Rossi: Manufacturing and Outsourcing System in Place for E-Cat Plants

It seems that while Andrea Rossi and his team is working on current test of the 1MW plant, that Industrial Heat has been making plans for future production of the E-Cat plant.

Today Andrea Rossi responded to a question about the length of time it might take for IH to fulfill an order for 100 E-Cat plants with the following comments:

Andrea Rossi
May 2nd, 2015 at 10:29 AM
Eernie1:
Provided the test on course ends up positively, an outsouring system and a manufacturing system has already been organized to be able to sustain the amount of plants that will be ordered. We will manufacture only the confidential parts, outsourcing all the rest.
The development of the manufacturing capacity will be developed proportionally to the actual amount of orders.
Warm Regards,
A.R.

Obviously at the moment we are not able to indicate precisely a delivery term, but I suppose we will be in the average of the delivery terms of the sector.

This looks like a sensible strategy — outsource all possible production to people who have the facilities, capacity and personnel to do the job efficiently. I guess that only the E-Cat reactors themselves will be made directly by Industrial Heat.

Everything depends, of course, on the success of this current test — but if it does well it looks like IH is ready to roll its products out into the marketplace. We have yet to know what the cost will be for the plant — that will be a crucial piece of information which will be an important factor in the number of orders IH could get for these plants.

  • Alain Samoun

    Good question…

  • Guru

    E-Cat is too much late. Missing boat. 1,5 million USD for 1 MW thermal plant ?

    Here is something more sexy: Neverending battery. Electricity directly out.
    Finished product. No need for 5 engineers to be in second container during operation.
    https://scontent-mad.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xap1/v/t1.0-9/10423682_10152876068928977_8678113040014925540_n.jpg?oh=5e711700c6871f56aa12f81e6fc17c61&oe=55E22DAE

  • Alan DeAngelis

    What was it that prompted the US patent office to suddenly start issuing LENR patents a few years ago?

  • Pekka Janhunen

    Yes but the context was Wright era planes. Anyway the point is that Rossi has used only four 12-month long iteration cycles from 2011 to this point. If a fresh competitor wants to catch up and win, he must manage with significantly fewer iterations. It’s a challenge, and the size of the research budget doesn’t necessarily help. In order to have a chance of winning the competitor must also take risks and be clever.

  • Obvious

    Complaints about the degeneration of society, and the bad behaviour of youth go back thousands of years. There is graffiti on the walls of Pompeii. From before the volcano erupted.

    • bachcole

      I knew that you would said that, obviously. I just expected it to be Egypt. At the time of the demise of Pompeii, Rome was already in decline. Just because this has happened before does not mean that it is not happening now. You can look at history books and fancy that you know something about the matter. I sleep with a living witness to the reality of our decline.

      • Obvious

        The impression of the decline is colored by a psyche formed in the earlier paradigm. Perhaps the children of these “degenerates” will rebel against their parents by becoming extra conservative.
        In my aging view, the youth have much more freedom than when I was young, and I more than my parents. When I was a trouble-making youth, we used to get chased a beat up for having a Mohawk haircut, and/or blue and/or green hair. (Most often by the heavy metal longhairs!). Now a 12 year old can walk down the street with hair like that without too much concern. Heavy metal and punk is almost mainstream. To get even weirder is getting harder to do, and is almost to the limit now, so the opposite will become the new avante guard, as fashion and attidutes rebound. Mozart hairdos, very formal suits, no tattoo or piercings will be the way to be “different”.
        Not to mention having kids sure is an attitude adjuster… especially if one was prone to learning the hard way when younger.

        • US_Citizen71

          My grandmother who went to high school in the 1920’s use to tell stories of kids wearing mohawks dyed red with mercurochrome as a form of rebellion. Everything old is new again!

          • Obvious

            Most of what was written in Pompeii isn’t fit to repeat here, but I thought this one was good: (translated) “O walls, you have held up so much tedious graffiti that I am amazed that you have not already collapsed in ruin.”

