MFMP to Work with Francesco Piantelli in Project Fedora [Update #4: Lab Revealed]

Yesterday the Martin Fleischmann Memorial Project had been dropping hints about a Christmas present that they could share with the world, and today on their Facebook page and quantumheat.org website they have announced ‘Prjoect Fedora’ which will involve working with Italian scientist Francesco Piantelli, a pioneer in the field of nickel-hydrogen LENR research, and former collaborator with the late Sergio Focardi.

They state:

Following over two years of reach out and a concerted effort this year, the MFMP is to work with the consummate scientist Francesco Piantelli, the Father of the Ni+H New Fire to realise our primary goal.

More details to follow…

fedora

One of the significant things about the MFMP working with Piantelli is he has been awarded a patent by the European Patent Office for his LENR process, and this legal protection could encourage Piantelli to share details about his work. Piantelli does have a company called Nichenergy — but there is little information available about the company’s activities. It has been reported (unconfirmed) that Piantelli is able to achieve considerable excess heat with his process, been able to create self-sustaining LENR cells that operate for months at a time.

If this is accurate, and if Piantelli is forthcoming with details about his work, there could be a real opportunity here for the MFMP to achieve their major goal, which is to demonstrate to the world unambigious excess heat from the New Fire.

UPDATE #4 (Dec 26, 2014)

A new post on the MFMP gives some new information about Francesco Piantelli’s lab, and some of the experiments he is running. Here’s an excerpt from the post:

There were several experiments running, one that we were told had been producing increasing nominal output from decreasing input since May! We did not get a chance to test the veracity of that claim ourselves, but it sure sounded positive. If we could see incontrovertible excess in an experiment that ran that long and get that rolled out internationally – we would achieve our primary goal and the New Fire would be officially lit we thought. We shall see.

There were 3 other cells of a different type hooked up, two of which were in various stages of an experiment but not yet producing excess heat apparently. These looked like the same type of Piantelli-Focardi cells in the article cited above (http://newenergytimes.com/v2/news/2008/NET29-8dd54geg.shtml) where there are clear pictures detailed. I guess if it works – don’t fix it! It also says this of one of his experiments:

“Piantelli didn’t know how hot the experiment had gotten before he killed it because the monitor eventually blacked out. However, the metal thermocouples inside the cell melted. This told him that the temperature exceeded 1450 C.”

piantelli lab

UPDATE #3

MFMP have uploaded the first video of Project /Fedora\, which shows Mathieu Valat talking with Dr. Piantelli. Perceptive observers may be able to derive some clues from the handwritten notes they are discussing.

From YouTube: “Francesco Piantelli starts the process of direct knowledge transfer. No time wasted on irrelevancies. Respect.”

UPDATE #2

The picture below explains the name of the project:

piantelli

UPDATE #1

I have been in touch with Bob Greenyer of the MFMP and he has explained that Piantelli is anxious for them to begin work with him, and the plan is for a MFMP team to start work in Italy with him in January. Bob wrote:

We have encouraged Piantelli and NicHEnergy to release any information covered by their patents and applications in many forums over the history of the project and more directly since early in 2014 as we built this relationship that is now yielding results. It is great that they are now moving along this path as we feel it is the best way to realise value for the investors in the IP.

Licensing is key, but documentation for potential licensees is extremely important and not trivial to produce. We have learnt from our experience with Celani and Ahern that it is all too easy to miss key elements necessary to yield desirable outcomes and given the critical urgency we cannot take any chances.

It is in the interest of all parties concerned that we capture the process in as much detail as possible to maximise take up of licensing of the technology.

We could spend years testing powders and be nowhere. Project /Fedora\ will hopefully enable us to shortcut to achieving our primary goal whilst at the same time enabling NicHEnergy to realise maximum value from their IP and establish Francesco Piantellis rightful place in history as the discoverer of the Ni+H New Fire.

  • Bob Greenyer

    We’ll know if he wrote the report for sure of he publishes the commercial sources and morphology of the Ni and the LiAlH4 and the preparation and sealing approach.

    And we test it and it works as claimed.

  • Bob Greenyer

    We have given links on our site to known events. I guess when you have a meltdown like P&F and he did – as a scientist – you are interested in how to control it and how it works. He is refining his understanding using the scientific method, hypothesise, test hypothesis, rinse, repeat until he knows what makes it tick. Things that super hot or melt down get people excited just as it did these great scientist – but what does it tell us about what is going on? I think this is his approach.

    He told us of many parameters that need to all be within critical min / max limits. If you are outside of those bound on those specific parameters – there will never be excess heat – we hope to capture that for everyone – because I can’t see anyone else providing that detail any time soon.

    We have to be cogniscent that there are many applications for LENR that might not require 1400ºC. Personally i’d like smart LENR fabrics that keep me warm (not vaporised). It would be disingenuous to put all our faith in one secretive commercial enterprise when there are others, like Celani and Piantelli that have IP protection or priority and are willing to have the details captured.

    As Jed Rothwell said the other day, he fully expects patents of LENR for the next 1000 years. We are at the dawn of a new age.

  • Bernie777

    I think we have to take Piantelli very seriously, especially
    If you read his pronouncements about future research of LENR. There are many areas of research Rossi has not touched on, mainly because of resources.

