‘Very Remarkable’ — Swedish R&D Organization ELFORSK on E-Cat Report it Funded




ELFORSK AB, the Swedish energy R&D organization established by utilities and manufacturers in the country has issued a statement on its website commenting on the 3rd party Report which it funded, along with the Alba Langenskiöld Foundation.

Here’s the statement (Google translated)


Researchers from Uppsala University and KTH Stockholm has conducted measurements of the produced heat energy from a device called the E-cat. It is known as an energy catalyst invented by the Italian scientist Andrea Rossi.

The measurements show that the catalyst produces significantly more energy than can be explained by ordinary chemical reactions. The results are very remarkable. What lies behind the extraordinary heat production can not be explained today. There has been speculation over whether there can be any form of nuclear transformation. However, this is highly questionable. To learn more about what is going on you have to learn what is happening with the fuel and the waste it produces. The measurements have been funded by such Elforsk.

A report published earlier this year by ELFORSK showed that in 2012, 200,000 Swedish Krona (about 23,000 Euros) was budgeted for the study of the E-Cat, and in each of the following three years 2,000,000 Krona was budgeted for its study.

It appears ELFORSK is very intrigued with the results of the the testing, and it sounds like they are going to be looking into it further. It looks like they want to know a lot more about what is going on with this technology, and I expect they will asking Rossi for access to more of his data and equipment. How much access they will be given remains to be seen.

  • http://www.lenrnews.eu/lenr-summary-for-policy-makers/ AlainCo

    Note that sad remark by Jed rothwell

    https://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg87477.html

    “EPRI is similar to ELFORSK. At EPRI there were reports by Passel which were

    good, reports paid for by EPRI from McKubre et al. which were excellent,
    and then there was nonsense published by Tom Schneider such as the
    introduction to the book by Hoffman. The book was nonsense raised to the
    second power, paid for by the American Nuclear Society.”

    so you can hope the worst…

    see what happened to Elforsk test on arxiv and how the toilet paper of pomp&eriksson was swallowed like milk

  • Job001

    Rather than accepting the bad results of F&P delayed innovation as “the way it is” perhaps we need to be proactive and develop methods of dealing with “our problems”.
    Do we have or need problem solving sites and groups dedicated to:

    Improving science innovation?
    Preventing/reversing cartel buried innovation?
    Patent reform?
    Reducing cartel extraction(False IP, etc.)?
    Returning stolen productivity(innovation) to society?

    The cynical view seems to be that only the crooks are problem solving.
    The positive view is that we can organize and problem solve, and we have new tools, insights, and motivations.

  • jfab

    If the input power is used only to heat the resistors (as we’re being told by Rossi et al.), then what is the need of a special waveform? How much a special waveform could affect the way a resistor heats?

    • fortyniner

      What do you mean by ‘Rossi et al.? – the Elforsk paper is authored by Levi et al.

      Perhaps you mean the phrase used in the paper – not by Rossi – to describe the supply used in the December (H1) test: “They were fed by a TRIAC power regulator device which interrupted each phase periodically, in order to modulate power input with an instrial trade secret waveform”?

      This could simply refer (as the wording, ‘in order to modulate power input’ suggests) to the pattern of the off-on sequence used to limit input so that the reactor stays safe – i.e., a Triac operating to ‘trade secret’ settings.

      • jfab

        When I say “Rossi et al.” i’m not talking specifically about the report, but rather the ecat technology in general, and those who have studied it.

        Regarding the on/off pattern and the waveform, AFAIK, these are two separate things. The on/off pattern is known (35%/65%), but the “waveform” is secret. But maybe I misunderstood, as they’re not elaborating on the subject in the report. I thought the waveform meant an actual AC waveform of some special configuration.

        • fortyniner

          So did I initially – specifically an RF modulation that would be radiated by the resistor wires. However there doesn’t seem to be any evidence for that. The stainless steel inner tube is of a type that would be transparent to EMR, but as it is also a good choice for high temp applications that probably doesn’t mean anything.

          It’s possible that there is another on-off or peak-cropping pattern, ‘inside’ the 35/65 one, that simply limits the overall energy that is input during the 35% part of the switching cycle.

    • GreenWin

      Looks like the denia1ists attempt to make the 3rd party disappear by referring to the paper as Rossi’s. Add to this the desperate, if technically ignorant attack on power measurement, and you have the latest tro1agenda.

    • artefact

      The e-cat HT2 has not only a resistor as a first stage but a “mouse”. This one could use the special wave form.

      • jfab

        Is the “mouse” inside or outside the ecat cylinder?

      • fortyniner

        Rossi did seem to be quite adamant that the ‘mouse’ is a separate sub-reactor within the H2 design, possibly replacing the simple heater elements, but nothing we’ve read in the paper or seen in the images seems to support this idea.

        Maybe there is something special about the control box that replaces the triac, that he his attempting to divert attention from with a red herring? It wouldn’t be the first time he’s done that.

    • Ted-X

      There could be a specific resonance frequency for the nickel-catalyst-hydrogen system. My guess was that it was half-carbonylated nickel surface with oscillating/resonating charges, forcing electrons from the hybridized orbits into the nucleus of nickel, which could be a starting point of consecutive transmutations. This assumes the catalytic effect of carbon monoxide, which could be the catalyst or a secondary catalyst.

