Passerini: E-Cat Test Completed, Results ‘Remarkable’ [Update: Rossi Comments]

Thanks to Mr. Moho for finding this comment from Italian Blogger Daniele Passerini who posted the following message on his site.

Sources that I used to draw are now depleted, new sources (Italian, Bolognese but not) tell me that the report is completed and the performance certificate cat Rossi is remarkable!

Here’s the link to the comment itself — original in Italian:

Reading Mats Lewan’s book we learn that Passerini is a close friend of Giuseppe Levi, who was involved in last year’s test — but Passerini specifically states here that he has new sources for this piece of information and not anyone from Bologna, which is where Levi works. So maybe Levi isn’t involved this time.

Anyway, it’s interesting to get a scrap of information at least!


Andrea Rossi just posted the following response to this comment on the Journal of Nuclear Physics:

“To the Readers:
I have been informed that around some blogs there are “rumors”, “whispers”, “innuendos”, “voices” et similia about the results of the long term experiment made by the Third Indipendent Party. I can guarantee that these noises are just certified stupidities. I myself do not know what is in the data collected by the Professors, and they did not give me a bit of such data. They have retrieved the hard disks to avoid any possible manipulation and demanded that everybody who attended the test had to sign a very strict NDA about the fact that no bit of information can be given to anybody before the publication of the report. Such report will be made indipendently from the results, which could be positive or negative. As a consequence of this, any noise made by “rumors, whispers, voices” and acustics of various kind, coming from “Italian” or whatsoever source,are nothing but useless air displacement operated by idle tongues.
The results will be given first to me 3 days before the publication to give us the time to organize a defense in case of negative output, then they will be published so that everybody interested will have them.
Warm Regards,

  • mike

    in a century a few of them will still be showing formulas proving it is impossible. lol While a guy on a pc powered by this technology, will be looking at the formula.

  • Bazza

    Any updates on this report? Has it been released?

  • friendlyprogrammer

    I will copy/Paste a previous comment to show a little of the common sense things I have seen in favor of the Ecat.

    – Andrea Rossi was very rich before worth $30 million USD. He did
    not run to hawaii (his Visa handed to him by The President of the United
    States), he continued environmental science. If his only concern was
    money he could have retired rich in his 30’s.

    – When Italys mafia
    took his waste management business by making his storage illegal
    (Apparently “The Mafia” reaches as far as Italy (who knew?), and they
    apparently like to control waste management in many countries) Andrea
    Rossi faced and beat all his Environment charges, when he could have hid
    in the U.S.A. (remember the VISA the President Carter gave him.).

    – All of Andrea Rossi science is common theme of environmental science.

    Many scam corporations think to raise money (scam) by selling shares.
    This scam was common with mining companies. Tell everyone you found a
    rich vein then sell shares then pay yourself a million in salary and go
    broke. Andrea Rossi has not sold or tried to sell any shares in
    Leonardo corporation. This would be easiest scam opportunity.

    – Andrea Rossi is immigrating to the US where anti fraud laws are extremely tough.

    – Andrea Rossi funded the first 5 years of this from his own pocket including hiring Focardi.

    Scammers have a history of using other peoples money for scams, and Andrea Rossi has used his own.

    Andrea Rossi made the Nickel/Hydrogen version of LENR popular in 2011,
    we have seen many unrelated labs confirm this is indeed possible and
    very effective. So he is on the right track according to many.

    separate and unrelated entities all claim THEY have a working LENR
    device. Why would so many reputable corporations claim this? Toyota,
    NASA, Brillouin, George Miley, Patterson cell, Honda, Mitsubishi, Peter
    Hagelstein, Celani, MFMP, Defkalion, The Athanor creators. That is a
    dozen just off the top of my head that does not include the ecat device.

    He seems to be logically progressing. His best demo was 18 hours on an
    unstable product and Defkalion bailed on him because he could not do a
    48 hour run, but now he is running (confirmed) at much higher
    temperatuires for longer. If this was fake why did he not fake a 48
    hour run with Defkalion or when he was demonstrating in 2011. Are
    skeptics suggesting he has advanced his fakery in this time?