  • georgehants

    From Cold Fusion Now
    Francesco Celani continues Live Open Science with Open Power Association
    We are honored to be able to announce that Prof. Francesco Celani officially will collaborate with Open Power!
    http://coldfusionnow.org/francesco-celani-continues-live-open-science-with-open-power-association/

    • Bob Greenyer

      Great news

      We met with Francesco in his home town last week – we agreed to release some very important information which we will do so as soon as possible.

      • georgehants

        Bob, look forward to that, great things happening.

        • Bob Greenyer

          It is fun being in the “just do it” department, rather than the “it can’t be done” camp.

  • Omega Z

    There is only soft evidence that Rossi sold 1 prototype to a Military entity(NRL). That Evidence is from another who had a prototype device tested by the NRL & claimed to have seen Rossi’s 1Mw prototype in their Facilities under testing. He also accused the NRL of sharing info with Rossi.

    Additional soft evidence is Rossi had an influx to his cash flow. Always a good indicator. However, the number 13 is wrong. That came from a misunderstanding in the blogs of 1 sold plus 12 additional ordered that was actually 12 including the 1 delivered. Rossi clarified that, tho most didn’t notice.

    There is no evidence soft or otherwise as to the additional 11 being delivered. In fact, it appears otherwise tho Rossi has never acknowledged anything either way. Note, Shortly after that sale, Rossi had a breakthrough on the Hot cat. I suspect this ended any further possibilities of the Military entity accepting any further deliveries.

    At the time of acceptance test, Rossi stated that the Client wanted all the QC issues(Leaks etc) addressed & a few changes. Rossi in fact built a 2nd 1Mw container & delivered it. Cheaper & quicker then a rebuild.

    The Original 1Mw container was completely refurbished & targeted for a European customer. Take note of the thread about Rossi Licenses & the discontent on that not taking place. This latest info combined with the Purchase by Industrial Heat has a correlating time line.

    Most of the E-cat story, if you had the approximate time/date stamps of certain info makes logical sense. Most of the confusion comes from speculation & some intentional misinformation on the blogs. Some clarification from Rossi at certain times would have helped, but sometimes, in business it’s best not to say anything.

    Speculating Now. The Original refurbished 1Mw Container has been completely refurbished again incorporating the Cat/Mouse Reactor Or possibly setting in an Industrial Heat warehouse And a completely new 1Mw Container incorporating all R&D advances has been built & is in the Customers processing plant.
    Maybe that Original 1Mw plant will 1 day find itself in a museum.

  • Bernie777

    These words of Piantelli in 2012 are still resonating in my head, “In order to face the problems (of LENR) it is necessary to create a large group of qualified researchers….” I am very skeptical that Rossi/IH or MFMP is the solution, it could require a much larger coordinated research group or groups by a much larger entity, with unlimited resources. Does anyone know someone like that?

    • Axil Axil

      Piantelli is doing research that others have already done. This research is current in nano optics and nanoplasmonics, Even the defense technology for stealth coating are applicable to LENR.

      • Bob Greenyer

        You are right. However, he is specifically doing the scientific method – hypothesise, test hypothesis, rinse, repeat to get a deep understanding of the mechanisms and parameter space.

    • Bob Greenyer

      We will be helping Mahadevan Srinivasan get the Indian research program re-started. I have been requested to go there in February if possible. He says money will not be a problem (for their research).

      • Bernie777

        Bob…..Please go, we need more major players researching, I would think you could make a major contribution to their efforts. Is there anything holding you back?

        • Bob Greenyer

          Project /Fedora in first weeks of January and []=Project Dog Bone=[] end January/Early Feb (after we get key assets).

          The meeting in Bangalore is not until mid Feb – we should have quite a bit by then hopefully to get them motivated.

          • bachcole

            Bob, will the developments in Russia have any impact on your plans?

            • Bob Greenyer

              We have been planning to ad Lithium Hydrides to our experiments since April.

              After the sparky cell has a few days with sparks (should start today) we will add LiAlH4 to the Ahern Powder. This is because the arc will allow parts of this reactor to hit and exceed 1400ºC.

              The plan was to add LiH and MgH2 to the powder cell as the experiment plan was to test the Ikegami theory for how the E-Cat (Not Hot-Cat) works – this cell will not be able to reach the Hot Cat temperatures in whole or in part but is an incredible calorimeter needing just 5W to get to 500ºC.

              There are already questions being raised about the Russian test, so lets see where the dust settles. Our phase 1 []=Project Dog Bone=[] will further challenge the methods used in Lugano, but as you may know – we have already some SiC elements on the way that will be able to run for a very long time at 1400ºC – these and all the other key components should arrive by the end of the third week in January.

              By end Jan, Early Feb, we’ll have a lot to share, some on-going live experiments and live streamed []=Project Dog Bone=[] experiments.

              We are very happy about the development in Russia.

              • Bernie777

                Sounds like you have your plate full, but maybe reach out to the Russian physicist for possible exchange of info?

                • Bob Greenyer

                  We are already on the case.

      • Gerard McEk

        Great Bob! I hope you can put them straight on the right track and that they will do science as openly as MFMP is doing.

  • Warthog

    The standard pathological skeptic propaganda…..any and all cold fusion phenomena are due to “measurement errors”. Have you ever actually READ any of the experimental reports in order to make such a comment, or are you just mouthing stuff you’ve heard on skeptic sites??

