MFMP Glowstick 3 Test — Was there Excess Heat? (Update: MFMP Provides Interim Analysis)

Thanks to Stephen Taylor for this suggestion:

@admin Frank, do you think it would be a good idea to start a GS3 summary thread? I am a little confused about what was learned and even uncertain what was observed. There were some measurement problems because of the coil bind or something and I’m not sure how to interpret the data at this point. Not sure where the discussion is happening. Any guidance will be appreciated.

I think Stephen’s idea is good — we’ve had lots of discussion, but now all the testing has finished I’m wondering if we are in a position to come to any firm conclusions. I have to confess that I am not sure what to think regarding the testing. There did seem to be some data that indicated that excess heat was measured in the test — but there has also been statements from members of the MFMP that cast doubt on that.

I don’t feel qualified to make an kind of firm evaluation on this test, so this thread is for you to put forward your best thinking on the topic. Thanks in advance!

UPDATE (June 13, 2015)

The Martin Fleischmann Memorial Project have posted the following analysis of their recent Glowstick 3 test on their Facebook page.

Did the *GlowStick* GS3 see excess heat?
[]=Project Dog Bone=[] Alan has been analysing the data from the calibration, active and subsequent re-heat runs and whilst it appears at that some of the observed departure from calibration can be explained by wire binding and movement – not all can be.
See the attached adjusted graph published for discussion (GS3 Active Run 27 May 2015 – with correction for heater coil misalignment).
For all the data and Notes, block diagram, schematics, bill of materials for the experiment go here
https://goo.gl/9P85Gs

Jack Cole commented on the experiment also:

“The declining and increasing power above the Parkhomov zone make it less likely that moved or constricted coils are the explanation. The coil would have to be shifting about to create an effect like that.”
Then he compares the recent family of GS3 charts produced by followers Sanjeev, Ged and Ecco (see graph with blue arrows) that have a similar behaviour to one of his own experiments he suspected of producing excess heat (see attached graph)

“Here is a chart from an experiment I did that showed apparent excess heat.”
Notice the similarities…

It is too premature to call anything, a post tear-down calibration may help, the real clincher would be evidence of elemental or isotopic ratio changes in the ash. Here is what the plan is in that direction in Alan’s own words:

“I’ll be opening the GS3 reactor on Monday after checking the residual pressure. Then I’ll pump it down to vacuum and leave it for a while to de-load the hydrogen. After reinstalling the core thermocouple I’ll do a final calibration run. These steps will be done with the reactor in place on the test stand, without disturbing the thermocouples or heater coil.
As a final step I’ll remove the fuel and divide it into samples for isotopic analysis.”

Whatever the outcome, we have to thank Alan and Skip for a job well done.

As ever, to discuss this more fully, head over to our main site here

http://goo.gl/AS8CuL

mfmp1

mfmp1

mfmp3

  • fact police

    There is no definition of COP that would give you 1.4

  • ss dd

    Has the MFMP considered measuring magnetic fields during their experiments? Is that something that would make some sense?

    On another thread: “The most obvious source of electrical power could be the magnetic field of the fast moving alpha particles.”.

    Wouldn’t it make sense to try to detect this field?

  • Ted-X

    OFF-TOPIC: The hibiscus tea may cause loss of hair.

    • bachcole

      I think that Ted-X was putting me on:

      https://www.pinterest.com/Sandust1/teas-for-hair/

      “In Ayurveda, Hibiscus (Jaswand) is known for healthy hair. Hibiscus
      promotes hair growth, stops hairfall, and delays premature graying.”

      My wife will want to know about this.

  • Ged

    The temperature versus time chart is up there too, above in this article, so I do not understand your objection as written.

    The power versus temperature chart I made is a double moving average across 12 or so minutes, so fast, transitory events such as thermal inertia are not visible.

  • Curbina

    Well Mr. Ahern, certainly the power vs temperature plot leaves out the time at which the temperature was held at certain power. And therefore the thermal inertia can indeed account for the observation. I wonder if with the data available the time can be added as another variable in the chart, and if that chart could reveal something about the thermal inertia.

  • pg

    was it too subtle?