  • fortyniner

    I’ve just sent this to the UK Dept of Energy.:
    (I’ll copy a version to the minister responsible when I’ve found his address)

    “Dear Sirs

    Some time ago your department issued a brief statement to the effect that you had a ‘watching brief’ in respect of the reported work of Ing. A. Rossi in connection with his ‘E-Cat’ (energy catalyzer) invention, a novel energy source employing nickel nanopowder, hydrogen and certain unspecified materials or systems.

    Recently a study funded by Elforsk AB, a major Swedish consortium representing several power companies, has produced very positive results (link and translation below) and on the basis of these results has now decided to invest some 2,000,000 Krona per year in further R&D. I am contacting you to enquire if you are aware of these developments, and if so if your department is now taking a more active role in investigating this possible alternative to existing energy sources.

    It is notable that development of this device has apparently proceeded at an unusually fast pace over the last year or so, with the direct involvement not only of Elforsk AB but also of an un-named US corporate concern plus interest from other parties such as National Instruments Inc and Siemens. At the moment it would seem that the UK is in danger of ignoring an important development and possibly losing out heavily as other nations stake their claims. A brief statement summarising your current position on the invention and its gathering support as this might affect the UK’s ‘energy mix’ would be appreciated.

    With regards,

    links, etc.”

    Obviously I’ll post any reply I receive.

    • georgehants

      I could be wrong but I think you may get a reply containing an expensive copy of the public prospectus outlining the wonderful new nuclear power stations to be built at the bottom of your garden, with a full scientific explanation as to why that will be the best thing that could happen to you.

      • Blanco69

        :) True

      • fortyniner

        So I suspect George – but at least we’ll then know what the ‘official’ UK stance on Rossi is, rather than just suspecting it.

        Of course there is an equal chance they’ll just ignore this email and any others like it, knowing that their replies might be made public.

      • Barry

        Good luck Pete…ah fortyniner. With the U.S., if you pooled all of the campaign $ that went into congress from oil corps. you’d come up with an obscene figure. You don’t have to look very deep in the story of CF to find obstructionism at work. It’s hard to sort though the true skeptics from obstructionist with agendas. Even the Forbes article. I appreciate what Mark Gibbs wrote but the comment section gives first dibs to S Krivits with a photo and listing his site.
        The saving grace for CF are the countries that aren’t so mired in oil. Sweden, Japan, Italy etc. I have more faith in their governments than the UK or US. I find the politics of CF in our country, especially at MIT of all places, embarrassing.

        • fortyniner

          Barry –

          It’s much the same here, except that instead of ‘big oil’ it’s the nuclear fission lobby that seems to have an inexplicable degree of influence over government policy. This may be due to technical ignorance and incompetence on the part of UK politicians – or something else. Who knows.

    • GreenWin

      Very well stated Peter. I wonder just what the illustrious U.S. EPRI
      organization is doing in light of the E-CatHT validation. Less than a year ago they paid for LENR research but unhappily “lost” the data.

      Is the U.S. utility industry going to roll over and let Elforsk AB make them look ignorant?? Oh, they already have…

      http://www.epri.com/abstracts/Pages/ProductAbstract.aspx?ProductId=000000000001025575

      • fortyniner

        Mmm – they tried, but not too hard! Just enough to cover their arses basically, although even that is more than anything the UK govt could manage. Looks like yanks and brits will probably stand together on the sidelines watching the rest of the world take off while we are busy irradiating ourselves or making gas come out of water taps. Unless of course the ‘partner’ comes through in the ‘states, in which case we brits will be all alone.

        • GreenWin

          Many a former empire has slipped into obscurity with fingers firmly inserted in their ears.

          • d1ricks

            The longer the government stays out of this the better.

    • Gordon Docherty

      I, too, submitted a request to the Department for Energy and Climate Change to consider “getting ready” for this development. I received a standard response – a list of websites of various organizations in the energy sector – but nothing beyond that. Ah, well. Reminds me of “Protect and Survive” (a quick look on Youtube for this, and you can quickly work out the level of planning that went into that :) )

      • fortyniner

        That’s pretty much what I’m expecting. When I get that I’ll work my way through my MP, Verma, Barker, Fallon and Davey, then see if I can escalate it any further if I don’t get a considered answer.

  • georgehants

    If we except that the E-Cat is genuine, beyond reasonable doubt, then we can now watch and judge —
    Our governments.
    The Energy Industry
    The green party’s.
    Our Science administrations and scientists.
    Our Free press and media.
    Etc.
    We will now clearly see any manipulations, corruption, incompetence, self-serving, Etc.
    We are now free to observe the actions of our society clearly regarding a Technology that has the potential to literally, change the World, for the benefit of everybody.

    • Ted-X

      Doing scientific research needs to be reformed. However, some systems are below the point of being reformed from within. This is true of many institutions (the Peter’s principle – extended). History has plenty of examples, starting from the Roman Empire.