  • Oceans2014

    great to see the donations coming in, one guy ponied up 2.500, Piantellis signed home made bottles of 1989 vintage Chianti will be selling for much more than that once they achieve their goal.

  • Bob Greenyer

    New major update, with a photo of part of his secret lab taken earlier this week.

    Project /Fedora

    http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/en/home/mfmp-blog/434-project-fedora

    https://www.facebook.com/MartinFleischmannMemorialProject

    • http://magicmusicandmore.com/ Barry

      Bob,with my beloved wood stove I’m in no hurry for a CF furnace. What I long for is sustainable, repeatable science. If MFMP can spearhead this, the rest will follow. If you can achieve this (with the help of Piantelli and Celani) before a product to market, in my book you will be the first horse to cross the finish line.

  • Axil Axil

    Could Piantelli be retaliating against the bad treatment that Rossi and his agents have been heaping onto his efforts over all these many years?

    Rossi has been trying to invalidate Piantelli’s patents to clear the way for their own Ni-H intellectual property claims.

    With the help of MFMP, Piantelli could be producing a poison pill against Rossi and the other Ni-H developers. Its either Piantelli’s patent claims or nothing. This move will blunt the motivation for Rossi to undermine Piantelli’s patent claims.

    The way that the patent laws currently stands led by changes in recent US patent law, any bit of technology that is inseminated publicly cannot be included in a subsequent patent. When MFMP demonstrates Ni-H technology it becomes public open source property, that technology cannot be patented by Rossi or anybody else.

    I am almost positive that orthodox science will never except LENR because it is antithetical to the current posits of science. Piantelli is too good a scientist and business man not to know that. So a demonstration of Piantelli’s system has no scientific value.

    • http://magicmusicandmore.com/ Barry

      Orthodox science can be forced to except the truth with repeatable science. If they remain flat-earthers after that, they will no longer be orthodox.

    • Omega Z

      Most are aware that Focardi worked with Piantelli, But “WE” should take note that Piantelli had hit an impasse & had stopped his work prior to Focardi working with Rossi. There was a time lapse between these developments. Also, Focardi was originally brought in by Rossi to disprove his results of which Focardi actually confirmed Rossi’s results.

      But I agree, there is some antagonism here from both parties..
      As to Piantelli, I don’t think his claim is as appears or he would already have investors quickly helping to bring it to market. He wouldn’t be joining with MFMP. He has issues to resolve…

      For Clarity, I do believe Piantelli has excess heat & possibly long run periods. I don’t believe it is a marketable product. As with many others in this field, he is missing the crucial ingredient. Piantelli has a patent, but note according to the Patent office, this is no guarantee that something works.

      You now have Celani, Ahern, Piantelli among a few others working in collaboration with MFMP. When ones competition joins against you, It’s usually a good indicator that you are ahead & they know it. They have personal insights that we don’t & travel within circles where they likely hear things that we don’t. Note also that Rossi has stated on at least 3 occasions that Brian Ahern is on the right track.

      It is sad that things did not play out differently. Piantelli has a patent & no marketable product. Rossi has No patent aside from the Italian patent & A marketable product. I’m sure most of those here would be content with some type of collaboration/partnering of the 2.

      I have no doubt that the DGT experience caused serious trust issues for Rossi. Those who disagree with this should research it. DGT stated outright that they stole Rossi’s IP or as it appears they attempted to, but missed the secret sauce. Note DGT only existed(was created) in the 1st place as a marketing partner for the E-cat. They had no technology of their own.

      As to the MFMP collaboration, I hope they use caution. I don’t think most people realize that the more open source this becomes, the longer it may take for LENR to be brought to market. Good intentions don’t always turn out well.

      Obviously, Some information needs to be shared to encourage & speed up advancement & this benefits “ALL” involved, but to much shared information makes it near impossible to file for IP.

      Without IP, the 100’s of billion$ in manufacturing technology & facilities costs will not be invested. It would be ironic if we end up with a highly viable technology that we had to wait another 25 years for Industry to develop a patentable technique that they would market.

      • Axil Axil

        The difference between these various systems is the secret sauce. A system without it is a poor performer. MFMP has all the info they need to produce a great system. A picture of Rossi’s micron sized nickel powder and the aluminum lithium hydride is all that it takes.

        • Omega Z

          “The difference between these various systems is the secret sauce.

          Axil Axil, I completely agree as I posted “he is missing the crucial ingredient”
          “the secret sauce”.
          This is what separates Rossi from the rest.

      • Bob Greenyer

        With respect, India produces vast amounts of generic drugs (out of IP protection) that are used the world over and continually builds infrastructure to manufacture them.

        Companies are making billions from Android phones and none of them own the OS.

        No one owns linux, or the IP to the ICE.

        India has a desperate need for non – HC energy as 70% plus has to be imported and this crushes their balance of payments. They are also at a tipping point for fresh water, for farming and drinking – to deal with that they will need vast amounts of energy. Make no mistake, India will not avoid making New Fire reactors just because their is a debate on IP and even if their is patent protection, they’ll use laws they already have to compulsory licence it because of its strategic importance.

        China will likely do the same. Right now, we need more EGO OUT – too many people have died already and they environment’s flaura and fauna have suffered enough.

