Zurich E-Cat Conference Thread (Day 1)

I thought I would create an open thread for people who are following the September 8-9th E-Cat Conference in Zurich. It can be a place where people can post significant news and information coming out of the conference. I have made some arrangements to have some conference attendees send me reports, but I don’t know for sure when those will arrive. I’m hoping for some live updates. I know that Sterling Allan of PESN will be there, and so there may be updates from the conference on PESWiki.com.

Here’s a link to a live stream of the conference provided by E-Cat Deutschland: http://www.ecat-deutschland.org/index.php/live-stream, which I hope will provide live video of the proceedings.

An alternative link to the live stream is here — seems more reliable than E-Cat Deutschland’s stream.

I can confirm that I have been sent the validation report that Andrea Rossi has been talking about, and will be discussing at the conference, and I will be free to publish that here on E-Cat World on September 9th.

Rossi said this about the report today:

I do not know, but my paper tomorrow will not be anything special: it will explain a R&D work, with the description of measures made on the Hot Cat: such R&D work will have to be completed, so many other tests will have to be done before having a high temperature industrial application.
We got encouraging results and we will describe them.

Please add news, information and comments below. I’ll add any significant information I come across to this post as the day progresses.

Here’s a link to the program — the conference starts at 2:00 p.m. Zurich time (GMT+1)

Rossi with bodyguards

I asked one of my contacts who is in Zurich what he thought the purpose of the meeting was. His response: “Mainly investors and contributers orientated. My best guess is that rossi wants to get a distribution infrastructure quickly. But I already met other physicists who are just very curious. I hope we get some answers and news too :)”

Rossi the rock star

Rossi has a fan.

As best as I could understand, Rossi said that the ‘Classic’ E-Cat has received safety certification by SGS. Apparently there are other ‘product’ certifications that need to be obtained. Not sure what the difference between the two kinds of certification are.


  • http://www.zazzle.com/energyrevolution Tony McDougall

    The 21st Century Energy Revolution has begun.

    http://www.zazzle.com/energyrevolution

  • GreenWin

    Very good comments Paul Fernhout. For some of us we find it beyond comprehension how vehement the denial of this potential energy source can be. Why after heaps and piles of data proving beyond a shadow of doubt, do the naysayers keep swinging their axes? If not in the pay of fossil or fission, is this unmitigated jealousy? Fear their fiefdoms will come down? Fear they are implicated in corruption and may be prosecuted??

    The universe is an ocean of energy. Energy is exchangeable to matter. So, there IS only abundance and plenty for all – provided the word is spread. Much of this denial began as religious fervor, with Bishop Irenaus of Lyon who hated heretics teaching early Christianity. It continues to this day in attempts (largely successful) to control the population by restricting knowledge, empowering fiefdoms and promoting ignorance.

    There IS plenty. The e-cat and other LENR technology will prove it with energy. And we need to move from fear-based agendas of shortage to learning we don’t have to fight over land, food, energy or water. What a great day that will be!!

    • GreenWin

      I will add a cautionary NOTE: Though we will soon learn the universe is abundant with energy and any matter we can imagine – it is not at all karmic. That is, the universe does not perfectly reflect the good, even when the good propagate positive energy and vibrations across its vast expanse.

      The universe is a distorted mirror in this respect, readily reflecting negative energy but not so often the positive. This too will have to change. Those who do good and are positive, MUST see that reflected back to their lives. Without this, there is only abundance meted out by an overly frugal master.

      • jacob

        GreenWin,thanks for your realistic outlook,I 2nd that.

        Abundance has always been here ,but knowledge to tap into it has been suppressed for centuries .

        The lack of knowledge has made us consumers of goods and services provided by our slavemasters in what appears to be a democracy ,but we live in a controlled world.

        There is enough for everybody,abundant energy,with abundant energy comes abundant food and products.

        It is where we are heading .