  • georgehants

    From Foxcrawl
    Andrea Rossi cold fusion E-Cat reactor promises to revolutionize the energy industry
    http://www.foxcrawl.com/2013/05/24/andrea-rossi-cold-fusion-e-cat-reactor-promises-to-revolutionize-the-energy-industry/

  • georgehants

    LENR Cars
    Self-Powered LENR Electric Car
    The perfect self-powered and maintenance free car
    electric batteries are autonomously recharged over night
    a single refill of fuel is enough to drive 45’000 km
    one refill costs $200 and is enough for a year
    http://www.lenr-cars.com/

    • LB

      There is more to a car than the engine. If this will end up as a power source in a car you will find it in the cars of the big companies
      Not in a wannabe car manufacturer with nothing more to show than a webpage with some pretty pictures on it.

      • Jonas

        Does some of those pictures reflect a Defkalion Hyperion with a Sterling engine..? At least I hadn’t seen those before, but they appear to be a year old?

      • fortyniner

        Powerful and reliable steam cars were made in the very early 20th century by what started out as garage enterprises. Many ‘kit cars’ are still being manufactured, often by very small companies, that selectively use commercial parts, up to and including whole cars minus the bodyshells.

        Given the huge investment of major car companies in IC and battery technologies, and R&D programs that run into decades, it seem entirely feasible to me that the first LENR cars might be built by entrepreneurs – IF small LENR units become available (which I doubt will be the case for decades).

        It seems probable that either a steam boiler, engine and condenser could replace the IC engine and gearbox in an existing conventional car, or a hybrid car might be adapted to utilise a small boiler/turbine/condenser to replace the IC engine. Either way, most of the work outside developing an LENR power unit is already done.

  • LB

    Yes this is good news…
    But I think a lot of people on this site, just like me, are hoping for this technology to be used as a decentralized power source.
    If you look at the founders of Elforsk you might not be totally wrong believing that is not the primary goal for them.

    I quote from their site:

    On 17 December 1992 Vattenfall, Svenska Kraftnät (Swedish national grid), Association of Swedish Electric Utilities’ (Svenska Elverksföreningen) and Swedish Power Association (Svenska Kraftverksföreningen) agreed to set up Elforsk – Swedish Electrical Utilities’ R & D Company (Svenska Elföretagens Forsknings- och Utvecklings- Elforsk – Aktiebolag). The jubilee will be specially celebrated in connection with Elforsk Day 2012, which is planned for 12 December. We are also producing a jubilee publication based on Elforsk celebrating 20 years. The theme for Elforsk Day is “Investment beyond 2020”, which is a relevant topic, not least bearing in mind the challenges facing society in terms of climate effectiveness and resource efficiency.

    • Gerrit

      Decentralized grid must not mean 1 power generator per household, it could just as well mean 1 generator per street / block / quarter / town. There will be enough work to keep these generators running and all interconnected. The work from the big electricity providers will change, but that means only those who can’t change quick enough will perish. It seems Elforsk wants to be at the very front of this new technology.

      • LB

        I agree

        • LB

          It would be a shame though if this technology which is such a good match for small generators (heat or electrical) that could be used in your own house was hindered or delayed by the big utilities.
          The government will surely be on their side. Why?
          The tax revenues of electrical energy, in Sweden at least, are huge. More than 50% of the price is tax and then add VAT on that.
          My house uses 30000kWh per year, most of it for heating. I´d love to ignite the Swedish economy by spending it in some other way :)

          • Ryan

            I personally hold that if adoption of LENR is applicable on a widescale of items (industry, shipping, vehicle power, home power, etc) then it will ultimately reach all of them as there will be a market for all areas. The argument that governments will reject them for households is, in my opinion, on shakey grounds. Given that power is such a major component and expense in almost everything we do as a society, as well as the immense expense of keeping a grid up and operational, if that component can be effectively negated or reduced in scope dramatically then over time less taxes would be necessary because costs across the board will have decreased. Even if the idea of home use was rejected outright by some in government (and their owners) a few more situations with major hurricanes or earthquakes would cause a furor of demand that would see them either about face on the topic or be removed from power. It is far simpler to handle a situation like that when power is distributed per household. Sure, some would still lose power but nothing like the scale we have now where a single event can put hundreds of thousands if not millions out of power.

            In my view it is more likely that we will first see distributed grids with neighborhoods in cities and towns getting their own power and over time as the technology develops we will see home based units gradually replace that as people recognize and become comfortable with the tech. Whatever the case, total conversion would still take decades and I could see keeping the energy taxes for a while if for no other reason than to help foster the rapid transfer over. If most, possibly everything is converted to a system that costs a tiny fraction of what we spend on energy now, there will not be a reason to have the tax. Getting to that point however may take some time and it certainly won’t be overnight even in the best case scenario.

            • fortyniner

              Regarding home/small scale LENR, all western govt’s would need to find a way to ‘meter’ output in some secure way. Without this, private small scale use would not be allowed.

              The most likely system is probably some kind of online link to a monitor within each device, so that usage can be ‘billed’ monthly or quarterly in the same way as any other utility. There would presumably be a way to simply close down the unit if any attempt is made to bypass the reporting system.

              If such a system could be developed then governments (and their owners/sponsors) would probably be quite happy to allow such devices. Any ‘bootlegging’ would be made a criminal act on ‘safety’ grounds on the (false) basis that the monitoring system is there to keep the reactors ‘safe’, and there would be great danger in not having such a system.