    – He has demonstrated publicly in front of many skeptics and geniuses many times during 2011.

    He did allow this recent team to evaluate the ecats with very
    impressive results, and DC input has also been ruled out. We must
    EITHER think there is criminal conspiracy among very impressive
    verifying team of scholars with reputations at stake, or accept the
    reality of the ecat.

    – Andrea Rossi did publish a paper on this
    (see his website) in 2010 but it was basically ignored, and all patents
    for anything suggestive of Cold Fusion have been banned. How would a
    normal person proceed?

    -He cannot get patents on this because of
    ban , but also has secret catalyst that is his advantage in market. How
    would anyone protect it?

    Look at the Zawodny videos on the NASA website.

    Rossi has never been poor. He could have gone to Margaritaville 20 years ago if he wanted to.

    Forbes Magazine Mark gibbs says,”This is not, of course, the last word
    or even one anywhere near the end of this story but unless this is one
    of the most elaborate hoaxes in scientific history it looks like the
    world may well be about to change.”

    Andrea Rossi has always been an achiever. As a teen he held the world record for distance running for two years in a row.
    here did not know Andrea Rossi was a world champion runner for 2
    consecutive years in a competition that required perseverance (24 hour

    He is likely imho to go down in history as one of the men responsible for clean energy and will save millions of lives.

    I say we go easy on the guy. He has ALWAYS done what he said he would do. I think he is very, very, very, credible.”

    I could likely expand that into several chapters of other things I know and discuss his biofuel patent income, and his frequent DOD contracts, but the points are made.

    Rossi did not hide in America from his accusers in Italy. He returned and faced down every charge despite having a Visa handed to him by The President of The United States (Jimmy Carter).

    I think he has the goods, and have almost since I first researched him.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      Do not forget Rossis background and industry connections enables him to command a 6 digit salary or close to it if he chooses. The fact that he has opted to work on his own in his own facilities while hiring Focardi and others tell us he was financially fluent enough to do this. It also tells us he opted this over minimum half a million dollars in Salaries.

      He then moved moved to Florida and invested in Real Estate. This tells us he is not afraid of U.S. law which have the toughest anti fraud standards, and that he could afford a comfortable international move.

      A lot of Canadians retire in Florida. How many Italians do?

      Plus now we know 20+ others have their own devices. From The Patterson Cell to Jet Energy.

      Why would you not accept the opinion of Dennis Bushnell, The head Research Scientist of NASA Langley (200 miles from the new Rossi/IH location).

    • just a story for those who still image or even fear it is a fraud:
      Rossi have made test where the claimed energy was much above anything chemical.
      So it is IMPOSSIBLE it is hidden battery or hidden fuel.
      the fraud have thus to be done through tweaking the apparent input energy or the apparent output heat…

      so, there is no reason to be unable to fake for 48hours if you can fake for 18…

      moreover the characteristics of fraud is to provide perfect demo, and very good faked dataset, which is not the case with some terrific Rossi demo…

  • friendlyprogrammer

    Who are you suggesting is or was a skeptic? I am kwhilborn but also post as Friendlyprogrammer. I hope it is not me you are suggesting was a skeptic, because I have been a hard core and very loud advocate for Rossi since early 2011 (The beginning).

    The top comment on this 2011 post is from me defending Rossi from Krivit.

    you can look at almost any significant LENR post since the beginning (2011 when he went public) and find I have been advocating LENR in the comments.

    I have written to Hybrid manufacturers, 60 minutes, W5, other news organizations, participated in science forums and maintain regular comments throughout Ecatworld and more LENR sites.

    If you suggest for one second I was a skeptic you are a huge liar.

  • in Mats lewan book, there is report of Küllander and Levi being skeptical but open, and finally convinced.

    there is also the skeptopath ericsson cited.

    the difference is the the two first were experimental physicist, and the last one, theoretician.