    • Tony76

      “find it beyond comprehension how vehement the denial”

      This is truly as interesting as the ecat phenomenon itself.

      It is analagous to religious faith. Both rooted in an existential framework that has massive inertia – quasi impossible to move it.The pathoskeptics are cerebral atheists who worship the quantum randomness of “modern science” Life and Big Bang theories. The hyper-logical mind cannot conceive that a world changing invention could come from a hairdresser (starlite) or a guy from an (alleged) diploma mill (ecat). In their view such inventions only come from government and corporate big-science.

      (Assuming ecat functional confirmation).
      This is a free lunch gifted by the Creator in order that Earth not self-destruct.

      On the subject of confirmation – has SGS confirmed their involvement?

      • GreenWin

        If this is a gift, it is given not only that the Earth evolve, but as a face palm to hyper-logics. A lot of humility and in some cases prosecution will be needed to clean things up.

    • http://www.electric-sailing.fi Pekka Janhunen

      Greenwin “we don’t have to fight over land, food, energy or water” True, except for land, E-cat doesn’t increase land area. But the place with plenty of real estate is space. LENR should help us getting there, if in no other way but by increasing the wealth so that the necessary initial investment can be found. Applying LENR directly to make launch vehicles cheaper might or might not be possible, too early to know.

      • GreenWin

        Very true Pekka. LENR can (with good engineering) deliver fresh water to arid lands that may have once appeared worthless. But low cost launch vehicles are an entirely new industry. And I’ve been thinking about a vacation home on Europa ever since hearing about water there :).

  • http://rossifocardifusion.com/author/john John De Herrera

    It looks like a THIRD INDUSTRIAL REVOLUTION has now started! Thanks to Andrea Rossi and his assistant Focardi, the world will have safe, clean, cheap and abundant energy supply. That will change our world substantially. Thanks to all who have participated, especially P&F, in the research on cold fusion. jdh

  • http://www.pdfernhout.net Paul Fernhout

    LENR’s success would likely totally transform the basis of our global economy from one assuming scarcity for one assuming abundance. When you have cheap energy (or even just cheap computing), almost everything else can become cheap via substitution (e.g. cheap energy means recycling almost anything is easy). So much of the perceived need for maintaining secrecy, for seeking patent protection, and even for finding investors for the e-Cat might just evaporate if more people realized that. I suggested that in a note to Andrea Rossi on January 2011, a copy of which is here:
    http://peswiki.com/index.php/OS:Economic_Transformation
    “The key point here is that breakthrough clean energy technologies will change the very nature of our economic system. They will shift the balance between four different interwoven economies we have always had (subsistence, gift, planned, and exchange). Inventors who have struggled so hard in a system currently dominated by exchange may have to think about the socioeconomic implications of their invention in causing a permanent economic phase change. A clean energy breakthrough will probably create a different balance of those four economies like toward greater local subsistence and more gift giving (as James P. Hogan talks about in Voyage From Yesteryear). So, to focus on making money in the old socioeconomic paradigm (like by focusing on restrictive patents) may be very ironic, compared to freely sharing a great gift with the world that may change the overall dynamics of our economy to the point where money does not matter very much anymore. …”

    The flip side of that coin is, if we don’t make the social phase change to an abundance oriented economy, then all this advanced technology of abundance would make fearsome weapons (e.g. e-Cat powered lasers or plasma beams). That would be a great irony if we then use e-Cat powered laser beams to fight over oil wells, water supplies, food, and even land and such. That would be ironic because cheap energy makes desalinating sea water easy, it makes creating fertilizer from the air easy, and it can support routine travel into space and the creation of space habitats from the asteroids and lunar material. We are going to need a social, economic, and even spiritual transformation if we are to survive this new energy technology and thrive in a healthy way with all the possibilities it would bring. Although, much the same is also true for several other technologies from nanotech to robotics to biotech — all of which could produce either universal abundance or universal oblivion, a theme Bucky Fuller talked about long ago.

