

Now it’s 1.25 p.m. of July 9th.
The 1MW E-Cat is in ssm and stable. The Hot Cat too. I must say tht in this period She is not generating troubles. So far.
Warm Regards,

  • greggoble
  • Leonard Weinstein

    Solar energy is touted as free, wind energy is called free, but both have capitol cost, operational costs, lack of storage problems, and many other problems, making both of limited use, and actually more expensive than conventional generated energy. LENR may also have a low cost source of energy, but capitol cost, operational cost, and possible need for some auxiliary source of electricity (even if it is powered by e-cat, you need generator, etc.), means it is not free energy. Until all information and development are determined, it may turn out it is still an expensive source of energy for many uses. The main advantages I see are potential energy independence on local or even individual basis, and probably somewhat less cost than present small scale systems. There clearly would be, as shown by the current e-cat plant test, significantly cost saving for a plant level heat source. I doubt the giant scale water purification use. Nuclear is far better for that use at very large scales.

  • Owen Geiger

    Yeah, unless Agaricus’ forecast turns out to be true. He thinks IH will lease units quietly to their buddies at first.

    “…the technology will be introduced in as low key a manner as is possible,
    most probably by leasing plants quietly and without announcement to
    ‘word of mouth’ customers.”

    This could drag on for years before a big, formal announcement is made. This gives IH plenty of time to keep improving their reactors, set up business alliances, etc. AND allow the powers that be to phase out of fossil fuel investments and other antiquated systems.

    • Omega Z

      This is all going to take decades.
      How many decades did it take to build out where everyone had electricity to their homes the 1st time. Don’t know. It’s not done yet.

      High efficiency heating & cooling systems have been available for over 20 year. Yet, a Very Large portion of homes still have at least 30% less efficient antiquated systems. Maybe they will be replaced in the next 20 years.

      It should be noted that these HVAC systems where highly subsidized at Federal & State levels with some Utilities offering zero interest financing & accepting only the savings as payment over about 3 years. In essence, The home owner would have nothing out of pocket & all the energy savings after 2-3 years time.

      Most people offered this deal turned it down. Most missing out on 10-15 years of savings & ultimately having to buy such a system out of pocket or loans with interest. People make no sense.

  • Omega Z

    The LT E-cat doesn’t get anywhere near hot enough for Brick manufacturing. However, there are multiple food processors in the vicinity where the LT temperatures would be pretty much perfect.

    Of course, we must keep in mind that the customer could be located anywhere. It requires that Rossi live out of a hotel room.

  • Owen Geiger

    Key question for Rossi based on some comments below:
    Assuming successful testing of your LT reactor, are you planning industrial size production of units shortly afterwards? Or just build a few units and increase production gradually? Much regards from long time supporter of your work.

    Gradual increase in production of units makes sense to me since the reactor is still rapidly evolving.

  • Alan DeAngelis
    • Göran Jansson

      A good saying! Though not from the Greek philosopher but from a guy named Dan Millman.

      • Alan DeAngelis

        Thanks,

        “The main catalyst of his spiritual journey was an attendant at an all-night gas station who became his mentor in 1966. Millman gave this enlightened counselor the nickname “Socrates”,” I like that.
        http://quoteinvestigator.com/2013/05/28/socrates-energy/
        OK then, let’s have some of the old Socrates with a New Age twist. (7:00 min.)

        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SQq_XmhBTgg

        • Göran Jansson

          “With a twist”. Yes indeed. I followed Leary’s writings closely in the sixties and seventies and found his ideas interesting. I did never try LSD, which I in a way regret.

  • vokzzi V

    Not only potentially historical, but already historical.
    On Rossi comes with positive results and the secret customer to MW E-Cat starts to build industrial facilities operated by LENR, then we are a witness to the new epoch in human history.
    If it turns out that the result is not satisfactory It will be a shock for the whole LENR community.
    The same shock we got after Fleischmann and Pons have been humiliated 1989.

  • malkom700

    If we can not quickly introduce LENR it will be another failure of the whole society. Gives reason for optimism is the fact that in a year full breakthrough in the issue of global warming happened.

  • Alan DeAngelis

    “Nothing can stop the man with the right mental attitude from achieving his goal; nothing on earth can help the man with the wrong mental attitude.”
    -Thomas Jefferson
    Happy July 4th weekend

    • ecatworld

      Thank you, Alan.

    • GreenWin

      Back at you Alan. Great quote.

    • georgehants

      Alan very good quote if assumed that the “goal” is of a good cause, unfortunately in this existence many who’s goals are in my opinion unsavory seem to also archive their ends.
      Jefferson should have added a proviso recommending altruistic acts.