              • AlainCo

                ah ah, no need to think in the old box.
                remember when you paid internet access per kilobyte transfered ? or per minute ?
                now you pay just for the right to plug…
                maybe one day you will just pay for the right to consume a given power, whether you use it or not…
                or you will pay your generator, or pay a local street syndicate for energy production between neighbours…

                marke will change of structure, and government will adapt taxes… best way is to stick to usual VAT… what ever you do, it is taxed, moderately, without possible escape, and it tax imports like local production.

                other solution is taxing income.

                taxing companies have a sense if companies benefit from state infrastructure that are not present in country without taxes… otherwise it is just suicidal.

    • captain

      Sweden could be the first country to have Rossi’s commercial plants in operation.

      And in the meantime USPTO… What a shame!

    • Jonas

      This is my hope too, but hopefully – even though it will take some time – even a centralized source of lenr will have brought this tech to the ‘streets’, thus making it somewhat easier to start constructing DIY kits, and will also make it easier to start selling domestic entities, I think and hope.

      We must always work towards decentralization and self-sustainable living, and especielly this technology does have such possibilities in that regard.

  • Sanjeev

    I think this has crossed over from a phase of “Rossi says” to “Many reputed individuals and institutions say.” Important milestone.

    • Gerrit

      It also means that while we were discussing and wondering why we don’t hear anything from industry and institutions, something was going on behind the scenes. And it is starting to surface now.

    • captain

      Rossi’s words: …facts will speak for me!

  • Robyn Wyrick

    Well, I live in the U.S., so I have never heard of Elforsk, (or any other organization outside this country.)

    But giving a brief read to what I can find in English about this Elforsk character, if he says the E-Cat is real, than I believe him.

    (I am pretty sure he’s the guy that reforged Aragorn’s sword, and stood with Isildur above the fires of Mount Doom, so he knows a thing or two about heat.)

    Very exciting times.

    • Pekka Janhunen

      El-forsk means Electricity Research. It’s Swedish electrical utilities’ (Vattenfall etc.) common research and development body. It has existed for 20 years.

      • Blanco69

        Yes. The Swedes have played themselves into the game very well. Kullander, Essen and Lewans have obviously been working hard behind the scenes. Remember that Anders Aaberg of Vattenfall was interviewed on Swedish TV at the Geneva presentation. Plus Magnus Holm and the team at HydroFusion seem to be well placed to capture a decent slice of the European market. As this magnificent Game of Energy begins to develop accross the globe I guess the Swedes will be close to the centre of power, at least in the early stages. It’s great to be here guys.

      • Robyn Wyrick

        Sorry Pekka, just horsing around. It really is exciting, and I’m a bit giddy or punch drunk.

        • Pekka Janhunen

          Anyway thanks for your remark because it gave me the excuse to explain the etymology of “elforsk”.

  • roseland67

    IF, (see how big the IF is),
    The ECAT is as it appears, could you not all make a financial killing
    “shorting” oil and coal stocks.
    Instead of all of the mud flinging re: hot vs. cold,
    this would be an interesting test of whether you believe what you are told or not. What an incredible “I told you so” that would be.
    “I believed, I invested accordingly and I made a $ killing, you didn’t”.
    Has anyone on the side of “belief” done this yet, or is everyone still unsure?
    Don’t tell me what the big companies are doing, I am curious what you all are doing.

    • MStone

      Too early. Its like shorting IBM in 1977 because of intel and apple. Market penetration on this will span 20 years. If a monster company like GE has it. Stocks might rise akin to the last 14 years of gold. It would be a long term investment…not a yahoo.

      • Rockyspoon

        I think it will be quicker than that.

        For example, if you are thinking of replacing your car in the next five years, would you be foolish enough to purchase one with and internal combustion engine? I think not.

        Car sales would drop off precipitously and the only way auto manufacturers could survive is to quickly (within 2-3 years) offer their models with some sort of E-Cat engine. It could be electric or Sterling, or perhaps both. The engineering hasn’t been done yet to determine which is superior, but that doesn’t matter.

        What matters is that market forces for high-end energy-intensive consumer products could change the pardigm rather quickly.

        • Donald Duck

          The viability of the effect for simple consumer products depends on the physics involved, which is not remotely understood. I would go for 20 years at least before you might get it in a car if you were lucky.

          But even the existence of such an anomalous effect presages the existence of numerous other unknown effects that may alter the commercial and social reality as we know it. All the roads lead to the apocalypse, which is better if it is not too fast.

          • Rockyspoon

            I disagree, DD–an advancement like this should not be looked at as “the apocalypse”. I view it as a forward movement to be leveraged quickly rather than feared and delayed.

            And I submit the physics is better understood than most people realize, and the parameters that control the reaction (which is more important that an intricate theory of the process itself) have been known for over 10 years now and is based on earlier CF and anti-gravity experiments.

            Take a look at this series of videos narrated by Seattle4truth, which explains Frank Znidarsic’s mathematically-robust explanation not only of cold fusion, but of anti-gravity, direct calculation of Planck’s constant (a fudge factor Planck simply pulled from thin air to make his equations work; he never could calculate it directly), quantum transitions, and so much more–all explained in a classical framework using Hamiltonian and Newtonian equations, which is an astounding reversal of currently-accepted dogma.

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y356PNQw-mM

            The physics behind fire wasn’t understood for centuries yet during that time man harnessed it to his benefit. Some processes in your computer are still not completely understood. That doesn’t stop you from using it to great advantage. And cold fusion is simply a heat source–compared to your computer it’s not complicated at all. Just think of the man-hours and money poured into the PC compared to CF. I can almost invoke the theorem of limits here and get infinity.