  • Ophelia Rump

    Nice to see you finally abandon that bogus argument, and admit Rossi will prevail over time.

    • friendlyprogrammer

      What are you talking about Ophelia.

      Click this link from 2011 (3 years ago)

      Now if you read the first comment you will see I have been a Rossi supporter far longer than I have seen your name around.

      I have no bogus arguments.

      • friendlyprogrammer

        I could give a hundred other links under these names.

        Rossi has an ecat, but he keeps underestimating what constitutes proof to the mainstream. In 2010 he thought submitting papers was enough. In 2011 he thought demonstrations would prove it. in 2012/2013 he thought verifications would prove it to mainstream. He has always underestimated how much proof is required. Why should this change now?

        Don’t confuse my lack of enthusiasm for this report as an excuse to badmouth me or say I don’t believe in the ecat as I have typed enough comments over the years in support of Rossi to have penned several books.

        • may I translate your wise warning as:
          “there is no limit to mainstream delusion and resistance to evidence?”

          I confirm as even the japanese government after Hiroshima was discussing details about the status of the Emperor not to surrender… until Nagasaki was bombed, and they finally admit they have no capacity to negociate.

          Thomas Kuhn give the solution to that frequent tragedy :
          – that a theory explain all including current paradigm and new anomaly
          – that the new paradigm give “believers” a huge material advantage, either in solving scientific, or engineering challenges.

          so there is two exit possible :
          – someone propose a good theory, compatible with current QM, to explain LENR
          – that clients are happy with LENR reactors.

          this exclude:
          – evidence
          – 3rd party tests
          – peer-reviewed publication
          – support by industrial, government agencies, financial funds
          – evidence of skeptic frauds and misconducts
          – evidence of incompetence of skeptics
          note that we already have all of that evidence, so no need to check.

      • GreenWin

        Apparently it’s all about “you” Mr. programmer?

        • friendlyprogrammer

          If someone came along claiming you were a skeptopath after years of hard core support for not only the ecat, but other forms of LENR it is hard not to call them a liar. You skeptics just hate us LENR folk.

          • friendlyprogrammer


            I have also been very active trying to prove LENR and provide proof…

            “First of all we have Piantelli who basically discovered the nickel/hydrogen process. He now has a company called Nichenergy. Piantelli has applied for patents and is only claiming a 2-4 times energy gain. He is missing something key that rossi has. Whatever catalyst is being used. I’m guessing harmonic sound might be in play, but that’s a guess. Allegedly; Piantelli has a theory that doesn’t require exotic reactions, but can be explained using known physics and mathematics. A semi-complete theory has been provided to the University of Siena and will be published shortly. The complete theory will probably be disclosed after the first commercial units have been sold.

            According to Dennis Bushnell, chief scientist at NASA’s Langley Research Center in Hampton, Virginia, NASA was working years ago on experiments based on Piantelli’s research, and that it continues.

            So NASA is doing Hydrogen/Nickel experiments admittedly.


            We should look at work done by Francesco Piantelli

            Please have a look at the above link.. here it is again.


            a quote from his bio,

            In 1989 Francesco Piantelli-Musso, a biologist at the University of Siena, in the course of his experiments with samples of organic material, noted an anomalous heat production. He made the information public. Focardi also observed the phenomenon and the two scientists decided to create a working group. They later added Roberto Habel, a member of the INFN at the University of Cagliari, as a member. This was in order to extensively study the cause of that anomaly in the formal of thermal energy.

            In 1996, an attempt was made to replicate experiment of Piantelli-Musso and Focardi at CERN. This was done by a group of CERN in Geneva . It was directed by Antonino Zichichi who then tried a replica of the experiment of Piantelli-Musso and Focardi. The study went on for almost a year. However, in the end has, there was no favorable outcome to the hypothesis of an explanation of nuclear nature of the phenomenon.