      • Alan DeAngelis

        Good point, we’ll just have to keep an eye on the charming psychopaths of the world who have our best interests in mind. 🙂

        • Agaricus

          Your task is likely to be surprisingly easy – I’m hard put to think of one psychopathic power monger who might genuinely have the best interests of the ‘useless eaters’ in mind.

    • roseland67

      Nothing in the world can take
      the place of Persistence.

      Talent will not; unsuccessful
      men with talent litter mankind.

      Genius will not; unrewarded
      genius is almost a proverb.

      Education will not; the world
      is full of educated derelicts.

      Persistence and determination
      alone are omnipotent,

      Either find a way, or make
      one, never lie down, never give up.

  • Mike Henderson

    It seems odd to me that the secret location has remained secret for so long.

    This is the internet, after all, and cyber-snooping is rampant. My favorite example is the way the folks on reddit.com/r/spacex and on nasaspaceflight.com forums track the comings and goings of SpaceX’s ships and barges used in their attempts to land and re-use a rocket booster.

    If the industrial site has many employees, somebody would surely brag or post something on their Facebook page. Especially if someone were terminated or otherwise held a grudge.

    Perhaps we need to step up our game? 😉

    • Omega Z

      Actually Mike, Those aware of the E-cat are but 0.1% of 0.1% of 0.1% of the world.

      There is a facility close to me that could probably make use of the 1Mw pilot plant. If it were, employees in general would not have a clue. Put an image of a cat on the door & the word E-cat, And they wouldn’t think anything of it. It is just an Electric steam generator. Discussed at lunch time, they determine E- stands for electric and the Cat probably means it is produced by Caterpillar Corp. Probably along side their Caterpillar Gen-sets.

      The few who are aware out of necessity will keep their mouth shut for many legit reasons if not for NDA. Consider what would happen if an Apple employee had inside knowledge & leaked it. The best employment opportunity he could expect for many years would be in the fast food service. That’s the way it works.

    • builditnow

      A starting point is somewhere close to Raliegh Durham, North Carolina. Start at Darden’s address and work outwards. 111 East Hargett Street, Suite 300. Raleigh, NC 27601.
      Start with satellite images to determine likely factories. It would also be a “friendly” business, i.e. one that has some connections to Darden / IH / Rossi.

    • Eyedoc

      I think it best that we all just let A Rossi bring his baby to full bloom at his own pace. To interfere or undermine him at this point is not good. I think its really close now…..I just hope he has the sense to keep some other (close family or friends aside from IH) intimately informed of the exact procedures and research he currently has . (so he & LENR can’t mysteriously disappear)

  • Gerard McEk

    It worries me that sometimes Rossi uses “1 mW” plant and at other moments the “1 MW” plant. There is a billion watts difference between these plants! 😉
    SSM may vary from moment to moment. If it would run in SSM for days or weeks, than that would be fantastic. However it could also work at the minute of his writing in SSM and a moment later not. I am afraid that we have to wait at least until the end of this year till we hear more.
    What do you know more about Sifferkol, Frank? Or is it just a rumor?

    • ecatworld

      Similar to what Mats and the Norwegian paper wrote.

      In April Torkel Nyberg wrote this on his Sifferkoll site:

      “I know first hand from very reliable sources that themselves have visited the Rossi/Industrial Heat E-Cat customer that the plant works very well. This has been verified both by measurements made by the customer and by significantly reduced electricity bills. The plant seems to be able to produce heat from electricity with a COP in the range of 20-80 depending on the level of self-sustain-mode applied. I guess that is what Rossi is working on right now.”

      http://www.sifferkoll.se/sifferkoll/?p=626

      • Gerard McEk

        Oh yes, that very promising message, which has never been confirmed by Andrea, I believe.
        If the plant is for long periods in SSM (say days or weeks), how it it then being controlled? Just by the take-off of heat or does it work in the way Axil assumes: a hot cat (or better: mouse) in the middle of some e-cats is being controlled and keeps the e-cats working without the need of extra heating. I personally would assume that short pulses of energy every few seconds into the heating coils of the e-cats are keeping them running and that the pulse width is being controlled to keep the system stable.

    • timycelyn

      I keep an eye on his JNOP blog, and have seen quite a few homonym (have I got that right? Two differently spelled words that sound the same is what I mean…) mistakes, possibly more in the recent past.

      I’ve recently started using a good speech to text package myself (just a way of getting my e-mail throughput up) at work, and Rossi’s ‘mistakes’ – such as this – have a very familiar look to them.
      We know he is – as ever – in hyperactive mode, and may well have adopted this type of software to deal with non-critical correspondance such as JONP.