    • Ryan

      As MStone said, its too early. Right now, at least from what Rossi has said on his part, he isn’t taking investments from those within normal means. As of yet I haven’t found any of the other groups really doing that either. As more information arises and we can determine who might be the big players in producing LENR devices we can more readily make decisions on who to invest in. Right now we simply don’t have enough information to move on. That’s why observing and taking in the information is important. We may not have the monetary might that some have but when/if something big does arise we have a better chance of being positioned to at least get in early on it.

      • NJT

        Yes, Those following this website will likely have a major opportunity for the first places in the line…

  • Jorge

    Anyone knows in which conditions did they performed the testing? E.g. did they had a device shipped to their labs, or did Rossi allowed them to perform those measurements at Leonardo?
    Cheers,
    Rui

    • http://www.e-catworld.com admin

      Hi, Rui

      The testing was done at Rossi’s R&D center in Ferrara, Italy.

  • GreenWin

    Dr Rossi could not find a better utility partner than Elforsk. They are widely diversified (hydro, wind, biofuel, nuclear, solar and LENR.) They have surplus funds to spend and are looking for innovation via many research programs:

    “In 2010 and 2011, Elforsk has been engaged in the establishment of the European Institute of Innovation and Technology (EIT) Knowledge and Innovation Communities (EIC) Inno-Energy project, which includes Uppsala University and the Royal Institute of Technology. This is one of six European nodes, aimed at creating a European counterpart to MIT in the USA.” http://www.elforsk.se/Global/Trycksaker%20och%20broschyrer/ENG_elforsk2012.pdf

    And with MIT wearing a big black eye in energy R&D (total hotfusion fail) – and Elforsk’s lead in LENR, it may take the crown. Utilizing Elforsk funding I expect to see a prototype 1MW HT-Cat (10 Tigers?) generating high temp dry steam for a ~300kWh generating plant. It is likely much further along than any have stated publicly.

    Another big feather for Ing Rossi. And a highly credible energy utility to partner with. Unstoppable.

    • Owen

      “But but… maybe there were hidden wires in the rack or energy beams directed at the reactor from a secret control room.”

      The wacko patho-skep arguments are crumbling really fast. Oh sure, like you’re going to fool Prof. Essen, former chairman of the Swedish Skeptics Society, with hidden wires and other amateur attempts at fraud.

      I concur with other posters here that this report is a major confirmation of Rossi’s work. His credibility has shot way up to the point where there’s a good chance an average scientist who reads the facts in this 3rd party report will be intrigued and look into this further. We’re at the tipping point now.

      • Owen

        Think of the odds of all this being a fraud. An energy research organization (Elforsk) that represents the energy providers in Sweden hired scientists they trust to evaluate Rossi’s device. The former chairman of the Swedish Skeptics Society was directly involved in the testing. The professors have put their careers at risk. No one yet to my knowledge has identified a major flaw in the testing that invalidates the results (I’ve read all the recent articles). And now the Swedish energy research organization is making a public statement saying they funded the test. A longer 6 month test is starting soon, so obviously they’re happy with the results of the first test. So the odds of this being a scam are about one in a million or less. Needless to say I’m super stoked on the possibilities.

        • exchemist

          I’d keep calm until the next test is done. Elforsk says that: ” What lies behind the extraordinary heat production can not be explained today. There has been speculation over whether there can be any form of nuclear transformation. However, this is highly questionable. To learn more about what is going on you have to learn what is happening with the fuel and the waste it produces.”

          This is a crucial caveat. As Elforsk acknowledges, we’ve seen only a demo, not a thorough scientific investigation. The “paper” has yet to be peer reviewed – and may never be if the quality of the work is felt to leave too many open questions.

          • fortyniner

            The statement is simple prudence. It would be very unwise for such a sober business organisation to appear to go out on a limb in this area. And it is no more than simple fact – the mechanism that produces the anomalous heat is at present unknown.

            Neither Elforsk nor the researchers have made any reference to a ‘demo’. The report is a research paper by any standards, and we do not yet know the reason why it has not (yet) been peer reviewed or published in print.

            The question at this stage is not how E-Cat works, but whether it works, and the Elforsk report has answered that question to the satisfaction of all but the most diehard skeptics. ‘How’ is clearly the object of the next phase of research.

          • Owen

            “Only a demo.” Give me a break. A team of international scientists studied and measured the E-Cat HT for over 200 hours and then wrote a 30 page report. Sounds like serious research to me. It must be serious research since Elforsk is going to invest more money for more testing.

            • exchemist

              Two points:

              1) As Elforsk points out, nobody has inspected the starting materials or the waste products. Nor has anyone been allowed to set up and run the device for themselves. Numerous aspects of this test were thus not under the control of the scientists, in the way that is generally expected in a thorough scientific experiment.

              2) Rossi is acting here as a businessman, with trade secrets to hide, rather than as a scientist, with new working of nature to reveal. Which is understandable, but a businessman runs a demo, not an experiment.

              These are the reasons I call it a demo.

              • GreenWin

                As many point out the validation is the work of 11 scientists and techs left alone and uninterrupted during three separate test periods, accumulating 200+ hours.