  • Bernie Koppenhofer

    From everything Darden has said, “I am not in it for the money”, “my
    goal is to remove coal as a fossil fuel” and if Rossi is satisfied with the
    millions he has already secured and will secure from his contract with IH, then
    we have to assume they expect and will even encourage replication, and they are
    proceeding in a way, they think, is the fastest way to LENR industrialization.

    • LuFong

      Tom Darden also said, “My goal is to give your science away, to get out broadly and equitably to the world, to see you receive honor and rewards for your efforts.” This may have been one motivation for the Lugano report. But also remember Rossi has a say in all of this and his goals or approaches may not be the same.

      • Bernie Koppenhofer

        It is my opinion Rossi truly believes the “free market” is the best way to introduce his E-Cat to the world. After following him for more than four years, his motivation is NOT for power, and extreme greed does not fit with his humanitarian streak. I think Rossi would be very happy after he makes his first 100 million to only be publicly known for his E-Cat and Nobel Prize.

  • pg

    EP2680271 – and apparatus for generating energy through inertial confinement fusion.

    • pg

      Sorry. EP2680271. Method and apparatus for generating energy through inertial confinement fusion.
      From the european patent application server. Anyone knows what this is?

      Date of publication:

      01.01.2014 Bulletin 2014/01 Application number: 12173401.6 Date of filing: 25.06.2012

      Designated Contracting States:

      AL AT BE BG CH CY CZ DE DK EE ES FI FR GB GR HR HU IE IS IT LI LT LU LV MC MK MT NL NO PL PT RO RS SE SI SK SM TR Designated Extension States:

      BA ME

      Applicant: Holmlid, Leif 412 96 Göteborg (SE)

      (74) Representative: Edlund, Fabian et al Awapatent AB

      P.O. Box 11 394 404 28 Göteborg (SE)

      Method and apparatus for generating energy through inertial confinement fusion

      The present invention relates to a method of generating energy by nuclear fusion. The method com- prises the steps of: bringing (100) hydrogen in a gaseous state into contact with a hydrogen transfer catalyst (14) configured to cause a transition of the hydrogen from the gaseous state to an ultra-dense state; collecting (101) the hydrogen in the ultra-dense state on a carrier (3) con-

      figured to substantially confine the hydrogen in the ultra- dense state within a fuel collection portion (16) of the carrier; transporting (102) the carrier to an irradiation lo- cation (9); and subjecting (103), at the irradiation location, the hydrogen in the ultra-dense state to irradiation having sufficient energy to achieve break-even in energy gen- eration by nuclear fusion.

      Printed by Jouve, 75001 PARIS (FR)

      EP 2 680 271 A1

      • Daniel Maris

        Looks like Leif Holmlid is a Professor Emeritus – that’s pretty high up the scientific hierarchy!

        http://www2.chem.gu.se/~holmlid/

        He says:

        My main research interest since some time is dense and
        ultra-dense hydrogen forms. These materials are the lowest energy states of
        Rydberg Matter. This is a state of matter of the same status as liquid or solid,
        since it can be formed by a large number of atoms and small molecules. For a
        more complete description, see Wikipedia.

        The lowest state of Rydberg Matter in
        excitation state n = 1 can only be formed from hydrogen (protium and deuterium)
        atoms and is designated H(1) or D(1). This is dense or metallic hydrogen, which
        we have studied for a few years. The bond distance is 153 pm, or 2.9 times the
        Bohr radius. It has a density of approximately 0.6 kg / dm3. See for example
        Ref. 167 below!

        A much denser state exists for deuterium, named D(-1) or d(-1).
        We call it ultra-dense deuterium. This is the inverse
        of D(1), and the bond distance is very small, equal to 2.3 pm. Its density is
        extremely large, >130 kg / cm3. Due to the short bond distance, D-D fusion is
        expected to take place easily in this material. See Wikipedia! See
        also a press
        release and listen to a
        radio interview in Swedish (10.50 min into the program). A similar but not
        identical material formed from protium is called p(-1) or ultra-dense protium.