        There are thousand of patents being filed every year on battery and semiconductor technology – as Jed Rothwell said yesterday – he expects patents in LENR for the next 1000 years.

  • Robyn Wyrick

    I just read over a nice history of the discovery of Nuclear Fission:

    In 1896 Henri Becquerel found that pitchblende caused a photographic plate to darken. He showed that this was due to beta radiation and alpha particles (then Villard found gamma rays)

    Then in 1902 Ernest Rutherford showed that natural radioactivity emitted an alpha or beta particle from the nucleus and created a different element (fission).

    30 years later, in 1932 Cockcroft and Walton produced nuclear transformations by bombarding atoms with accelerated protons.

    In 1938 Otto Hahn and Fritz Strassmann proved that atomic fission had occurred.

    In 1939 Bohr said that fission more likely in uranium-235 than in U-238. That year Francis Perrin introduced the concept of the critical mass required to produce a sustained chain reaction.

    The first nuclear reactor to produce electricity (a trivial amount) was built in 1951.

    And this was with all the urgency and might of the great military and scientific powers of the world.

    Personally, I think the story about Cold Fusion fits rather well – and has transpired fairly quickly.

    • bachcole

      Also, nuclear fission had some very dramatic proofs that it was real, and yet it still took 13 years to get any electricity out of it. Cold fusion does not and hopefully will never get that kind of dramatic proof.

    • Allan Kiik

      “In 1938 Otto Hahn and Fritz Strassmann proved that atomic fission had occurred.”

      By some other sources this was actually proved by Lise Meitner, Hahn took the glory after frau Meitner had to flee the Germany because she happened to be a jewish.

  • Axil Axil

    http://lenr-canr.org/acrobat/FocardiSevidenceof.pdf

    Evidence of electromagnetic radiation from Ni-H Systems

    Piantelli’s theory of LENR does not explain why gamma radiation is a sometimes thing in the Ni-H system.

    In the referenced experiment above, a cold system will produce gammas but a hotter(more vigorous system) does not produce gammas. The ultimate theory of LENR causation must explain this case.

    • Bob Greenyer

      He has an explanation for that now. We will get clarity and share as we can.

  • http://magicmusicandmore.com/ Barry

    It’s good to see Cold Fusion old working with Cold Fusion young.

  • Axil Axil

    In the video, Piantelli is explaining his theory of the LENR reaction. Piantelli believes that a negative hydrogen ion forms and closely orbits the nickel nucleus,

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrogen_ion

    This ion is called a Protide: 1H−

    The Protide is far heavier than the electron so its orbit will be very close to the nucleus. This negative ion will catalyze fusion in the same way that a muon does. That is through negative charge shielding of the nuclear positive charge via a strong negative charge orbiting close to the nucleus.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Muon-catalyzed_fusion

  • Fortyniner

    If you had a working cold fusion reactor Andy, would you feel an overwhelming need to prove it to me – someone you don’t know, and who has nothing to offer you?

    Or would you decide on how best to make a very large pile of money from your IP, and get on with that without bothering to tell me or anyone outside your circle about it?

    I am repeatedly puzzled by skeptics and even some ‘supporters’ who seem to think that they are entitled to proof that someone else’s private research has been successful.

    • Sanjeev

      I agree, the so called skeptics always feel as if the world revolves around them. They want every inventor they are skeptical of to bow to them. Strangely they bow to the dogma without a single question.

      • Fortyniner

        I’m never quite sure whether (in the case of ‘skeptics’) this kind of thing is the result of simple arrogance combined with naivety about the commercial world, or a deliberate attack using false (a priori) logic: “If A is true, then B must follow (unsupported assertion), so if B is not the case, then A must be untrue (false conclusion presented as fact)”.

        • Sanjeev

          I don’t think pathoskeptics have any idea what logic is. They do use this kind of logical appearing arguments to show how smart they are. Usually the gullible, brain washed people fall for it. This achieves their goal, which is to bias the public opinion against the new discovery and to feel good and secured because now their beliefs are “protected”. It gives some assurance when majority believe the same as they do. So they try to manipulate majority opinions. They usually have no interest in getting up and doing their own research, which shows that its not their main interest to know the truth, actually they are afraid of the truth.

          To this fear, add some inferiority complex, desire to appear important and a bit of jealously, and you have an ideal pathoskep here.

          Logic works only when the information is complete and sufficient. In case of uncertainty it fails. A true skeptic will remain agnostic when the available information on a subject is incomplete.

          • georgehants

            Sanjeev, morning, re your last sentence, logic works just as well when the “information is incomplete”, logically the answer becomes, we do not have enough information, we do not know.
            These are words that most arrogant incompetent scientists are literally unable, in most cases to utter.
            Science knows virtually nothing about anything but struts around making out it has all the answers on everything, comical and dangerous.

    • robyn wyrick

      Sweet. [bump]

  • Wayne M.

    This sounds like déjà vu all over again. Celani and Ahern were both announced with fanfare when they associated themselves with MFMP. There was similar talk about how this association was going to move the project forward. Still waiting.

    Now we have Piantelli. A scientist who reportedly has the inside knowledge about how to build an Ecat and keep it running with a material COP. A scientist who believes the most important aspect of validating research is making the experiment reproducible. So the MFMP is going to learn the reproducible ‘secret sauce’ from Piantelli and move the project to fruition. Really?