                Science must become a business if it is to produce products. The fact Elforsk is investing in E-Cat confirms this.

              • fortyniner

                Rossi may have been acting as a businessman, the Elforsk scientists were working as a research team.

                To call their experiments a demo, which of course is NOT acknowledged by Elforsk as you claimed, seems to be little more than an attempt to belittle the importance of these experiments.

        • Rockyspoon

          I hope they line up a dozen E-Cats in this upcoming extended test, each with a slightly different configuration, and run them in parallel to optimize return on information.

          Sure, it will cost more to run a dozen E-Cats and require a larger team of technicians, but 6 months is a long time to wait, and I’m sure at the end of testing just one unit, they’d realize there were different parameters that could have been investigated.

          Take my advice, Elforsk, and optimize test results by running a gang of E-Cats, each a different “color”.

          • Rockyspoon

            Or another approach is to make 5 E-Cat units exactly alike and run them under exactly equivalent circumstances, just to see how differently they behave.

            This may sound like unusual advice, but I once built three crystal pulling machines out of exactly the same components and found their behavior was surprisingly different–as if they were based on completely different configurations.

            Besides, the 1MW E-Cat contains over 100 E-Cats, so this experiement testing replication would not be trivial at all.

  • Andrew Macleod
  • Sean

    All this good news about ECAT yet when I look at some sites on the internet I am dismayed about disparaging reports of the claims. Even a high level inventive British nuclear scientist I know personally, states that CF is impossible. (He likes his uranium reactors and can explain them well + miniaturization neutron B, MOD stuff.) The truth is out there and I hope that soon we will all be enlightened by what is in the ECAT reactor and how it works. Just like we understand most of our everyday stuff. I choose to believe it works by the law of possibilities. If it were not for this site Ecat World, I would have given up on the idea long ago. If the science is there, I am sure parallel inventions are taking place right this minute. If so “competitiveness” and that is good for all of us that support LENR.

    • Roger Bird

      If a scientists says that something is true, he is probably right. If he says that something is impossible, then he may be wrong. Remember, Sean, that scientists said that heavier-than-air flight was impossible, in 1908, that drifting continents were impossible up until 1965, 50 years after Wegener said that it was happening. I could go on and on. Remember that the tools that conventional nuclear physicists use to “see” the sub-atomic world are traveling at close to the speed of light, where everything gets weird. How do we know that a wickedly fast neutron doesn’t have a bow-shock in front of it or behave in some other strange way to enhance the value of the Coulomb Barrier.

      • daniel maris

        They said the speed of light was X but they reduced it to walking pace putting it through special materials – and have even fixed it. That would have been “impossible” a few years ago.

      • GreenWin

        Yes. Perhaps more fascinating than LENR itself is this stunning display of denialism coming from the old school. Wow. The vitriol resulting from damaged egos is astonishing!

        • MStone

          I know. But, the interesting thing, that they are not realizing, is that their skepticism is preserved in amber on the internet. If LENR comes off, 10,000 Salieris’ will be exposed.

    • Rockyspoon

      The old generation of nuclear physicists are trained almost exclusively on the strong forces of the atom. We know very little about the weak forces, which is the realm of LENR.

      So your British nuclear scientist is correct when he states that CF is impossible if he stays within a strong-force explanation. But someday he’ll eat crow and realize there’s more to the nuclear world than his half education.

      • Sean

        Exactly! thank you for confirming. Some disciplines are too inflexible. Science is always changing and challenging.
        My own theory is there are five forces. Gravity, Magnetic, strong force, weak force. The 5th I surmise as intelligence. None of these forces are in existence without being observed by us (Including the universe). I design and engineer so in my mind I dream up a new product. I make it virtual 3d on the computer aided design for clarity. When I am satisfied I will send it to be built for real, using atoms / molecules with all their characteristics into reality (CNC). So I as a human am boss over these forces. These other four forces depend on us.

  • artefact

    I don’t know if this was mentioned before, I may be late, but the timetable for ICCF18 is filled with the speakers.
    http://iccf18.research.missouri.edu/program.php


    Startup Showcase
    Nicholas Chauvin | Robert Godes | John Hadjichristos DEFKALION | Mitchell Swartz

    Condensed Matter Nuclear Science – The Way Forward Panel: .., .., Joseph Zawodny

    Distributed Power Source Using Low Energy Nuclear Reactions
    Dr. George Miley

    Celani’s Wire Excess Heat Effect Replication
    Dr. Mathieu Valat

    Further progress/developments, on surface/bulk treated Constant wires, for anomalous heat generation by H2/D2 interaction
    Dr. Francesco Celani

  • Patrik
  • Omega Z

    I’ve pointed out the significance of the ELFORSK funding in a couple posts on a couple previous threads. Also the fact of their continued involvement. The 6 month test.

    This indicated to me that the tests were very Encouraging & hence I’ve given the detractors much less interest. As in their disinformation campaign is no longer of much significance.

    I don’t think Rossi was ecstatic because the HT-Cat Provided excess energy in this test, Rossi is ecstatic that it was to a magnitude to warrant continued involvement from ELFORSK. This is his Validation that he on the right track. Now all Rossi has to do is develop it’s potential to generate Electricity.