  • Curbina

    Hello, I’ve been unable (time wise) to post comments for a while but have kept reading the new posts and respective comments. About the ongoing analysis of the GS3 results I’d like to ask Alan Goldwater and Bob Greenyer about their personal opinion on the analysis. I think the revised and adjusted input power vs temp plot is clear to show that at least in a range of temps there was “excess heat”. The results are at least encouraging.

    • Bob Greenyer

      Firstly, the test that Alan and Skip performed was brilliantly executed and I doff my hat to them.

      My personal opinion is that this is annoying – in the same way that the Mathieu’s Dec 12 2012 test with Celani wire that apparently produced 12.5% excess was annoying. It is annoying because it is not so huge that it cannot be dismissed, but it is tantalising and a good motivator for everyone to plough onwards.

      For me, thermometry is a good screening approach because it is relatively cheap and can show things that may have promise – but conclusive at this level – no. Well understood calorimetry like Parkhomov’s original approach is much easier to debate.

      In the end, it is all in the ash – this test is sufficiently interesting to warrant asking those that have offerred to analyse ash for us, to do so. If the ash shows elemental or isotopic changes in line with those claimed by others and which would be expected to yield excess heat – then we’d be in a better position to call it.

      • Curbina

        Thanks for your comment Bob. I hope something valuable is revealed by the ash analysis.

  • Mats002

    It is not my intension to discredit anyone, all those people are great men doing fantastic things. My point is that most people – including myself – tend to trust some sources of information more than other. Soft and even hard evidence will be valued differently by people depending on their relation to the source of information.

  • James Andrew Rovnak

    I don’t joke lightly, do a lot of dreaming & reflections base on my past life experiences as a Nuclear Engineer who left to work in fossil & petrochemical plants for a while because no one wanted to build inherently safe reactors, then back to nuclear. I was born & raised in a small Pennsylvania coal town & remember as a kid seeing grown men coming out of the mines with white circles around their eyes & coal black faces & tried unsuccessfully to do something about their plight with my career. Many I knew died of black lung disease, no less, unfortunately for them & their families & I did nothing to help of that I am deeply sorry!
    Jim

  • James Andrew Rovnak

    Take a look at Vessela Nikolova’s blog to get a handle on EM worth in starting & maintaining these reaction ss dd.
    I tried to write to her today, but the site guardian called my comment spam & couldn’t get thru, oh well, maybe another day. Really liked the yellow book Hot Cat 2.0 she co authored available on Amazon.com

    Jim

    http://www.ecat-thenewfire.com/blog/fast-fuel-test-heat-after-death

    I know Alan likes to refer to heat after death (HAD) in his discussions.

  • James Andrew Rovnak

    Its there Baccole of that I am certain but see what the ash says, No? Only hope there is enough to measure well for we did not run as long as Lugano! That test by Rossi cued every experimenter on what to put in his fuel element on many guesses as to why by them. take a look at following tweet for uncontestable evidence by a new player in field about LENR energies truth both in theory & experimental evidence at least in the case of converting Li isotopes up the chain to get their useful power to warm us eventual,

    https://twitter.com/JAROVNAK/status/609856971206991872

    • Bob Greenyer

      I agree that this patent is profound, we reported on it some time ago and it really opens the door to Lithium derived energy with very low projectile energy.

      What is incredible about this patent is the scores of well conducted experiments.

  • James Andrew Rovnak

    Good show Bachcole enjoy your comment thoroughly & eternal optimism

    Jim.

  • magicsnd1

    Regarding a question asked by Mats002 about measuring the voltage at the center of the coil, it’s not necessary to measure each half separately. In fact, the
    main feature of this experimental design is that each side (ie. Active
    and Null) gets exactly the same amount of joule heating from the coil,
    which is precisely symmetrical and made as a single winding.

    Therefore
    any difference in temperature is from other factors, including physical
    deformation of the windings from thermal expansion, and differences in
    the core, like thermal conductivity and reactivity of the fuel. Only after analyzing and systematically eliminating the physical variables can the presence of LENR excess heat be claimed.

    • Mats002

      Agree but one factor you did not mension now is electrical influences because of different core materials at the two sides. From discussions here at ECW that possibility is ruled out as far I can understand, so I make a deep bow for what you have acomplished.