            Again in 1999, another attempt was made to replicate the experiment of Piantelli-Musso and Focardi. This was done in the Italian city of Pavia. Piantelli-Musso and Focardi have repeatedly stated that the cell has been built and successfully tested at the respective laboratories at the University of Siena and at the University of Bologna. However, until now there have been other experimental positive feedback by independent groups of researchers

            So we have Patents being issued to Francesco Piantelli for the exact same thing as what Andrea Rossi is doing, except Andrea Rossi is claiming his is superior.

            Now Andrea Rossi is one of those guys who likes to duplicate experiments and try to replicate the results. He duplicated the Pons fleischmann cold fusion experiment with Paladium and hydrogen.

            He used a catalyst when re-creating the Francesco Piantelli experiment and has claimed superior results.

            According to New Energy Times On Sept. 22, NASA conducted a LENR (Low Energy Nuclear Reaction) Innovation Forum workshop at Glenn Research Center in Cleveland, Ohio. Speakers included NASA scientists Joseph Zawodny, Gustave Fralick, Michael Nelson, Jim Dunn and Dennis Bushnell and retired University of Illinois professor George Miley.

            At the meeting, Bushnell said that LENR has a strong potential for a new source of energy. He was optimistic about nickel powder LENR solutions.

            This Workshop can be confirmed to have occurred by looking at the bottom of this NASA website where it states,

            Relevant Presentation:
            + Download presentation given at a LENR Workshop at NASA GRC in 2011 [available soon].

            at this web address,

            So the Chief Scientist at NASA Langley Research Center, Dennis Bushnell is OPTIMISTIC about the ecat.

            NOW LISTEN TO THIS…..
            “The temperature you can get out of [LENR] is interesting,” Bushnell said. “We’ve had to be careful [in our research in] terms of the energetics. I don’t think there is a power [limitation] problem.

            “I think the problem now is of raw courage to look into something that is new. We’ve been fortunate to have a center director at Langley that has the courage to support us to do this. We’ve been at it for three or four years.

            Click on this to see that NASA has readily admitted to replicating the Low Energy Nuclear Reactions (LENR), from Nickel/hydrogen. This is admitted freely.

            So NASA is saying they have been doing Nickel/Hydrogen cold fusion at the NASA Langley Research Center for three or four years.

            Sme Doubt Andrea Rossi, but can they also doubt Francesco Piantelli, and Dennis Bushnell (NASA)

            Piantelli claims his earlier units reported two to four times energy gain, but new units are underway. According to reports, these new units will have two hundred times energy gained. These units are expected to be completed in the next couple of months.

            WoW!! So we have a race going on here.

            Piantelli (who seems like the inventor), then Rossi who seems to have modified the idea, and NASA plugging away at Langley Research Centre for three or four years.

            3 different parties… all claiming the same thing.

            Okay now back to Andrea Rossi and the ecat.

            Sergio Focardi – In 2007, Italian inventor Andrea Rossi, e-cat fusion key figure, contacted Focardi to collaborate on his work on cold fusion. Sergio Focardi was a participant in the well known and studied Francesco Piantelli
            From 1988 to 1990, Sergio Focardi was president of the Coordination Committee of Italian Scientific Associations also known as COASSI. From 1980 to 1989, he was dean of the faculty of mathematical, physical and natural sciences. Also, from 1992 to 2000, he was chairman of the Board of Bachelor of Information Sciences in Cesena. It was this capacity that he founded the course of Information Science in Bologna and Cesena as well as Environmental Sciences in Ravenna.
            Sergio Focardi is an Italian physicist, and presently an emeritus professor at the University of Bologna. He also led the office of Bologna of Istituto Nazionale di Fisica Nucleare. His field of expertise is working on cold fusion with Nickel-Hydrogen reactors.

            To hear him speak positively about the ecat click on the link below.
            He does not speak english, so this video although puts a face to his endorsements is a bit tedious if you do not speak Italian. Translation is provided.

            He has been involved with Nickel/hydrogen cold fusion research since 1989. THAT is 22 years ago…

            So this was not an overnight invention.
            Giuseppe Levi – Nuclear and Supernuclear Physics Professor at the University of Bologna.