    As a believer that LENR is real, even I see this question begging to be asked:

    Why hasn’t Piantelli already done it?

    Why does Piantelli need MFMP? He shouldn’t if he has a reproducible, high COP, sustainable LENR reactor. I.H. would have purchased Piantelli device instead of Rossi. Piantelli probably has another incomplete, intermittent, unstable, and low COP technology. We have seen this over and over. First the hype, then the wait, then still waiting.

    Hope springs eternal.

    • bachcole

      You do not need to feel alone. If Piantelli had something, we would already have known about it. He knows more than I do, but less than Rossi, otherwise he would be demonstrating some serious and long term heat.

      • Bob Greenyer

        The plan is to work through the process from first principles to unquestionable excess. He says he can deliver that and the output will be long term. We have not personally seen anything that fits that spec to date and it would meet our primary goal.

        When given the right information, we are able to pool our talents and message what we see in a way that has not readily been achieved in the space.

    • Bob Greenyer

      There are live experiments running right now for

      1. Ahern Powder and Stoyan Sarg in the Sparky cell in US

      https://www.evernote.com/pub/marpooties/sparkypowdercalorimeter#st=p&n=9528bab5-1e6d-4679-b0ed-527dfabe7597

      2. Higgins powder in the US

      https://www.evernote.com/pub/marpooties/powdercalorimeter#st=p&n=6a8108a9-cca5-4c53-a881-2da9d1f2aa61

      Celani wire dual cell was re-started last week into this week in France, but we had to go to Italy, where we also met Francesco Celani, Mathieu needs to swap out the heater wire in the cell – it has been a long haul to get everything set up for the Gamma experiments there.

      You can follow these experiments, as always, LIVE here:

      http://data.hugnetlab.com/

      Piantelli says he does repeatable excess heat, he is focussed on the technology, control, longevity and how it works – Hypothesis and test.

      We do need to make it very much more easy to let people follow the work we are doing openly. We have not got millions and we are volunteers. It took well over 2 years to meet Piantelli, it is not ideal, but we are doing something.

  • Oceans2014

    Piantelli clearly understands the mechanism of the reaction, scaling up from the relatively low power levels previously reported to 5 kW – http://cold-fusion.ca/metalenergy-to-raise-funds-for-piantelli-384000
    >> a 5 KW – Solar – system would cost about 7-10K > great home units !

  • Kevin O

    Science advances one funeral at a time. In this case it is the foreseeable funeral of Piantelli that finally nudged him to divulge his secrets rather than bring them to the grave with him.

    • Daniel Maris

      That thought occurred to me.

      • Henk

        Actually this can be seen as yet another proof that Rossi has the real thing.
        Piantelli is getting old and weak and he wants to put his name on the LENR hall of fame before it is to late.

    • Sanjeev

      Unlike Dennis Cravens, who decided to take his findings to his grave in spite of being covered by a granted US patent. He refused to collaborate with MFMP.
      http://www.e-catworld.com/2013/09/19/dennis-cravens-reports-on-ni-week-cold-fusion-demo/
      All kinds of people in the world…

  • Steve H

    MFMP’s goal would be better served if it could concentrate on a recipe for creating a hot-water boiler. I am sure Potterton, Baxi and Worcester-Bosch would be interested in their findings.
    The rest of us do not care whether University’s are interested in this technology or not!

    • Zeddicus Zul Zorander

      That could be a secondary goal. Primary goal must be how to create sustained, repeatable and high excess energy.

  • Steve H

    Bill Gates is no mug – if he wants to help the rest of humanity, he will.
    The vehicle he chooses is up to him!

    • Steve H

      Should have been added as a response to georgehants, below – whom I have the greatest admiration, for his direct way and tenacity.

  • georgehants

    If Mr. Gates wishes to help the World a small donation to these people may be a very good idea.

    • bachcole

      Bill Gates has sponsored lots of good causes (and a few I didn’t think were so good). One of my favorite is Khan Academy. Gates’ philanthropy is MUCH more nimble and focused than the philanthropy of the mega-rich in the past. In fact, I would have to say that the philanthropy of the mega-rich in the past was like the dancing of dinosaurs in a very large glass jar shop compared with Bill Gates. This may be because of the power of the Internet; it may also be because Bill Gates is a much better philanthropist than the usual mega-rich.

      Anyway, to get to my point, I would not be the slightest bit surprised if Mr. Gates did give a donation to MFMP/Piantelli. It might be a good idea if someone like georgehants or Roger Bird or any number of other people were to suggest to Mr. Gates that he look closely at MFMP; and it would help if Mr. Gates were to know that we have NO financial or personal interest in MFMP. Perhaps we could even get a petition started here at e-catworld.com telling Mr. Gates what we think about the matter.

      • http://www.drboblog.com Doctor Bob

        JWOW!!
        Ask Bill Gates to donate money to MFMP….
        Thats a great idea. I cant believe no one thought about that years ago.

        After making the petition you could contact Darryl and Sheila on Bain Bridge island and ask them to bring it over to Bill’s house.

        http://www.drboblog.com/db-the-haunted-science-report/

        What other options do we have?