        A theoretical description of ultra-dense deuterium D(-1) has
        been published by Friedwardt Winterberg. See these links to Journal
        of Fusion Energy, and Physics
        Letters A. The first experiments showing nuclear fusion in
        D(-1) can be found as Refs. 191 and 201 below.

        Ultra-dense deuterium was recently shown to be the first
        room-temperature superfluid, see Ref. 196 below. It also shows a Meissner effect
        at room temperature (Ref. 204) and is thus probably also superconductive at room
        temperature.

        • Alain Samoun

          This is related to a previous post from Axil Axil. Care to comment Axil?

          • Axil Axil

            Hydrogen Rydberg matter is the most powerful aplifiers of LENR power that there is because its crystal form is so small.

            All other alkili metals produce Rydberg matter. The one we are interested in with application to the Hot Cat is lithium.

            But many other elements and compound from solid dust that add to the mechanisms that produce LENR.

            Any element and many molecules can form a cluster if the conditions are right.

            We all learned in high school science classes about three states of matter: solid, liquid, and gaseous. Liquids were described as the bridge between gases and solids, possessing a definite volume but no definite shape, compared to gases which have neither, and solids which have both. Those who continued on in science learned about a fourth and — from a universal perspective — more common form of matter called plasma, which is an ionized gas.

            In recent times, scientists have added to this list yet another form of matter — aggregates of atoms packed into spherically shaped objects called “clusters.” Numbering as few as three or as many as a million individual atoms in size, these tiny bits of matter serve as a bridge between gases and bulk phase materials (liquids and solids), and if you visit the chemistry, physics, or materials sciences departments of any major research institution today, you are almost certain to find someone who is working with them.

            Clusters can be formed from any element on the periodic chart. They can be composed of a single type of atom — an “elemental cluster” — or they can be composed of two or more different types of atoms or molecules. Depending on their composition, they can be metallic or non-metallic. There are electrically neutral clusters, and there are electrically-charged “ionic” clusters.

            What all clusters have in common, however, is their in-between size: they are too large to be thought of as a molecule but too small to be classified as a liquid or a solid. Consequently, clusters frequently exhibit physical and chemical properties not seen in bulk phase materials — properties that scientists hope to exploit in a broad number of areas.

            For chemists, an area considered by many to be a holy grail is the study of matter as it evolves from the gas to the liquid state. New knowledge about this transition is expected to come from a better understanding of the formation and structure of ionic clusters.

            Ionic clusters consist of a single ion surrounded by one or more neutral molecules. They are created when a gas is cooled. Molecules in the gaseous state are widely separated and move about in continual motion. So widely separated in space are these molecules that they exert no force of attraction upon one another, and although they frequently collide, their kinetic energy is so high they will not stick together. These gas molecules must be cooled to reduce their kinetic energy and associated random motion.

            As the temperature in the gas drops, however, molecular motion slows and the molecules begin to gather and stick together. Eventually, the motion slows sufficiently for intermolecular forces of attraction to bind the molecules together into clusters that number from a few to a few hundred individual molecules in size. If the number of neutral molecules surrounding the ion in each cluster becomes sufficiently large, an assemblage of clusters will resemble a conventional bulk material–either a liquid or a solid.

            Spreading jellium

            http://www-ssrl.slac.stanford.edu/content/sites/default/files/images/science/highlights/2007/goldnano-fig1.jpg

            The story of the superatom begins when two physicists walk into a barber shop. Marvin Cohen of the University of California, Berkeley recalls how he and a colleague, the late Walter Knight, ran into each other at their favorite barber’s one afternoon in 1984.

            While waiting for his haircut, Knight talked about some surprising data from an experiment in which he had baked a block of sodium and then measured the masses, and thus the sizes, of vaporized particles that came out.

            Knight’s particles came in a range of sizes. But those made of eight, 20, 40, 58, or 92 atoms were a lot more abundant. Cohen guessed what might be happening, and he started scribbling some back-of-the-envelope calculations. “Tony, the barber, thought we were figuring out a way to beat the stock market,” Cohen recalls.