            He can be viewed speaking for an entire hour starting on the youtube link below. In English..

            Levi is one of the scientists who has had the opportunity to run tests on the device, and was involved in the press conference on January 14th, and is a member of the American SKEPTICS Society.

            He suggested it is insulting that colleagues do not accept their verifications.


            Sven kullander – Also has tested and has lent support backing the stance of The University of Uppsala. Some of his qualifications and merits I have listed here.

            Björkens prize for year 2000
            Membership in Societies and Academies
            Swedish Physical SocietyEuropean Physical Society
            Finnish Society of Sciences and Letters
            Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences
            Royal Academy of Arts and Sciences in Uppsala
            Royal Society of Sciences
            Committee Memberships
            Nuclear Physics Research Committee, CERN, 1968 – 1969
            Swiss Institute for Nuclear Research, 1968 – 1970
            Swedish Atomic Research Council, 1975 – 1977
            Committee for Physics Experiments at the CERN Proton Synchrotron, 1977 – 1979
            Swedish Natural Science Research Council, 1977 – 1983
            CERN Council, 1980 – 1983
            CERN Research Board, 1982 – 1984
            Board of the Faculty of Mathematics and Natural Sciences, Uppsala, 1984 – 1993
            Scientific Council of the Cooler Ring COSY project, Jülich, Germany, 1989 – 1992
            Programme Advisory Committee, COSY, Jülich, 1994 –
            Scientific Policy Committee, Max Planck Institute for Nuclear Physics, Heidelberg, 1991-
            Swedish CERN Committee, 1977 – 1995
            Asea Brown Boveri Energy Prize Award committee, 1990 – 1997
            Board of the Royal Swedish Academy of Sciences, 1998 -present

            Sven Kullander has also come forward in favour of the ecat, and is preparing to deliver a lecture later this month on Low Energy Nuclear reactions.

            Sven Kullander, professor of high energy physics at Uppsala University and chairman of Sweden’s Royal Academy of Sciences Energy Committee will be giving a public lecture entitled “Tomorrow’s Nuclear Power — Will it be Cold or Hot?” at Orebro University in Sweden on November 23rd at 16:30 in lecture hall T in Tech House. This lecture is free.

            Cold fusion has been developed recently in Bologna can be housed in an apparatus which is not much bigger than a coffee maker and generating energy only with a few teaspoons of nickel powder.? An intensive discussion on the net have questioned the experiment in Bologna mainly because it can not be explained by the established nuclear physics theory. It has also been speculated that the derivative produced heat energy must have been greatly overestimated mainly by an overestimation of the buildup of steam. At the lecture, these issues will be treated in order to gain a better understanding of the experiment in Bologna.


            So far we know that

            – NASA believes in the technology and has been conducting nickel/Hydrogen cold fusion experiments for the past three to four years.

            For people doubting NASA has been involved in this, look at this NASA webpage.
            Please note that is not a pro Rossi website, but NASA.

            – The University of Bologna has lent its name to support the ecat.

            – The University of Uppsala has lent its name to support the ecat.

            – We have at least three competing bodies trying to get “ecats” to market. Piantelli, Nasa, and Rossi.

            – Dennis Bushnell the Chief research Scientist at NASA Research Center in Langley not only believes in the ecat, but has been working on such a device himself for the past three to four years.

            – Professor Sergio Focardi has witnessed Piantellis results, and Rossi’s results, and has come out saying the ecat is a real thing with nuclear reactions taking place.

            – Professor Sven Kullander has witnessed the ecat in operation and has come out heavily in support of the ecat. It would be fun to hear his lecture later this month.

            – Professor Giuseppe Levi is a Nuclear and supernuclear physicist at the University of Bologna and a member of The American Skeptics Society. He has witness the ecat in operation many times, and speaks very highly of it. Kri interviewed him, and the 1 hour video link to his speaking of it is very convincing.

            There are many more names of Professors and scholars who have witnessed this device and are standing behind it, but you should get the idea that this is supported by academics.