        • bachcole

          I suspect that Doctor Bob is being sarcastic, the worst kind of sarcasm, which is that of making fun of the ignorant.

          • http://www.drboblog.com Doctor Bob

            What about, instead of making a petition, writing a recommendation?

            We could ask various knowledgeable, labs and companies, working on Cold Fusion, to sign of?

            Frank could post the recommendation here on E-catworld – then we could ask my friends if they would consider driving over as well to deliver at Bills House?

      • mytakeis

        It would indeed be a boon if Mr Gates’ world view included free energy for all peoples, and hence the new paradigm of ‘enlightened’ humanity.

  • Steve H

    Stroll-on true, open information.
    Most of the practical people in the world will be able
    to deduce the rest.

  • LuFong

    Great news, not only for LENR, but for open science as well. If you read Mast Lewan’s book An Impossible Invention Piantelli speaks of the importance of reproducibility in order for science AND commercial ventures to proceed. So this step by Piantelli is not surprising. With MFMP’s effort and Piantelli’s contributions hopefully this end can be achieved.

  • Axil Axil

    I was just reading that Dr. G Miley has produced considerable over unity heat after 4 hours, but his nanopowder deteriorates in short order due to sintering.

    http://www.lenr-coldfusion.com/2012/09/21/george-miley-working-3kw-30kw-lenr-designs/

    “Results were shown where the energy gain (LENR/chemical) started at about 7 after a few minutes, but increased another order of magnitude over four hours. Longer runs had problems due to deterioration of the nanoparticles, attributed to sintering.”

    This deterioration of nanopowder can always be expected whenever a static nanopowder is used in the LENR process.

    I wonder if Piantelli has the same problems with his nanopowder. Rossi avoids this problem by continually rebuilding his nanopowder after each input power pulse. This is the function of the “secret sauce”. I call this nanopowder renewal process “dynamic nuclear active environment” (NAE) formation.

    The “secret sauce” is an alkali metal like lithium or potassium: an element with a low vaporization point that first vaporizes and then re-condenses into Rydberg matter after each input heat pulse. These nanoparticles will eventually sinter but will always be renewed to provide a constant resupply of fresh nanopowder in a dynamic process.

    The function of the micro-sized nickel micropowder is to generate a Bose Einstein condensate which produces a superfluid condition that also protects nanostructures from sintering.

    • Gerard McEk

      What is the mechanism that renews the nanopowder, Axil Axil? Would it be the high current pulses Rossi uses?

      • Axil Axil

        It is simply heat. Rossi’s primary heater produces a temperature great enough to vaporized the alkali metal. As the vapor moves away from the heat source, the alkali metal will produce nanoparticles through condensation. Then there is an aggregation process produced by electrostatic attraction that combines many nanoparticles into a larger composite microstructure. The points of contact of the nanoparticles in this aggregation are the places where the LENR reaction occurs.

        • Eyedoc

          Axil,
          You appear, IMHO, to have one of the best understandings of what seems to be occurring in LENR. That being said, do you have any favorite from among the many theories out there ?

          • Axil Axil

            Please see the following links
            for my own nanoplasmonic theory of the Ni/H reactor. Nanoplasmonic
            was invented back in 1974 by Martin Fleischmann.

            http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com/2014/08/lenr-and-nanoplasmonics.html

            http://egooutpeters.blogspot.com/2014/08/fundamental-causation-mechanisms-of-lenr.html

            This theory is holding up well
            with regards to additional exploration of particle physics and the
            standard model. It looks like this theory of LENR contradicts the
            unification of the four fundamental forces as postulated by the
            standard model because it speaks against the existence of
            supersystematic particles, a requirement for the unification of
            fundamental forces under the standard model. It looks like
            unification of forces happens at low energy levels in LENR.

        • Gerard McEk

          You seem to describe a sputtering process, although I am not sure where you think the electrostatic force comes from, because no electrostatic field was used, as far as I know. I have always thought that you could build a perfect LENR environmet by sputtering a surface with Ni and other required elemens. A question remains that the proces you describe seems to require a narrow band operating temperature where it works perfectly. The Lugano test described that it worked perfectly at both 1200 and 1400 degrees. Does that cope with your theory, Axil?

          • Axil Axil

            The electrostatic force comes from resonant dipole motion on the surface of the nanoparticles where one side of the particle is polarize positive and the other opposite side is polarized negative.

            It sounds to me like Dr. G Miley uses vapor disposition to build his nanoparticles. And Piantelli has used vapor disposition to treat the surface of his nickel bars to roughen their surfaces. Mizuno uses an electric arc to roughen the surface of his electrodes. Celanti uses an acid treatment to roughen his wire electrode. The rough surface produced uses Anderson localization to confine electron flow into solitons around topological defects on the surface of the nickel.
            In palladium hydrogen loading, the surface is roughened by crack formation on the surface of the metal.

            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anderson_localization

            Rossi needs to run his reactor in a narrow temperature band to keep control of it. DGT uses a periodic arc discharge to pump the SPPs. This is a way they found to keep good control of the heat output without meltdown.

            The theory is compatible with all these modes of engineering a Ni/H and Pd/D system.
            By the way, I don’t think that Piantelli;s theory for LENR is valid because it violates a few conservation laws.