    Contrary to what many think, Generating Electricity is not a superficial Task. This isn’t a backyard You-tube boil water to run a simple generator. Making it commercially viable is a difference from Night to day. A Major Task.

    The steam has to be of a certain quality & provide specific pressure at a constant 24/7, 365 days a year. Believe me, You wouldn’t be a happy camper if every time you went to post on your favorite blog you computer shut down & rebooted.

  • Nelson Alencastro

    Mother nature thanks Andrea Rossi and the ones that support him for this extraordinary achievment.

  • artefact

    – cheap hats, cheap crows!
    Buy now. We expect the price to rise soon –

    • AB

      I think we’re going to need an independent test to verify whether the crows and hats work as claimed.

      • artefact

        You know, it is like with the fire. People used it without knowing the science behind it ;)

        • fortyniner

          ‘Fire’ is an obvious fra*d put about by an army of scam*ers intent on selling ‘matches’, ‘lighters’ and other purported fire-making magic beans to gullible mom and pop believers. It is clearly impossible for a solid object to turn into gas without an intense laser beam to make this happen, so anyone claiming to make fire without a laser is obviously engaged in this widespread con.

          It’s all done with smoke and mirrors, and it seems that some particularly clever con artists (mostly Italian) have even found ways to create this illusion without the mirrors, almost certainly by using hidden lasers. The fact that many sad and deluded victims of this fr*ud think that ‘fire’ is real, including a few easily-fooled scientists, simply makes this whole dog and pony show that much more hilarious.

          • artefact

            You convinced me. I will try to light my candles with a laser instead of a match this evening.
            My life has now improved enormously because I’m no longer living a lie. At my next BBQ I will think of you. (after having it started with a high energy laser)

          • Timar

            I suppose you start a blog, Peter, dedicated to exposing that ludicrous fra*d. You may call it shutdownprometheus.com

      • Tappanjack

        Only a good way to make them palatable, because there is going to be a lot eaten shortly;)

        • Rockyspoon

          Barbecued crow? Hat with sauce? I can envision it all now. And how appropriate.

          (Hey, blowback is very fair–had Rossi’s E-Cat failed this experiement, we’d never hear the end of “I told ya so!”‘s from all those pathological/uneducated deniers.)

  • Janne

    Hooray! For once the Swedes did something right.

    • Hampus

      What?

      • Janne

        I’m just yanking your chain. You did good.

    • Nisse

      Refrigerators, ball bearings, zippers, propeller daily used Swedish inventions. We did some things right.

      • freethinker

        There are also dynamite inventions in telecom ;)

      • ArtoE

        Eh… I assume that Janne is from Finland. I am as well but I definitely enjoy my refrigerators, ball bearings, zippers and stuff. So, thank you and keep inventing the good stuff (and keep testing weird but promising energy sources too).

        • Hampus

          Don’t forget Alfred Nobel and his Dynamite.

          • Timar

            …and Billy(tm), too!

          • fortyniner

            …swords, axes, longships. We have long memories here in deepest Somerset!

            A great battle with vikings was fought 1,100 years ago just a few hundred yards from where I live: “they were defeated with great slaughter … so that few of them came away, except only those only who swam out to the ships.
            (Anglo-Saxon Chronicle – 914 AD)

            (That lot may have been Danes, but the principle still applies!).

          • John Littlemist
    • LB

      Well I can only speak for my self but..

      I´m always right!
      Actually, one time I was wrong.
      It was when I thought I was wrong, but I was right!

      • fortyniner

        :) Must remember that one!

  • Bernie Koppenhofer

    Thanks Admin, good reporting. Congratulations to ELFORSK AB and Alba Langenskiöld Foundation they are putting US institutions to shame.

    • kasom

      i love this!

    • GreenWin

      Unfortunately, yes. For us Yanks.

      • Rockyspoon

        The US now has the worst political system on earth for there’s so much wasted potential. Just lies and scandal.

        There’s a similar counterpart to our Cold Fusion history of kicking P & F to the curb. The best retribution is to shove the noses of American scientists into a hot cat and let the blisters be a constant reminder every time they look in the mirror.

  • Roger Bird

    This is big news. Everything is about credibility. This imparts a great deal of credibility to the E-Cat. I said before and I will say it again, it is too late to suppress this thing. Don’t bother pestering patho-skeptics. They can’t do anything about it except embarrass themselves.

    • daniel maris

      Exactly – it has a very good credibility feeling about it.

    • NJT

      Yep, they will soon suffer on both ends, soiling their undies and eating those little round hats with the propellers on top – love it!

      • LB

        lol I don´t agree but that poetry makes funny images in my head :)

  • Roger Bird

    I think that we have gone past being able to quash this E-Cat phenomena. Too many people already know that it is for real. Too many people have seen it with their own eyes. “Experts” can say anything that they want and it will only slow down the rising tsunami. But the tsunami is inevitable.

    • Rockyspoon

      I used to wonder why Rossi was going to the bother of announcing what he was doing to the world. He was encountering so much negativism it didn’t seem worth the effort.

      But your comment is probably the best reason he did it–get the word out so those enemies that have played some very ugly games in the past wouldn’t have a chance against an informed public.

  • daniel maris

    This is very good news. I think in some ways this is even more important than the report itself.

    (I see Ecco the Dolphin has the same thought – perhaps we are right!).

    This might start more media interest.