            The idea that Rossi has spent the past few years sponsoring himself for a scam seems ridiculous, and I cannot believe how many people do not seem to see how ridiculous a scam scenario is. It’s common sense.

            Anyways. I have read and heard a lot more that what I have wrote and linked here, but I think I give a compelling argument for the ecats merits.”

            So if I am a skeptic.. We all are skeptics.. What crud..

  • Kwhilborn

    So what? People have been burning fingers on ecats since 2011 en masse. That does little to bring mainstream acceptance to this field. Nor will this report.

    You are making my point for me. You say only very stupid people would invest money based upon written words. That is not true. If those written words appear in NATURE MAGAZINE or some other highly regarded peer reviewed magazine they would be considered as fact.

    If Rossi gets published in NATURE MAGAZINE then his tech is mainstream.

    Antonio was happy this report would be conclusive, and I am saying I doubt that. What are you saying? That even if its inconclusive someone might burn themselves? I do not even see a coherent thought there.

  • Kwhilborn

    Who cares. If you agree that “The average scientist seems to have an I.Q. slightly less then a glass of cold water.”, then you are proving his point in that your own IQ is less than a glass of cold water.

    I happen to have many friends from my university days, and we were all in science oriented fields. This was a blanket insult to scientists in general and is STILL the most ignorant and stupid comment I have ever read in comments here. I now think George must be some kind of undereducated moron. Maybe you as well if you agree that “the average scientist seems to have an IQ less than a glass of cold water”.

  • guga

    What about georgehants’ offensive comment? I had not assumed that you could agree to such statements.

  • Antonio Saavedra Narváez

    Finally. After so many years, the time has come. For good or bad.

    • Kwhilborn

      Don’t read too much into this. He did a similar verification last year. It was tainted because it was held on his premises, just as it is being done this year (he said they brought equipment). This means nothing in these results will sway skeptics any more than previously. At best he has convinced a few more academics who participated in the testing.

      I think the AR approach to introducing this tech is flawed, and we are more likely to see a breakthrough come from one of the other 20 LENR researchers in the game. AR may have the breakthrough, but he is failing to patent correctly or even prove correctly he has such a tech.

  • orsobubu

    “Decide to reset the world currency system by, among several other
    measures, announcing a 30 percent devaluation of the U.S. dollar against
    other currencies and/or against gold” This would be an astonishing news, to be remebered in history books. Where did you get it?

    As usual, I like to point out that the problem is that sometimes energy is TOO cheap already now (for capitalism’s profit needs), not the contrary, and the situation will worsen in the future.

  • Obvious

    bachcole, you must have been let out of moderation delay purgatory!
    Anyways, to George, I meant your post, not the link, was obtuse originally.

    • Obvious

      From wikedpedia regarding Hitchhikers Guide to The Galaxy:

      The Belcerebons of Kakrafoon Kappa had an unhappy time. Once a serene and quiet civilization, a Galactic Tribunal sentenced them to telepathy because the rest of the galaxy found peaceful contemplation contemptuous. Ford Prefect compared them to Humans because the only way Belcerebons could stop transmitting their every thought was to mask their brain activity (or its readability) by talking endlessly about utter trivia. The other approach to dampening telepathic communication was to host concerts of the plutonium rock band Disaster Area. Thankfully, during the concert, an improbability field flipped over the Rudlit Desert, transforming it into a paradise, and cured the Belcerebons of telepathy. A Disaster Area spokesman said that this was “a good gig”.

    • georgehants

      Obvious, once you move away from the restrictive classical World and look at the True reality then everything is obtuse. Ha.

  • JDM

    AR seems to be answering lots of questions today, like he has some extra time to kill while he is waiting for something, eh?

  • GreenWin

    Does the term “egghead” reflect the state of one’s follicle accumulation? Or does it refer to characters that become hard boiled after five minutes?

  • Obvious

    I think it may have been the FBI that came up with the saying “you can’t bake a cake without breaking a few eggheads”.

