Rossi: E-Cat Secret’s in Space

Andrea Rossi is famously reluctant to say anything about his theory about how the E-Cat works, so it’s a bit of a surprise to read the following exchange on the Journal of Nuclear Physics today:

Joseph Fine
November 1st, 2013 at 5:27 PM
Ing. Rossi, Robert Curto and Readers,

Dark matter and dark energy may or may not exist. According to recent news (see article below), a recent search for Dark matter has revealed nothing. Excellent detectors, more well-designed experiments and some old-fashioned luck will be needed to gather further, if any, evidence. If dark matter/energy exists, humankind may not be ready to deal nobly with the grand architecture (and the Grand Architect) of the universe, as many do not deal nobly with each other.

Meanwhile, the 4 or 5 % of the universe made up of ordinary matter seems to have become extraordinarily interesting.

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article.cfm?id=lux-dark-matter-null-result

Best regards,

Joseph Fine

************************

Dr Joseph Fine:
I agree.
In any case the observation of the astrophysic phenomena has given bases to the theory behind the work we are doing. Together with Prof. Focardi we analyzed some reactions that are foundamental for what now we call the “Rossi Effect”. It will be very interesting when the situation will allow us to disclose the theory we are working upon. Universe is a wonderful and ( relatively) free nuclear laboratory, in which happen and can be measured events that are impossible to be reproduced in a lab, as Cerny as it might be.
Warm Regards,
A.R.

I really don’t know enough about astrophysics to comment here, but Rossi has always come across as someone who is very well-versed in theoretical physics, and can converse with knowledge and ease on the topic. He sounds like he is eager to reveal his theory, but I am sure that there are very important competitive reasons why he has to keep quiet for now.

I do wonder what astrophysical phenomenon has attracted his attention.

  • gdaigle

    Interesting statement.

    There are tenuous possibilities of connecting the “Rossi Effect” to a cosmological model without dark energy or dark matter, though they involve bridging large gaps of knowledge with speculation. Having said that, here is one way that the connections could be made through use of symmetry breaking:

    A. Brian Ahern from Ames National Labs, as reported in E-Cat World, states “I am announcing the nanonickel breakthrough at the New Energy Symposium in NYC on Wednesday. I am saying the energy is real, repeatable and of useful output. I will also state that it is not of nuclear origin. I will say that it is a manifestation of asymmetric magnetism.” Asymmetric magnetism by its nature requires symmetry breaking.

    B. Droescher and Hauser (http://www.hpcc-space.de/publications/documents/Pages_from_AIAA2012-3915.pdf) have suggested that a phase transition (magnetically induced through a polarization of the quantum vacuum or critically low cryogenic temperatures) followed by symmetry breaking (parity violation) can result in extreme attractive and repulsive gravitomagnetic potentials, responsible for dark matter and quintessence (dark energy) respectively, as reported in experiments performed by Prof. M Tajmar (despite erroneous reports that his results were recanted).

    C. A study (http://phys.org/news/2011-11-quantum-vacuum-dark.html) by CERN physicist Draga Slavkov Hajdukovic suggested that dark matter may be an “illusion” caused by the quantum vacuum if gravitational dipoles are produced through asymmetry. He demonstrates the credibility of this idea by showing that the gravitational polarization of the quantum vacuum can explain via Modified Newtonian Dynmics (MOND) four cosmological observations usually attributed to dark matter. More recently, McGaugh and Milgrom (http://arxiv.org/abs/1308.5894v1) have reported that MOND is a better predictor of the velocity dispersions of dwarf satellite galaxies of Andromeda without use of dark matter, than the standard model of cosmology which employs dark matter.

  • John Littlemist

    Recent Lattice Energy LLC slide set also claims that Widom-Larsen theory “solves several unexplained astronomical mysteries”, on page 18:

    http://www.slideshare.net/lewisglarsen/lattice-energy-llc-toyota-confirms-mitsubishi-transmutation-of-cs-to-proct-31-2013

  • E_man

    Frank, congratulations to 1000 votes on Your pool !!!