            • Gerard McEk

              Thanks for your replies, Axil.
              These eloctrostatic forces you mention only work on nano-scale. Is that enough to attract these particles?
              I have read the explanation of your theory the EgoOut, interesting! Did you also underpin it theoretically completely?
              Last question: Do surface plasmons only exist at the surface or also along the micro cacks surface inside the metal? I ask this because of the one cm cube palladium incident of MF/SP, which melted into the lab floor. Obviously the whole cube went into self sustaining meltdown, not only its surface.

              • Axil Axil

                The electrostatic attraction of microparticles even occurs in stellar nebula in the first stages of star condensation. This dust condensation occurs before gravity gains strength to further the condensation.

                http://www.geol.umd.edu/~jmerck/geol100/lectures/02.html

                The LENR reaction occurs in the cold plasma that surrounds the nickel, or in general a transition metal. During a meltdown, the nickel can vaporize but the reaction still goes on. The reaction is only as rich and vigorous as the vapor that supports it.

                Taking things a step further, here is what I believe happened during the F&P meltdown.

                The palladium melted. Therefore, the temperature reached at least 1554C. Even more impressive, part of the palladium cube vaporized. The temperature reached more than 3000C. In addition, a hole was excavated in the concrete floor. The sand in the concrete must have been vaporized. That means that the silicon vaporized at a temperature of 3265C. This vaporization temperature is greater than the melting point(1554C) of palladium and the vaporization point of palladium(3000C). Since only a part of the palladium(1CC) was vaporized, this tells me that the reaction was carried primarily in the silicon vapor within the concrete since most of the mass loss was in the concrete. Also, the iron rebar was vaporized at 2862C. The palladium cube arrived at a position somewhere inside the concrete crater where the temperature was relatively cool to keep from totally vaporizing under the heat produced by the silicon plasma.

                The reaction started on the surface of the palladium cube after a long period of surface pitting was generated by long term low level electric arcing. Mizuno uses electric arcing to prepare his LENR active surfaces. Over the months, the surface of the palladium cube reached a critical level of LENR surface preparation to carry a LENR reaction to a point were a positive nuclear feedback loop took hold producing a plasma where the reaction became self sustaining and than gainful.

                The plasma carried by the palladium cube eventually burned through the lab table(Melamine?) and hit the floor. The reaction then transferred to the silicon in the concrete where it formed nano-particles when the silicon plasma cooled. These nano-particles carried the LENR reaction. The hydrogen loaded in the palladium was long gone after the palladium melted and partially vaporized and could not have been the energy source for the reaction during the final high temperature phase of the meltdown event when the concrete began to burn and vaporize.

                Oxygen is another dielectric gas(dc = .85) that can support SPP formation.

  • Sanjeev

    The granted patent link is here :
    http://www.e-catworld.com/2013/01/18/european-patent-granted-for-francesco-piantellis-lenr-process/

    A process similar to Hydrino is described. Details of preparation of Ni nanostructure and loading of H2. But no mention of catalyst.

    • Sanjeev

      Its notable that this patent is very important because Rossi had filed an opposition for complete revocation of it. The battle is still on.

  • Oceans2014

    in the video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nn8csJPIMCs from what I understand in Italian, he is saying THIS IS VERY IMPORTANT – Dr Piantelli is pointing out. THIS MAY BE A TIPPING POINT for Cold Fusion.

  • Private Citizen

    If Piantelli does have working cells, it should be a slam dunk to supply same to MFMP for immediate caloromic testing. Would only be a matter of days before we had open source proof of LENR.

    No need to independently develop the tech, just test to the point that chemical energy is impossible.

    • Daniel Maris

      Well quite. And the reverse applies…if we don’t get that confirmation in double quick time, then it will be a crushing blow to the LENR movement! I’m optimistic BTW.

    • Sanjeev

      They do not have any working devices, from whatever little public info is available.

      http://cold-fusion.ca/metalenergy-to-raise-funds-for-piantelli-384000

      This says that Nichenergy reactors can reach 7KW. It should be an easy job for MFMP if this is the case.

    • Mr. Moho

      There are a few more details in one of the latest updates on quantumheat.org:

      http://www.quantumheat.org/index.php/en/home/mfmp-blog/434-project-fedora

      Mathieu Valat and Bob Greenyer had an amazing and enlightening time
      with Francesco Piantelli over the past week, a meeting we have tried to
      secure for over two years and been in active discussions about for many
      months.

      He shared unbelievable amounts of detail, insight into many of the
      key events in the story of his Ni+H discovery with incredible
      granularity and of the process itself. It was 3 hours in each of two
      days where he just talked and talked with a clarity that all who might
      reach 81 would aspire to retain (indeed, far clearer than many would
      hope for in their prime). This man knows his stuff.

      Because we are not-for-profit and non-governmental, at his request,
      we have agreed to run live experiments from his lab as soon as possible
      as his health is failing fast we feel it is imperative that we do this
      now. He asked us to come and work with him – and we believe this is the
      fastest way to demonstrate the reality of LENR. We have begged our
      wives, working things with our businesses and employers to make
      ourselves available.

      He says he will be able to deliver repeatable experiments that will
      produce clear excess heat which would meet the MFMPs primary goal – and
      we can document the process.

      We are aiming to start 2nd week in January.