            Sodium is a metal, with a propensity to shed one of its 11 electrons. In a cluster, atoms share these electrons in a “socialistic” way.

            Cohen says. For simplicity, in his calculation he imagined the positive electric charge of a cluster’s sodium ions (each of them an atom minus one electron) as being spread uniformly like jelly, rather than concentrated at the ions. Nuclear physicists use a similar model for atomic nuclei; they call it the “jellium” model.

            Jellium gave the right answer. The shared electrons orbiting the cluster do so in different energy levels, or shells, just as they would in an atom, Cohen figured. Computer calculations confirmed his guess. Like ordinary atoms, clusters with unfilled electron shells are chemically reactive. Full shells, with “magic numbers” of electrons, are not. Sodium clusters with eight, 20 or 40 atoms are the analog of helium, neon, and the other noble gases, which rarely form molecules. Clusters with non-magic numbers of atoms tend to lose or gain electrons, making them more likely to also lose or gain atoms (to get a magic number) through collisions with other clusters

            http://www.azonano.com/work/Superatoms,%20How%20The%20Materials%20Research%20Institute%20at%20Penn%20State%20Might%20Rewrite%20The%20Periodic%20Table%20By%20Using%20Nanoclusters%20To%20Make%20Superatoms%20One%20Atom%20at%20a%20Time_files/image001.jpg.

            Simulation of a superatom

            This type behavior leads to the name “super atom”

            • Daniel Maris

              Thanks for the informative tutorial!

            • pharoa

              Is it possible that earth is has a lenr reactor in its core and cracks in the outer crust resemble the NAE or defects in lenr expirements?

            • Alain Samoun

              So it is a new type of matter with ultra high density.
              This allows for example a D-D fusion started with a green laser excitation.
              Can we say that the experiment of F&P produced some of this material and that the fusion was randomly started by some radiation (Gamma ray from space?) Giving then the explanation of the difficulty to reproduce this experiment at will?

              • Axil Axil

                The D-D fusion that you segest would produce nuclear byproducts all the time. This is not seen in LENR. Ultradense hydrogen fusion is a “warm” fusion mechanism; it is not LENR.

  • friendlyprogrammer
    • bkrharold

      Actually he started by ripping off CP/M from Gary Kildall, and carried on from there ripping off Apple and squashing all competition on the way. Now we are all stuck with his monstrous creation.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        I’ll not complain. The computer Era has treated me well. Hence my Monicker. Crime pays is the lesson of the day.

  • US_Citizen71

    It is called teen angst and has been around since the caveman. The biggest difference between today and when you grew up and went through it is society puts less of a filter on speech and pop-music today. Older generations didn’t really care for Rock n’ Roll when it came out and viewed it much as you view today’s music popular with youth. It is just a different viewpoint from a different stage in life. I share your disdain for much of today’s music but not due to lyrical content just its awful sound engineering with its narrow dynamic volume.

  • BroKeeper

    Christine, you are correct. We all were designed to be ‘Brother’s Keepers’. Until we harmonize to that truth unpleasant consequences will remain whether we are the cause or recipient of disharmony. Technology is only a tool to ones choices for good or evil.

  • William D. Fleming

    What with that bit of bragadossio I assume you are in the U.S. I live in the U.S. also and I don’t know a single chronically unhappy person. It must be that you live up north.

    If anyone is unhappy it is only because they are thinking untrue thoughts, because the natural state of life is a sense of profound blessedness. You are right though that new technology can not cause happiness.

  • JedRothwell

    Rossi is quoted:

    “We will manufacture only the confidential parts, outsourcing all the rest.”

    Modern regulations do not allow the use of “confidential parts” in this kind of equipment. Every single component, including the screws in the faceplate, has to be reviewed by Underwriter’s Laboratory or the equipment will not be certified for use, and no one will buy it. You have to supply UL with a full set of blueprints and with working models. Government regulators will also demand full details. Furthermore, this device would trigger frantic efforts by other companies to reverse engineer the technology. Every industrial manufacturer in the world will want to know how it works, and they will soon find out.