      It is an amazingly good piece of softwre, but does make homonym mistakes, hardly surprisingly. I’ve found out that it has an almost malicious ability to substitiute the wrong spelling just where it will do the most harm.

      Recently, I was addressing a middle eastern customer in a mail starting

      “Dear Fadi….”

      The software’s version (thankfully caught at proofreading!) was “Dear Fatty….”

      Bless its little electronic heart…..

      • Omega Z

        I think English as a 2nd language is most of the issue for Rossi.

        What makes you believe that your “speech to text package” issues aren’t on purpose. Programmers can have a dark sense of humor.

        In your words-“I’ve found out that it has an almost malicious ability to substitute the wrong spelling just where it will do the most harm.”

        Once upon a time Years ago when I was into programming, I had issues with people’s naivete about computers & the software. I cracked a few programs adding some malicious code. To give me an undisputed edge of course. Followed with the reveal. With only a few exceptions, Most still showed zero concern.

        Apparently, I was the one who was naive. Millions of hacks every year & still most show little concern.

  • Paul Smith

    I wonder what will happen at the beginning of next year when the test of 1MW plant will be completed with a full success.

    Will it truly be the beginning of a new era? They will be very exciting times, certainly, but I think that the real effects on humanity will come only after many years.

    • Agaricus

      I think you are probably right. IMHO there won’t be any public ‘announcement’, as few people outside the ‘follower’ sites would believe the news. In any case it wouldn’t serve any purpose, as these machines will at best be replicated in small batches initially, and industry contacts will be enough to find all the buyers/lessees IH needs for G2/G3 models. It could take many iterations before IH (or their owners/partners) go for industrial scale automated production that would require a marketing effort.

      At a guess, early next year Rossi will say something vague such as, “The test has been concluded and we are now assessing the results. The customer is pleased.” and will then field any more pressing questions with generalities. I believe we are probably still in for a continued long wait for any public news release, which may simply take the form of planted ‘Is this the answer to our energy needs’ articles in various industry rags.

      • Omega Z

        I agree, it will be a slow start up. You wouldn’t want hundreds of these in operation only to find there are still major issues you were not aware of. That would break the bank real quick.

        I expect a few modified versions of the existing design. These will provide additional data that will also be beneficial for the home version.
        Followed by Gen2 that will be made up of 200Kw/250Kw reactors & possible multiple Megawatt systems. This will all be accompanied by a gradual increase in world aware.

        Probably sometime in 2016/17, the 1st Power generating pilot plant will be deployed. THIS, is when the real awareness will fully awaken. The Logic. The LT-Cat (Uses) electricity to produce heat. The HT-Cat will produce Electricity. The Holy Grail.

        • Agaricus

          Obviously total speculation (what else have we got?) but I think you’re being optimistic about cold fusion power generation in a couple of years. Rossi says hot cat experiments are going well (only hot cat reactors could be used in this way) but I haven’t seen much indication that this refers to anything more than some kind of test bed (i.e., probably not a pilot plant) and even an initial plant test could still be a couple of years away.

          In the meantime I think that LT reactors will slowly proliferate (not only from IH’s stable), and at some point this fact will gradually start to become public knowledge. After all, IH and any other backers have been shoving money in (admittedly only a few millions on the face of it) and might like to see some returns they can show to shareholders, and the technology seems to be maturing to a point where using LT reactors to produce cheap hot water or low pressure steam is commercially viable.

          So long as these devices are perceived as ‘power amplifiers’ rather than near-magical power sources, the uncritical mind will have much less difficulty accepting that they are real, and opposition may be less inclined to do much if they don’t appear to be too much of a threat to their investments or other interests. Whether or not the journalists and ‘academics’ have the balls to accept facts and go where they lead remains to be seen

          • radvar
            • Agaricus

              Yes – a curve resembling that for global wind turbine uptake is much more likely than the one for PV, but beginning at the same level.

          • radvar
          • GreenWin

            Peter, you point to the next big issue for IH and Dr. Rossi – generation of electricity. While this will not halt the commercial success of Industrial Heat products it is curious it is not higher above the horizon. I assume the LT Cat is best at heat-only production in this early phase. Transference of that heat to mechanical work introduces instability in the carefully balanced SSM.

            This may be the focus of the present HT Cat which could better accept the cooling effect of heat exchange. Regardless, indications are extreme sensitivity to “load.” Absent a robust method of thermal to work conversion the E-Cat remains an astonishing low cost source of heat energy. I expect to see others develop LENR-type plasmas which will better tolerate G. Miley-like direct conversion to current flow.

            Never-the-less, the success of the LT in an industrial setting will go far to dashing doubts about LENR’s commercial potential. This will accelerate R&D into the proven phenomenon resulting in a plethora of new products. Many of which may come from the corporate elite.