  • Daniel Maris

    Virtual particles? Could explain both LENR and the missing matter? Just a guess!

  • catbauer24

    Self-endearing, when Rossi talks about the ‘Rossi Effect’. If it’s real, it’s the ‘Focardi Effect’, or to give better credit to a different basis, the ‘Pons-Fleischmann effect’, or in general some type of ‘Hyrdogen-loaded lattice Heat’ effect.

    • Doktor Bob

      I agree, the last thing we want to do is confuse anyone

  • Allan Shura

    Theologians once debated the number of angels on the head of a pin but it is useful if only when it is put in to practice. Some perhaps may believe they have access to a newly discovered realms.

  • BroKeeper

    One of the sub-headlines within the Dark Matter article of the November Popular
    Science magazine quotes “Dark Physics Could Lead to Dark Stars, Dark Planets,
    even Dark Life”.

    Interesting: a source few deem as scientific truth, cites the following: “For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and INVISIBLE, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers ……”.

    It is also theorized that dark matter and dark energy are responsible for accelerating
    the universes expansion and now understood to be Einstein’s gravitational k (kappa) constant, although he once considered it his greatest blunder. The before mentioned source quotes ten times that He “stretches out the heavens like a curtain”.

    Perhaps there is a master plan far beyond our ability to detect and comprehend or maybe true science and this discredited source will converge as one someday.

    • GreenWin

      It could also lead to the evil “Dark Vader” – Lucifer’s father and Lucy Ricardo’s mother.

      • BroKeeper

        LOL! Or even the famous philosopher Homer Simpson – D’OH!
        But if you look at it closer it may not be far from the truth if one reads a little further about grace winning over dark things: “….and through him to reconcile ALL things unto himself, having made peace through the blood….”

        • GreenWin

          Bro, I know you are on to the wisdom. Reason to go into the highways and invite all that ye meet, to the feast. 🙂

          • BroKeeper

            We
            All will be at the feast eventually. The
            operative word is eventually, even Lucy
            Ricardo’s mother. 🙂

  • Sanjeev

    If cold fusion can happen with some nickle and hydrogen in a jar in your kitchen, it can also happen in this big old universe everywhere. May be Rossi’s reactions has some kind of radiation signature, like gamma rays at a specific frequency, and may be he saw that same signature in some astronomical observations and made a connection of some sort.
    The dark matter/energy is a product of the dark minds of theoreticians, who for some reason cannot let go of their old text books. Note that the model being followed is now 100 years old and there has been no progress in fundamental science, except knowledge of hair splitting kind and lots of technology.

    LENR is like a tempest in the pot which will stir it up and raise some dirt. I don’t think we will see a grand unification theory immediately upon the release of a LENR heater in the market, but it will demolish the old models, and will make everyone look for new ones.
    My wild guess is that ultimately people will see that the energy-matter conversion happens at all times in all places and its all virtual – just information. The Consciousness will enter the equations, as the primary “substance”, the generator of this information. That will unify all human experience and knowledge.
    Certainly, people are not ready for this yet, most of them are in survival mode and anything that challenges their survival gets rejected. Abundant energy will take away this pressure from their minds and we will see a more evolved society….that’s why I’m eagerly waiting for my Ecat or a similar product. It is that important.

  • US_Citizen71

    One theory I like to roll around in my head is that dark matter and dark energy are actually fictitious in the same way that centripetal force is. With all the matter in our universe moving at different rates of speed time dilation between objects is normal. Gravitational energy may not behave the same way as matter and not succumb to time dilation causing our observed belief in dark energy and matter.

    • GreenWin

      US, you have some confirmation in your first idea. Quasars do not appear to conform to time dilation (or relativity) as their redshift does not change the time it takes for light to reach Earth. Even though distant quasars are more strongly redshifted than closer quasars, there is no difference in the time it takes the light to reach Earth. Perhaps, like LENR, it is mass hallucination?