    There is not the slightest chance you can keep any aspect of this device secret.

    A business strategy of “security by obscurity” cannot work for this product. The only strategy that can work will be patents and open intellectual property.

    • Axil Axil

      Jed is so wise. Jed is almost always correct in his understanding of how the future will unfold.

      • JedRothwell

        Thanks! I hesitate to “vote up” such praise, but thanks.

    • http://renewable.50webs.com/ Christopher Calder

      Solar Hydrogen Trends had the idea of keeping their technology secret by having it used on US military bases abroad, which would then sell electricity created by their secret process to the hosting countries. I told them I would bet my life that that scenario would never come to pass. These technologies are like the internal combustion engine. How many companies around the world make them today? How many companies make transistors today? You cannot keep secrets for long, and you can bet the major intelligence agencies from both hemispheres are keeping tabs on information sent over the Internet.

    • Patrick Ellul

      Jed you are correct of course about reverse engineering. Sometimes AR does mention and admits that their best market asset is the first mover advantage, that they are far ahead of their competition. This is not unlike any other technology. In fact one could conspire that this one year test is just a front to gain a bigger advantage on competition. Generating some doubt with “could be negative” mantra while outsourced production lines and contacts are set up.

      • JedRothwell

        I do not think there can be any “first mover advantage” for a technology as important as this. Furthermore, once serious R&D begins, hundreds of major industrial corporations such as GE and Hitachi will pour billions of dollars into the field. Rossi will not be able to complete with them.

        Rossi will have no “first mover advantage” for the same reason the Wright brothers had no advantage in 1908, when the public first learned that the airplane exists. The Wrights thought they had an advantage. In 1907 they wrote to the venture capitalists backing them:

        “We can furnish governments with practical machines . . . now: no one else can. There
        is no certainty that anyone else is within three years of us . . . The progress made by others since the announcement of our final success at the end of 1905 is as rapid as could reasonably be expected, but it by no means indicates that others will reach the goal in less time than we required.”

        In my essay on the Wrights, I wrote:

        “Their strategy was predicated on the preposterous idea that you can keep a patented airplane secret. It never seems to have occurred to them that once intense public interest ignites, the quality of replications must improve dramatically. Furthermore, they did not grasp that it is much easier to replicate than it is to invent something in the first place. They should have seen that only third-rate people were trying replicate them during this period, but that in a boom thousands of talented people would soon get to work and progress would be immeasurably swifter.”

        By 1911 there were ~500,000 people working in aviation and the Wrights were behind their European rivals.

        See:

        http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/RothwellJthewrightb.pdf

        • Patrick Ellul

          Thanks for the deeper explanation. Of course I am not thinking that AR could possibly ward off competition, only speculating on what his strategy at attempting to do so might be. He shouldn’t just give up market wise just because he’s really up against it. We do feel for him of course, but I would say most of us care more about the technology going mainstream.

        • Sanjeev

          I agree with both comments of yours. The E-Cat will slip like sand from the hands of Rossi and co. The only way to monopolize it is to not to release it at all.

          • Agaricus

            Even that is dubious. Once a new thing is known to be possible it’s only a matter of time before others will replicate it..

          • mcloki

            OR. IH and Rossi will do like thousands of other companies. Pioneer the effort and then sell to a higher bidder. Sure GE and other can put billions into starting LENR research from scratch or they can cut a cheque.

        • Pekka Janhunen

          An aeroplane can be tested quickly, but testing the E-cat takes time because it’s supposed to run for 6-12 months by single fuelling. That will slow down replicators.

        • http://www.lenrnews.eu/lenr-summary-for-policy-makers/ AlainCo

          is it a reason to expect that the winner in LENR race will be those who can attract talents to go further ?
          not the one who protect his back?

    • Warthog

      Gotta disagree with you, Jed.