          • Omega Z

            “I think you’re being optimistic about cold fusion power generation in a couple of years”

            I propose the 2016/17 pilot plant electric generator based on a Rossi post a while back. They are in the early stages of designing it.
            Obviously, it will also have at least a 1 year field run(Positive or Negative). But it will also be a slow start up for similar reasons as the LT-cat. You don’t want to build out until your sure of most all possible issues.

            I should probably double check on JONP as sometimes, he deletes certain posts.

          • Omega Z

            As noted in my post to you below.
            ———————————————————-
            Andrea Rossi June 16th, 2015 at 7:32 AM

            Martyn Aubrey:
            So, it’s F9: I take advice of it!
            The temperature of 1600 K is equivalent to 1327°C ( it is 1600 – 273).
            The Hot Cat 1 MW plant is object now of designing. We still do not have a prototype.
            After the end of the test on course in the factory of the IH Customer ( F9) we’ll start the construction of a Hot Tiger.
            Thank you for your attention to our work.
            Warm Regards, A.R.
            ———————————————————-
            Andrea Rossi June 16th, 2015 at 9:48 AM

            Mark Saker:
            An R&D is on course on the scale up of the “Hot Cats”.
            Warm Regards, A.R.

            • Albert D. Kallal

              Unfortunately, this does suggest that Rossi can now state they are going to use the “better” hot-cats and thus they need another year of testing + running?

              This is difficult! Why sell a LT cat when HT cats are just around the corner? And why sell LT cats that competitors can take apart can catch up to when HT cats are for sell?

              Based on above, Rossi can WELL make the case that they going with HT cats, and thus another year + test is required. This unfortunately will give the impression that what they have is not working well. There not a lot of incentive to sell LT cats if HT cats are coming out next year.

              Regards,
              Albert D. Kallal
              Edmonton, Alberta Canada

              • Agaricus

                I’ve said before that I believe that a leasing business model will be adopted, that will allow upgrades to be made without complications, and will also provide for IH staff ‘on loan’ to run the plants and provide security. That way, customers will be assured of having the most recently developed variants that suit their purposes, and IH can keep potential spies away from their kit.

                Unfortunately, I think that the scenario you suggest (things go quiet after the LT test run has concluded, and Rossi then only talks about future HT development) is all too likely, and some previously supportive observers will begin drift over to the ‘ECN’ interpretation of events.

                • Omega Z

                  Peter
                  It depends on what IH/Rossi’s market plan involves. I believe the initial building of pilot plants & such are just part of R&D to optimize the technology & the harnessing of it for useful purposes. The harnessing part is to provide licenses a starting point for product development.

                  Once accomplished, IH/Rossi will manufacture reactors to be used by licenses in their products. This path requires a patent. Even if IH/Rossi can’t patent the basics of LENR, they can patent all the optimized hardware developed & copyright any software that operates it (APPLE). This requires all competition to create their own. (Time consuming)

                  The above sums up nearly everything Rossi has stated over a long period of time. The only outlier is Rossi’s stated intent to patent the basic technology. This could be the distractor while everything else above is accomplished.

                  Everyone else is still trying to reach Rossi’s level to obtain patents on something that may not even be patentable in an enforceable manor while IH/Rossi are busy patenting the optimized hardware & software thus gaining several years lead time in marketing.

                  Consider this. You may not be able to patent the basics of LENR any more then you can patent magnetic fields. However, you can patent/copyright “your basic technology” for creating & controlling it in a useable fashion.

              • ecatworld

                I asked about this on the JONP:

                Dear Andrea,

                If you have success with Hot Cat testing, will there still be good reasons for you to produce low temperature E-Cat plants and reactors? Why would you need the low temperature plants?

                Andrea Rossi

                July 5th, 2015 at 6:39 PM

                Frank Acland:
                Yes, the low temperature E-Cats will be still in the line of fire for many industrial purposes. Not for domestic.
                Warm Regards,
                A.R.

              • Omega Z

                Albert
                Due to nature, I believe there will be multiple variations of E-cats.
                The higher the temp, the more robust & expensive the materials & the shorter the life cycle. Therefore, I believe they will be sized & manufactured according to market need. An LT-cat could last several decades for food processing. The HT-cat would need periodic replacement. It all comes back to overall economics. Not 1 size fits all.

            • Agaricus

              Thanks. All depressingly linear and plodding.

      • Mytakeis

        Successful replications could speed up the process, I think. Getting closer all the time, and Andrea Rossi’s prolonged SSM’s encourage replicators to keep on trucking.

  • Owen Geiger

    What did you mean?: ” as we speak inside two shipping containers somewhere in the United States.”

    Fix and delete.