      We do not have time to put a Kickstarter together and get it approved
      before the work must begin in order to raise funds, but there is an
      amazing reward that we have negotiated from Piantelli to help us.
      This will be revealed very soon – and it is not what you expect!

  • Gerard McEk

    Well, it is great MFMP starts another adventure, but until now I did not see any (interesting?) conclusion about their previous projects, at least not on this site. I assume if they have something we readers and bloggers of ECW would be informed, or did I miss something? What were the conclusions of the hot cat fuel free tests for instance?

    • http://www.lenr-forum.com/forum/ barty

      As I understand, they are waiting for the ordered infrared thermo-camera.

      • Mr. Moho

        Also, it’s the HUG team in Minnesota (Ryan Hunt et al.) which is doing Dog Bone dummy tests. I doubt they’re going to be directly involved with Piantelli; Europe-based MFMP members likely are.

      • Bob Greenyer

        You are right – The whole Phase 1 (thermal assessment verification of Lugano test) of []=Project Dog Bone=[] revolves around having an Optris PI160 calibrated to 1500ºC – and, as we found out, these are VERY hard to get, this is not like ordering an compact digital from best buy.

        We will not have it until the last week in January – we should also have he Williamson IR spot Pyrometer by then. We are set for doing that in US end Jan as planned.

        • mytakeis

          trivial but ….. []=Project Dog Bone=[] ….. very nice pictogram!

    • ecatworld

      Bob Greenyer told me today that the dog bone tests are still going to go ahead in the USA in January when all the needed equipment will be in place.

    • Ged

      So far, the conclusion of the one live run of the dogbone was summed up on the e-catworld page; but briefly:

      1) 900 watt input isn’t remotely enough to yield 1400C external temps, confirming that aspect of the report. By the time the team pushed in 1200 watts into the device to get near 1k C external, their heating elements and thermal couples physically failed – showing trying to push the external to 1400C by direct power input is Very, very difficult, and could never be done with inconel wires.

      2) with celani experiments, they saw upwards of 12-14% excess heat. But that was with tubes suspected to have lithium in their wall materials, while experiments that had no lithium showed no excess heat.

      That’s all I know so far.

      • Gerard McEk

        In my view they should write conclusions, when they publish someting and not leave it to the imagination of the readers. A conclusion can also be that nothing can be concluded because of … whatever. They do a test and they can at least say that it was in accordance with what they expected or not and if in accordance, than the conclusion is:….; if not than they may conclude that there is a problem with an accuracy or they have a wrong instrument or something.

    • Sanjeev

      I guess you missed everything, because even the tiniest developments are being posted on ECW, FB and quantumheat websites.

    • Mats002

      I agree it is not easy to find a sum up of MFMP outcomes. They seems to want the audience make there own conclusions of the data and facts they produce. The audience must then be very skilled in many subjects.

      Bob Greenyer about the Celani wire replication at Vessy’s blog http://www.ecat-thenewfire.com/blog/ :

      “Our target was to replicate the claims of excess heat made by Francesco Celani at National Instruments Week, USA, and ICCF-17, Korea, both in 2012. It was a truly courageous thing of Francesco to release his part explored work. The target was to seek truth. We found excess heat signals of up to 12.5%, but that was below Celani’s findings which was disappointing. We later discovered oversight and other aspects of Celani’s original experiment that retrospectively adjusted his output to be in line with our own, which was satisfying”,

      Not only did MFMP replicate Celani but also corrected him. MFMP have proven to have all the different skills needed to do advanced calirometry, engineering, mathematics, instrumentation, etc involved.

      Now MFMP have earned the trust to take on Piantelli. Very encouraging
      !

  • http://www.lenr-forum.com/forum/ barty

    Direct knowledge transfer and no blabla! That’s the real news! Maybe this makes pressure to Rossi and IH. Competition is good for business!

  • Oceans2014

    Super news on Christmas day, looking forward to licencing a Piantellis coldfusion system in 2015!

  • http://magicmusicandmore.com/ Barry

    Great news to receive on Christmas Day. I’ve always had deep admiration for Piantelli. Perhaps others will pool their knowledge and collectively work on this long awaited technology. Good work MFMP.

  • Mr. Moho

    The update to this blogpost is amazing… although I’m wondering if impending health issues are mainly what prompted Piantelli to go move along with this collaboration and even offer to help out MFMP members in person in his own lab in Italy to enable them achieving their goal.

    • http://www.lenr-forum.com/forum/ barty

      Maybe. If he’s of an older generation, he propably wants to see his invention to be in usage. So for him it makes sense to initiate positive results at MFMP. Then information will spread, and he has the patents for it 😉

      • Mr. Moho

        Older generation indeed, as you may see in the photo added to the latest blog update above. While I was searching for information about him on the ‘net, I came across out this old magazine scan and found out that he’s one year younger than the late Focardi:

        http://www.radiocittadelcapo.it/wp-content/uploads/sette-fusionefredda.pdf

        • http://www.lenr-forum.com/forum/ barty

          Uhh okay, he realy looks infirm. Maybe he wants to see Cold fusion running in his life time.

          • Oceans2014

            Francesco Piantellis looks like one classy guy who as enjoyed life and all it has offered, now he can fulfill his life’s dream.

  • Curbina

    This is certainly good news. Is so good that the MFMP came to be.