      Certainly, the UL and/or government regulators will demand full details, but they can (and will) keep those details secure. Both UL and regulators understand the need for confidentiality and competition.

      To use a non-LENR example, Elon Musk’s rocketry efforts do not seek patents, specifically because (in Musk’s words (paraphrased))…patents are just licenses for outlaw countries to steal technology….. I’m sure that all Musk’s tech (if it goes commercial) will require the same level of regulation that LENR might….but he certainly expects confidentiality to be maintained in spite of such scrutiny.

      Research by possible competitors will, OTOH, skyrocket (and I suspect is already doing so). I fully expect Rossi’s tech to be both duplicated AND improved VERY rapidly

      • JedRothwell

        Elon Musk’s rocketry is a very special case, unlike like any other industry.

        Rossi is presently working on an industrial scale boilers. Industrial boilers are all regulated with thousands of pages of details published by the government and by the ASME. There is not a single component in any boiler that is not extensively standardized and regulated by the federal and state governments. See, for example, the regulations in Rhode Island:

        RULES AND REGULATIONS FOR BOILER AND PRESSURE VESSEL INSPECTION

        http://www.dlt.ri.gov/occusafe/pdfs/boilerregs.pdf

        This is 53 pages long. It covers things like:

        EBO-l – Age Limit Of Existing Boilers
        EBO-2 – Maximum Allowable Working Pressure For Standard Boilers
        EBO-3 – Maximum Allowable Working Pressure For Nonstandard Boilers
        EBO-4 – Cast Iron Headers And Mud Drums
        . . . etc.

        It ends by pointing the reader to a much larger, more extensive set of regulations:

        “GR-19 Conditions Not Covered by These Rules and Regulations

        For any conditions not covered by these requirements, the applicable provisions of the ASME Code or the NATIONAL BOARD INSPECTION CODE shall apply.”

        ASME codes for boilers are sold in as multi-volume books. That’s hundreds of pages. It covers everything from latches to how you dispose of condensate.

        Until we have hundreds of pages of similar regulations governing every aspect of the Rossi reactor, including especially the inner core where the reaction occurs, no first world government regulator and no industry standards organization will allow these reactors. No insurance company will cover them. No sane factory manager, employer, or facilities manager would allow one.

        We do not allow untested equipment in modern society. We do not allow so much as a fingernail nail clipper or a garden hose that does not meet extensive standards for product safety and longevity. The notion that we might allow a nuclear reactor that works by unknown principles is utterly ridiculous.

        Fortunately, the cost of developing these standards will be trivial per unit. It will actually lower the cost of the equipment. That is all modern technology works.

        • Warthog

          “Elon Musk’s rocketry is a very special case, unlike like any other industry.”

          See “aerospace industry”. Just as heavily regulated, if not more so, than the “industrial boiler” category. When Musk “goes commercial” he will come under all of those regulations. Not a special case at all.

          Likewise “Cherokee”…..waste treatment/remediation in cement production…..VERY heavily regulated. I am sure that Darden and his Industrial Heat collaborators are working very hard with those who will regulate the proposed systems. But I say again….although those details must (and will) be revealed to the regulators, the regulators will NOT publish them to the general public.

        • Bernie Koppenhofer

          The govenment of China will not play by the above rules.

    • Guest

      Is there any possibility or regular process by which the patent offices could grant a retroactive patent? Previous ECat applications were rejected, but if it is demonstrated to work…?

    • Albert D. Kallal

      The simple issue that they want to “slow down” the rate of others stealing their designs.

      The fact that they intend to keep “in-house” the important parts does not suggest in any way this prevents some kind of UL certification. The UL folks will most certainly be bound by some kind of non disclosure and of course such parts will be supplied for that certification. NOTHING here suggests this would prevent UL certification. And nothing suggests that such parts would not be supplied for the UL certification process.

      However, outsourcing the manufacture is a VERY different matter.

      Keeping in house the “important” parts is often a way to hold on to such designs as opposed to outsourcing such important manufacturing to China or some other place that results in both the parts and designs appearing next week on eBay.