  • Kim

    If we could get 1 more well rounded, well
    funded third party test, I think we have
    a chance of hitting critical mass or
    orbital velocity…

    Respect
    Kim

    • Alex

      We need a visable product on the market. Unless Nasa or someone huge confirms Rossi’s claims.

  • Chris I

    I wonder what the skeptopaths will say about this.

    No, I already know what they’ll say…

    • freethinker

      lol :) probably that now there are more fraudsters joining in.Or maybe that the “dum” swedes will we robbed of their well intended money. Lol in square. :D

    • Sanjeev

      I can suggest the headline for next Krivit article:
      Rossi steals 2 mil Kronas from top Swedish R&D org.

      ;)

      • Chris I

        They’ll more likely say Rossi paid the Swedes, as well as what FT says.

  • Jouni Tuomela

    Swedish people have always been smart, nearly as smart as we Finns.
    It is very reasonable to invest on getting clear results of such an important matter.
    They say:
    “Energikatalysatorn – (Rossi, E‐cat) – fördjupad granskning
    Mål
    Ända sedan Fleichman och Pons påstådda fusion i palladium 1989 har kall fusion varit
    omdebatterat. Ett flertal grupper har sedan dess kunnat visa på värmeproduktion i
    olika experiment som kan tyda på fusion. Uppfinnaren till energikatalysatorn, ”E-Cat”,
    är ingenjören Andrea Rossi. Det nya med uppfinningen är att den producerar tillräckligt
    med värme för praktiskt användbara ändamål, genom en hittills oförklarad process.
    Vid olika demonstrationer har enheter visats med effekten 10 kW. Värmeproduktionen
    är flerfaldigt större än vad som kan åstadkommas med konventionella
    förbränningsreaktioner. De kända komponenter som ingår är nickel i pulverfrom samt
    vätgas.
    Målet med Elforsks projekt är att:
    • Stödja vetenskapligt genomförda undersökningar som analyserar om
    energikatalysatorn E-Cat avger den värmeeffekt som har uppgivits i olika
    demonstrationer
    • Stödja försök att fastställa vilken process som kan orsaka värmeproduktionen
    och hur variation av olika parametrar kan inverka samt analysera eventuella
    risker eller andra negativa effekter
    • Analysera betydelsen av processen (om den fungerar) för framtida el- och
    värmeproduktion
    Aktiviteter
    Mätningar av värmeeffekten/värmeproduktionen genomförs och om resultaten är
    ”anmärkningsvärda” inleds analyser avseende bakomliggande processer. Baserat på
    resultaten från dessa arbeten inleds – om det finns skäl att gå vidare – i samverkan
    med olika energiexperter studier av framtida koncept för el- och värmeproduktion samt
    analyser avseende vilken betydelse energikatalysatorn kan få för den framtida
    energiproduktionen. ”

    Google translation:
    “Energy Catalyst – (Rossi, E-cat) – Depth Review
    Finish
    Ever since Fleichman and Pons claimed fusion in palladium 1989, cold fusion has been
    debated. Several groups have since been able to show heat production in
    various experiments that could indicate fusion. The inventor of the energy catalyzer, “E-Cat”
    is engineer Andrea Rossi. The novelty of the invention is that it produces enough
    with heat for practical purposes, by an as yet unexplained process.
    At various demonstrations units shown with 10 kW of power. Heat production
    is several times larger than what can be achieved by conventional
    combustion reactions. The known components are nickel powder from well
    hydrogen.
    The goal of Elforsks project are to:
    • Supporting scientific surveys that analyze the
    energy catalyst E-Cat delivers the heating effect has been reported in various
    demonstrations
    • Support efforts to determine the process that can cause heat
    and the variation of different parameters can influence and analyze possible
    risks or other adverse effects
    • Analyze the importance of the process (if it works) for future electricity and
    heat
    Activities
    Measurements of thermal power / heat production is carried out and the results are
    “Remarkable” begins testing for underlying processes. based on
    results of this work begins – if there is any reason to go on – in collaboration
    with various energy experts studying future concepts for electricity and heat production
    analyzes of the significance of the E-cat may have for future
    energy production.”

    • Gerrit

      do you have the source for this, I can’t find it on the net.

    • Nisse

      Swedish people have always been smart, nearly as smart as we Finns :)

      Best one today, U needed a swede to win World Cup in hockey :)….

      • Hampus

        Swedes and Finns are the same people, we have always been the same country until Russia took you over. That was indeed the larges defeat sweden ever had, our king even abdicated in shame because his country was now divided and we got some French general instead.

        • Timar

          Err.. the Finns speak a completely different non-indoeuropean language?

          • Bill

            Finns certainly more intelligent- they stayed out of the EEC

        • Chris I

          Apart from a 10% which is near the border, Finns are very different and more like Lithuanians and Estonians. They’re related to Mongolians and Tartars (and so are Hungarians).

  • freethinker

    This acknowledgement is very encouraging.

    With the positive report, more money will go to research this. Possibly some of the 2 million SEK will go into the 6 month project.

    Hopefully this is the first steps to a steep ascent to real significant funding and full scientific acceptance.

  • Methusela

    Excellent news :)

    • Ecco the Dolphin

      This is bigger news than the third party report!

      • GreenWin

        Correct, as it addresses the one area the old priesthood does not control – commercial power.