      But even though the
      distant quasars were more strongly redshifted than the closer quasars,
      there was no difference in the time it took the light to reach Earth.

      Read more at: http://phys.org/news190027752.html#jCp
      But even though the
      distant quasars were more strongly redshifted than the closer quasars,
      there was no difference in the time it took the light to reach Earth.

      Read more at: http://phys.org/news190027752.html#jCp
      But even though the
      distant quasars were more strongly redshifted than the closer quasars,
      there was no difference in the time it took the light to reach Earth.

      Read more at: http://phys.org/news190027752.html#jCp
      But even though the
      distant quasars were more strongly redshifted than the closer quasars,
      there was no difference in the time it took the light to reach Earth.

      Read more at: http://phys.org/news190027752.html#jCp
      But even though the
      distant quasars were more strongly redshifted than the closer quasars,
      there was no difference in the time it took the light to reach Earth.

      Read more at: http://phys.org/news190027752.html#jCp
      But even though the
      distant quasars were more strongly redshifted than the closer quasars,
      there was no difference in the time it took the light to reach Earth.

      Read more at: http://phys.org/news190027752.html#jCp
      But even though the
      distant quasars were more strongly redshifted than the closer quasars,
      there was no difference in the time it took the light to reach Earth.

      Read more at: http://phys.org/news190027752.html#jCp
      But even though the
      distant quasars were more strongly redshifted than the closer quasars,
      there was no difference in the time it took the light to reach Earth.

      Read more at: http://phys.org/news190027752.html#jCp
      But even though the
      distant quasars were more strongly redshifted than the closer quasars,
      there was no difference in the time it took the light to reach Earth.

      Read more at: http://phys.org/news190027752.html#jCp

      • GreenWin

        Sorry about the repeats…

      • bachcole

        No need to be sorry about the repeats. It is revolutionary enough (in a direction that I happen to like, me being a steady state dude) that I didn’t get it the first 6 times. By 7 it was beginning to sink in. I fully grasped it by the 9th time. Does this mean that the Big Bang Theory is over-thrown, or is this just going to be forgotten like all scientific revolutions until all of the Big Bang believers grow old and die.

      • Fortyniner

        “- quasars, it seems, give off light pulses at the same rate no matter their distance from the Earth, without a hint of time dilation.”

        But what if redshift is NOT an absolute indicator of distance, but also reflects the intensity of the gravity well at the point of origin. Seems too obvious – clearly I’m misunderstanding something here..

        • GreenWin

          Hi Peter, my understanding is the Big Bang model assumes inflation is a constant (though accelerating.) It is the physical movement away from observers that lengthens emitted light waveform. Conversely a compression of waveform indicates movement toward observer (i.e. Doppler)

          Consider a man-made satellite that travels away from us at high speed – we expect its radio emissions to take longer to arrive, the further it moves away (time dilation.) Quasars are the most luminous emitters in the cosmos and appear to have powerful black holes at center. However quasar emissions (light) exhibit no time dilation. If anything, we’d expect the gravity well to slow photons – I would think. How does a quasar adhere to inflation constant yet exhibit no time dilation (unless its light goes superluminal or sumthin’) ?

          • Fortyniner

            GW – thanks. I hacked a bit out of my post in the interest of brevity, and on reflection I probably cut too much for the remainder to make much sense.

            My original problem with this is the apparently unquestioned assumption that redshift ∝ cosmological distance, i.e., Hubble’s formula. If this assumption is incorrect or incomplete then then highly redshifted quasars may not be as far away as is assumed, i.e., may not in fact be receding relative to us at the relativistic speeds calulated. As quasars are in effect a type of black hole, I would have thought that the effect of local (to the quasar) gravity on redshift would need to be taken into account before estimating distance/speed per Hubble. The distortions to spacetime caused by such massive gravity, must make calculations of mass, size, distance, luminosity etc. of such bodies as if they are ‘normal’ structures in our spacetime, fraught with potential stumbling blocks.