      Rossi has stated many times that he expects reverse engineering of their products, but there no need to make such reverse engineering so easy.

      The control software, and how this system works means even with reverse engineering, building commercial competing products will take some considerable effort. Even the data from performance of the plant is a huge lead time.

      I do however accept that “copy” products will occur relative soon after the e-cat, but it will take some time, since small low cost e-cat units will not be available for some time (and thus who has a million dollars to buy a plant that they intend to take apart?). Most larger companies accept and run by rule of law – they not be willing to steal such designs and contracts will no doubt limit this ability.

      Regards,
      Albert D. Kallal
      Edmonton, Alberta Canada
      [email protected]

  • http://renewable.50webs.com/ Christopher Calder

    Would anyone care to guess the total weight of all of the fuel in the one megawatt E-Cat reactor now operating in North Carolina? Fuel would be defined as all of the powder, including every ingredient of the mixture, not just the nickel. Ho much in kilograms total?

    • Alan DeAngelis

      Here is an earlier calculation that I did. It doesn’t answer your question but it my give us an idea of how much lithium is needed if we know how much oil would be needed to do the same task (this is very convoluted but I’m too feeble minded today to do it properly).

      Energy in one milligram of lithium:

      Li(7) + H(1) > He(4) + He(4) 17.3 MeV 17,300,000 electron volts

      Li is 92.5% Li(7)

      0.000925 g/7.016 = 0.0001318 moles of Li

      6.02EE23 (Avogadro’s number, the number of atoms per mole)

      6.02EE23 x 0.0001318 = 7.94EE19 atoms of lithium

      17,300, 000 volts (per atom) x 7.94EE19 (atoms of lithium) = 1.37EE27 ev

      1 electron volt (eV) = 3.83EE-29 ton of TNT

      Therefore, 1.37EE27 ev x 3.83EE-29 = 0.052 tons of TNT

      19.2 mg of lithium would have the energy of one ton of TNT

      Oh, and using this energy and work unit converter one ton of TNT is 1162 kilowatt hours.
      http://www.unit-conversion.info/energy.html
      And as Obvious pointed out in a previous post one ton of TNT has the energy 0.71 barrels of oil. http://www.e-catworld.com/2014/02/26/lewis-larsen-of-lattice-energy-llc-on-lenr-and-transmutation/#comment-1264032831

      So, 27 milligrams of natural lithium in the above reaction would have the energy equivalent of one barrel of oil.

      I could be totally wrong. Please don’t assume I did this correctly. This should go through the peanut gallery review process.

      • Alain Samoun

        Continuing your hypothesis,with the same peanut gallery review:
        Will we have enough lithium?
        27mg Li = 1 barrel of oil
        These days, the world consumption of oil is about 34EE9 barrels a year
        34 billions barrels = 27*34EE9 mg= 918EE9mg = 918 tons of Li
        About 1,000 tons of lithium will replace the all consumption of oil energy in a year
        In 2015 the world production of lithium is estimated to be ~150,000 tons a year
        So in your hypothesis LENR will consume ~0.6% of the current production of Lithium and replace totally the production of energy from oil.

        To mitigate this result, in real life today, LENR will have to be adapted to transportation – The main use of oil.

  • pg

    Australia?

    • psi2u2

      Here is some American music I like: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCZWv5U5wJ4

      This is what we are singing in Baltimore right now.

    • Anthony Richards

      Nah – they don’t even make Holdens or Falcons any more !

  • Daniel Maris

    For outsourcing read “China” I would say.

  • Pekka Janhunen

    Western countries are based on using fossil fuels, which is unsustainable at least because at some point those fuels will run out. The nagging knowledge of this brings forth negative feelings. By the way, frankly speaking it looks to me that there are many countries nowadays where citizens are more free than in the US. Partly it’s just the size: usually big countries have deeper hierarchies and more rules than smaller countries.