  • GreenWin

    A new validation of “The Rossi Effect” will set off the well-planned, usual skeptofest denouncing the qualities of professors, procedures, publishing etc. Mainstream science hates to be questioned:

    “When a man of the profound scientific wisdom of Simon Newcomb (for
    example) had demonstrated with unassailable logic why man couldn’t fly,
    why should the public be fooled by silly stories about two obscure
    bicycle repairmen who hadn’t even been to college. Professor Newcomb was
    so distinguished an astronomer that he was the only American since
    Benjamin Franklin to be made an associate of the Institute of France. It
    was widely assumed that what he didn’t know about the laws of physics
    simply wasn’t in books. And that when he said that flying couldn’t be
    done, there was no need to inquire any further.”
    THE WRIGHT BROTHERS, by Fred C. Kelly

    • georgehants

      It is just fascinating that the average scientist does not seem to have the common sense after so many examples of “expert opinion” being proved as just another comic act of the century in science, they still sit around worshipping their premier comics and establishment declarations, of for example, Cold Fusion is bollocks.
      The average scientist seems to have an I.Q. slightly less then a glass of cold water.
      Perhaps a few scientists on page would like to debate this point with me.
      I don’t think so, they will be hiding on their own comedy blog sites where the only words they know are “crackpot” etc.

      • Obvious

        If common sense was actually common, this would be a very different world we live in.

        • georgehants

          Obvious, your reply is obtuse please try and make some sense of it.
          Do you you mean a better or worse World.

          • Obvious


            • georgehants

              Now you have to consider joining the spiritual community that is willing to give a chance to the Quantum knowledge that out thinking can effect our reality.

              • Obvious

                How is the knowledge Quantum? I thought knowledge was more Bremsstrahlung-like.

                • georgehants

                  Obvious, you must move away from any type of thinking that try’s to explain in simple terms our reality.
                  The Quantum does not allow this.
                  One must just follow the Research and without any kind of foolish of being taken in learn.

                • Obvious

                  Now that’s obtuse.

                • georgehants

                  Obvious, it is not for me to in any way influence your interpretation, you have the same freedom of thought of every individual on this planet.
                  You make your choice, but don’t blame somebody else for your choice.

                • Obvious

                  I can blame the racket of 7 billion noisy brains with interfering with my thoughts if want to. All that noisy thinking is probably the cause of reverse entropy in the nano sphere experiment… if no one was thinking near the experiment, it probably wouldn’t happen at all… The wave of “I’m hungry” refrains of those brains travelling around the globe is enough to make me put on a tin foil hat. It is both sad and annoying. But the “wake up and scratch bum” thought wave going around the Earth more or less synchronized with sunrise is Really annoying… Humans better clean up their thoughts before collective thinking starts happening.

                • georgehants

                  Obvious, I am going to bed, thank you for our discussion, most enjoyable.
                  There are so many Wonderful things out there that most people are not even remotely aware of.
                  I look forward to another chat. 🙂

      • LilyLover

        Sometimes looking back 25 years, in the field of Science, I feel I never came across real Scientists. Yes, the PhDs, Professors, Deans or Post-Docs included. Common scenario: PhD Student: Which professor has funding? OK, Dear Prof, my area of interest is … me too! Feeding families or paying student debt takes precedence over Science. Then, these Scientific drones use the common sense to survive. Unless, free-willed research is funded (even at $15 per hour), nothing good can come out of “Science” – Industry. Today, MSM meme-based topics get approved for funding by the “Policy-Makers” for which “Professors” (to profess is to beg?) compete to win the award. To which the Scientific Workers conform. So, may be they base it too much on common sense. That’s why unlimited free education is important. Fraction of War/Welfare cost!
        Another thing – Objects / Non living entity cannot possess intelligence. Therefore IP rights should only belong to people from whom corporations can license annually. A scientist needs to be able to capitalize on the inventions and a corporation should never be. MBA in finance with army of lawyers siphons the fruits of inventors to the top of the corporations. Then all good scientists decide that their children should be lawyers or MBAs.
        Just like military, Patent office must be run as a totally free service to the society. All patent lawyers must be on public payroll. If not all the time, at least every alternate year to establish their free market worth. Ther should also be Language experts. The applicant, big or small, can only be known after the patent is adjudicated. Combination of anonymity, randomness and claim-language-sanitizers should lead to three patent lawyers preparing the case independently. Then, the claimant can pick a combination and send it to another lawyer for final application. Then, the WORK of the patent office is to help facilitate the granting of the patent and interactively help steer the patent to fruition all the while not knowing who the claimant is. To steer a meritorious patent to fruition is complete departure from present stance of default-denial.