            Of course, that still leaves the problem of the lack of correlation between quasar period and redshift, so is probably entirely irrelevant anyway! (I am assuming that the ‘problem’ – not explained in the article – is that quasar periods do not increase on average in any obvious proportion to measured Doppler redshift.) I suppose the answer – it may have already been done – might be to try to get redshift measurements from ejecta or stars associated with quasars (i.e. in the same galaxies) to see if the redshifts agree.

            • GreenWin

              Very well put Fortyniner. Not sure about the black hole gravity well being different in quasar than from say, a younger galaxy like Milky Way. To that end here’s a fellow who suggests the quasar functions as a second observer, as in the double slit experiment. I find this provocative because we assume ours (Earth) is the inertial frame for measuring. This fellow suggests a quasar has its own, extra-dimensional “consciousness” and assumes IT is the inertial frame – cancelling time dilation. Rather fun to consider and in keeping with evolving thought on reality as a function of consciousness. http://endgametime.wordpress.com/quasars-time-dilation-and-relativity-related-to-consciousness/

              • Fortyniner

                Yes, I came across the same text somewhere else. I’m not sure what to make of it really – more food for thought!

        • Julius Bourjo

          You’re talking about RedShift , did you read about Halton Arp ?

          • Fortyniner

            @ Julius

            I hadn’t heard of him until you mentioned his name. Having just now Googled his work, it seems he has done exactly what I suggested further down the page might be an acid test, by looking at the redshifts of quasars cf. physically associated galaxies. He seems to confirm that the redshifts do NOT agree, and there is plenty of other confirmation as well that redshift is NOT a reliable indicator of distance/recession.

            http://electric-cosmos.org/arp.htm

            In fact from what I can understand, his observations should have killed the big bang theory more or less at its inception, but more powerful forces within the astronomy community seem to have prevailed. Either the ‘blackout’ on his work was so thorough that astronomers such as Hawkins (GreenWin’s link) haven’t heard of it, or he is still being deliberately ignored by the astronomy establishment. Either way my inexpert speculation about the significance (actually, lack of it) of redshift seems to be justified, so thanks for the suggestion!

            I think Arp’s time will come, perhaps very soon now.

            http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/ciencia/esp_ciencia_haltonarp.htm

          • bachcole

            Halton Arp is another victim of the viciousness of the American science community.

  • ilk

    The “astrophysic phenomena” that Rossi refers to may be the possibility of LENR in the solar atmosphere. Somewhere I read that there may be transmutation going on in the chromosphere / corona region where there are regions of unexpectedly high temperatures. It may be that the aftermath of supernovae are not the only source of heavy elements. I am sorry that I have no references to documentation for this. I am only a curious layman, not a physicist.

    • ksbceng

      The surface temperature of the sun is 6000C but the temperature of the Sun’s corona is millions of degrees C. Why? One accepted explanation for this can be the energy is released by twisted lines of magnetic fields as they break. An alternative explanation is some sort of LENR process.

      • bachcole

        Or both.

      • Sanjeev

        This fact confuses a lot many people and it confused me for many years. But you should understand that a high temperature generally does not mean more energy, it just means more concentration of energy. So a big pool of water at 30C contains a lot more energy that a cup of water at 99C. Corona is very very rare and the amount of matter in it is tiny, so its possible that its temperature goes up, as it is well insulated and gets lots of radiation of all kinds.

        Anyway, there is no “official” explanation. You will find this article interesting, its surprising how “cold” the sun actually is.

        http://coldfusionnow.org/power-equivalent-to-the-sun-we-already-have-it/

      • Hope4dbest

        “An alternative explanation is some sort of LENR process.”