  • Dave Smith

    I suspect the “for better or worse” comments have always been Rossi’s attempt at what’s known as a Safe Harbor Statement. Per Wikipedia “The Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995 provides a “safe harbor” for certain forward-looking statements. Businesses usually include a form of a disclaimer that states that any instance of a forward-looking statement found in their material is only true at the time it was written, and they further claim that they are under no obligation to update such written statements if conditions change or that unexpected occurrences happen to affect the statement afterwards. Such forward-looking statements, however, must be identifiable by the use of certain prescribed words. This act allows companies to make speculative statements based on current market trends or research directions without fear of major repercussion, while ensuring that potential investors are informed of the speculative nature of the statements.” Large companies always include this disclaimer when they release information about business prospects, and it’s Rossi’s consistent use of the “for better or worse” comment at the end of his correspondence that leads me to believe that it is his attempt at the “safe harbor” disclaimer. I believe it is essentially a reminder that the statements are still speculative in nature so that they can’t be sued for misleading potential investors.

  • Nigel Appleton

    I suggest you move away from these negative influences, and stop listening to hate-filled and angry music.
    Where I live, the grass is green, the flowers bright, the sun shines, and we are free. I see few truly miserable people and many of those few can be cheered with a little friendship and charity.
    What are YOU doing to reduce global or local misery?

  • Zack Iszard

    My guess is, coming in to the 8th and 9th months of the test, if a negative outcome is increasingly unlikely, orders will start trickling in. At this point, IH will have an idea for near-term production demand and will act accordingly. The last two months of the test, provided a negative outcome is very improbable, media attention will build in a grass-roots fashion. It will surprise me if the client stays unnamed and hidden until the test period is complete.

  • Alan DeAngelis

    It looks like Rossi has solved Earth’s energy problems. Now it’s time to start thinking about Mars. http://fusion.net/story/129464/regular-people-may-help-nasa-get-humans-to-mars/

  • Fibber McGourlick

    Good news!
    Regarding this “for better or worse” business, I’d say if it’s worked well for 3 months or so, it can quickly be made to work well forever by the world’s energized technology. The first industrial trial of the steam engine was soon followed by the age of steam.

    • Agaricus

      With any luck we may soon see the beginning of the Second Age of Steam. This time around we won’t even need to invent the technology – it’s all there, ready and waiting.

    • timycelyn

      I must say Andrea is getting a little less than convincing with the whole “…could still be negative..” thing.

      He’s being pushed over on his blog on what would (with 5-6 months of good running in the bank, at what we now belive were largely high COPs) constitute a negative outcome and his response was as follows:

      “Silvio Caggia:
      Examples:
      1- assume that today everything gets destroyed for any event, so that the plant has to be rebuilt: this would annihilate any payback possibility and make the former good results just virtual achievements, without any economic value
      2- assume that the COP today becomes less than one and we are not able to repristinate it: same as above
      3- etc ( use your fantasy)
      Conclusion: better fly down and maintain a low profile until the 350 days are performed, so that statistics will allow us to confirm a positive result. So far the result chances can be explained to you by Orsobubu and the F-Something function.
      P.S. Luckily today ( now is 08.00 a.m. of Saturday May 2nd) She is stable and well. Obviously I am inside the plant.
      Warm Regards,
      A.R.”

      Ok, I suppose it could go bang, but I assume the odds of that are very low indeed, else there is no way they would be running the trial! It now drops to lower COP – so what? They’ve already got excellent performance in the bank, so they need to change fuel at 6 months rather than 12. “Suppose we cannot reistate it?” meaning they put new fuel in and for some mysterious reason it doesn’t work….really?

      Nope, if those are the only examples of concerns he can come up with, I declare “positive but could still be negative” , as the famous phrase goes very hollow indeed. The bottom of the barrel is being scraped for examples of negative, and very little, other than oak shavings, seems to be appearing…

      I think the giveaway is in his conclusion “better to fly low”, basically let’s keep the hype down, it is of no benefit to us right now…. and on that matter I tend to agree with him.

    • Mike Henderson

      “it can quickly be made to work well forever” Really? I would expect it to take, well, forever. 😉