        This is supposed to help in the transitory period so that frivolous claims cannot be granted to TheBig and important claims are not denied to individuals.
        This will cost less than a few thousand welfare-moms. Children of whom could in turn have a chance to employ ten times over in the following generation with equal right to IP protection. May be I’m rambling too much… but you get the point, right? So, no, it’s the society that has no common sense of protecting the individualized IP and disallowing “corporate IP”. Society loves to stay poor and coward. That’s why they let the grasshoppers have it all. In that context, the Scientific workers, simply conform to the Big Science and exhibit the common sense. I wanted them to exhibit – sense. The commons are anti-sense. Therefore I hope scientists never exhibit common sense. That’s what has led to the situation today. So, no more common sense. Just proper sense. & That’s why only the “mad” scientist will succeed as of now.


      • GreenWin

        The lesson being taught by LENR is to remind the high and mighty that they are not so high or mighty after all. Regardless of how high and mighty one purports to be… there is ALWAYS someone higher. Ask Thutmoses III.

        And, what goes around will come around. So, be careful what you sew.

      • guga

        Calling a whole group of people stupid is totally inappropriate, completely out of bounds. This is not a base for discussion.

        • georgehants

          guga, well I enjoyed reading your defence or the incompetence and corruption in many areas of science.
          You have convinced me Ha.
          I think that is called a blanket denial, typical of the average scientist.

          • Kwhilborn

            I’m an avid believer in the Ecat. I am also a scientist. I can think of many terms I think suit you beneath “Crackpot” at this moment based on your blanket attack in your previous “crackpot” comment.

      • Kwhilborn

        I think most people who are Engineers (like myself) consider themselves scientists in that our education is a lot better than average. I also believe that the Ecat is real based on common sense gleened from reading materials and dialogues.

        I do not think the “average” scientist is even aware of CF because it is suppressed. CF caused a lot of embarrassment to thousands who endorsed it and believed in it. It is understandable that many of them feel they have been down that road already.

        I do not think anybody in University studying any Major would have an IQ equal to water, and that is perhaps the stupidest thing I have ever read in these comments.

        Perhaps Flinging poo is your idea of “debate”, but it seems more the behavior of a monkey. Try growing up before using big words in future.

        • thomas kuhn explain the reason why educated scientist (or professionals) can be crazily denying facts.

          The training of scientist is done by massive brainwashing to make them productive inside the current paradigm by not looking beside it.

          It is the opposite of stupidity, it is training, over training.
          all intelligence of an academic is working to deniy anomalies and go back to the current paradigm.

          part of their IQ is used to rationalize anomalies, and other part to be blind to anomalies.

          Engineers, like non physicist are not more intelligent, but not locked in the same paradigm. engineer have a paradigm, but this paradigm probably make them locked into believing measurements and not trusting theories or models.
          my education, between micro electronics, QM, IT, software engineering, project management, finance modelization, numerical modeling make me aware of :
          – difficulties to replicate in real science
          – role of blackswan in innovation
          – role of impurities an lattice in physics
          – danger of modelisation and theories
          – groupthink in organization and markets, rewriting of history

          cold fusion is not challenging my paradigm, rather well understood under it.
          – groupthink
          – lattice and doping effects
          – blackswan
          – pathologies of theory and models
          – unpunished frauds