        If what’s going on in the Sun’s corona is an LENR (Low Energy Nuclear Reaction) I don’t want to imagine what a HERN (HIGH Energy Nuclear Reaction) must look like…

    • bachcole

      Your ilk is like that, claiming to be a curious layman but being smarter than the average physicist. (:->)

    • Jim Anderson

      Widom Larsen theory states what you said may be possible. There are slide presentations on Slide Share that list this as a possibility.

  • clovis ray

    i think there for i am, no wait, i’m not sure.lol
    i think it is truly missing, in like not there. i would guess it dark matter, is the stuff that is made when the stuff of this universe, is sucked through a black hole , and transformed into dark energy, over in another multiverse, thats the reason we will never obtain it , unless we somehow can find our way over to that other multiverse, and haul a load back over here. now what you think about that guess.

    • bachcole

      I am therefore I am.

      I experience therefore I am.

  • GreenWin

    Wait a minute… Dr. Fine is saying that our “Standard Model” of the physical universe has difficulty explaining the FOUR percent of matter it applies to?? And we have NO idea what the remaining 96% of the universe consists of?? Shocking.

    • eyedoc

      What is meant by ‘as Cerny as it might be’ ??

      • ilk

        CERN is the name for the European Organization for Nuclear Research that operates the Large Hadron Collider.

        • Fortyniner

          Apologies for repeating your info, ilk – I’m pretty sure your post wasn’t visible at the time for some reason.

          • ilk

            Fortyniner,
            No problem. It was my first post and there was evidently some processing delay. Your information, being more complete, was an improvement on mine.

      • Fortyniner

        Presumably meaning ‘CERN-like’, i.e., incredibly large and unbelievably expensive. CERN is the European Organization for Nuclear Research, home of the Large Hadron Collider that may or may not have demonstrated the existence of the Higgs boson (hooray) at a cost of a mere few billion taxpayer Euros.

        • bachcole

          And whatever diminishes the European pocketbook diminishes mine, even if mine is thousands of miles away from Europe.

      • asey

        Joseph Fine

        Cerny as in dark or black? (He added in rusian) черный

        -Joseph Fine

        Andrea Rossi
        Dr.Joseph Fine:
        …he, he, he,,, CERNy

  • clovis ray

    hi, guys, you know hydrogen seems to be the main ingredient it is also the most plentiful thing in universe.

    • clovis ray

      could this be a key to finding dark energy.

      • Fortyniner

        ‘Dark matter’ and ‘dark energy’ are what are generally known as ‘kludges’ – invented factors that are introduced to make the observed facts fit with a theory, but which have no evidential basis themselves. The virtually inevitable outcome is that a new theory that actually matches the data without any need for kludges eventually replaces the old theory that didn’t fit the facts – usually when all the advocates of the old theory have died or retired.

        The standard model is now so full of holes that it is being held together on several fronts by such ‘duct tape’ methods. Even Wikipedia seems to admit that it is a dog’s breakfast:

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsolved_problems_in_physics

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Physics_beyond_the_Standard_Model

        • bachcole

          49er, what you say is poetry to my ears. I even used the word “kludge” when I first heard about dark matter and dark energy.

          “Well, that doesn’t work. What if we invent something that will make it work right?”

          “But Boss, didn’t we already do that with Dark Matter”.

          “Kownowski, do you like your job here at the observatory?”

          • Fortyniner

            🙂

            • Ivone

              Has anyone heard of MOND? It teaches that, at low speeds, gravity is strengthened. and that there really is nothing out there causing the increased rotation. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Modified_Newtonian_dynamics

              • Fortyniner

                Thanks – interesting idea, although the maths is (are?) well beyond my pay grade. Certainly the invention of undetectable ‘dark matter’ to ‘explain’ galactic rotation speeds seems primitively mechanistic and the product of outmoded thinking.

                My own intuition is that our understanding of time is at the heart of many cosmological ‘anomolies’. If time is assumed to be not quite the constant it is generally thought to be, then all concepts of speed, acceleration, gravity, distance and ‘cosmological expansion’ etc. into which a time factor is integrated are up for grabs, in a way that is not open within the standard model.