    • Tony76

      The only claimants who see the big picture are the Pirelli School students and perhaps Celani. The rest are blinded by “making money in the old socioeconomic paradigm”.

      Good post, to the heart of the matter.

  • http://aotearoaisnotforsale.com Linda

    So when can I buy one?

    • jacob

      not sure !

  • artefact

    In the report I see all the shown pictures by Rossi.
    The leaked picture from cures has not the new developed black paint on it. It is just something gray. In the report you can (will) see a real black color around the cylinder.

    • Ged

      On man, where did you get the report, artefact?

      • artefact

        now you can read it in the next thread. I got it from.. somewhere :)

  • georgehants

    Listening to last night of the Proms and watching Rossi’s presentation on ECW. Wonderful.
    Thanks Frank and everybody for all the updates, if you would stay up all night and prepare a nice report for the morning that would be good.

    • GreenWin

      george, I like your style. Like the CEO who leaves the room and says, “Go ahead and finish up fellas…” As Kim says, Respect.

      • georgehants

        Ha, at my age it has to be.
        Now I wait for you techy guys to tell me if we have moved on.
        Nobody mentioned that Rossi’s bodyguards were in action, so I hope everything stays safe and calm.
        I have saved the theory report that interests me for tomorrow.

  • Francesco CH

    ! ! ! ROSSI EFFECT ! ! !

    *The “Rossi Effect” is verified*

    *The Power Source can not be of chemical nature*

    • Renzo

      On the Ragone chart the 600° ecat is out of scale :D

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ragone_chart

    • Ged

      This is indeed a watershed event. All the leaks have been confirmed now. The claims of Rossi have been backed up to the great majority. The data was stated and shown straight, no dressing it up, even when it wasn’t that favorable (COP 2.5 minimum isn’t the COP 6 the low temp E-cat can do).

      It is no longer a question of if Rossi is the real deal or not. Now, the only question remains is the applicability of the technology (is it useful if stuck at COP 2.5?), its cost effectiveness, and other such market/utilitarian details.

      • Wolf

        As I missed most of it: How was the data verified? Who did the measurements? I read something about SGS? Is there proof of this fact?

        • Ged

          Yep. A lot of the stuff here was Rossi reading from the report itself; which Frank is going to drop us (he just read pages 17 and some 18 a moment ago). The names of several people involved were also given.

          There were many pictures including thermal imaging you missed and other data presented.

          We have only to ask SGS directly, or get the certification number (which I think Rossi just read a second ago) and cross check to fully verify.

          • Wolf

            Thanks. Did he tell what type of certification SGS did? Just a safety certification? Or performance certification also?

            • Ged

              Safety certification I believe (so claims of COP are not fully investigated!), however performance data was presented as part of the safety test it seems, from what I gather from the talk (we’ll have to see to make sure when Frank puts it up). The machine was run independently by SGS, fully disassembled before and after being run. SGS ran the machine to its max to make sure it would be safe (can’t certify the safety of a toaster unless you plug it in and make toast ;) ).

              Edit: The thing to keep in mind is the talk is interlaced between the SGS stuff and the currently ongoing Hot Cat validation (performance) tests. And I may not have de-interlaced the two correctly at all points.

            • Ged

              hah, looks like the report we get is just part of the ongoing Hot Cat validation one. We’ll have to go to SGS specifically to see if they can verify the claims about them, and if they are willing to release the safety report if true.

      • Francesco CH

        This is well explained by Cures and Rossi.

        Basically the professors were EXTREMELY conservatives in measurements, at the point of “self-castration”, just to avoid any possible objections.

        However, real COP is higher. Precise measurements concerning COP will follow suit in the future.

        First: verify the existence of the effect

        Second: determine the size of the effect

  • Ged

    3.66 KWh in max, but missed what he said came out, as calculated by the blackbody radiative equation (which will give a very conservative estimate! as radiation isn’t the only energy transfer going on, with both convection and conduction siphoning off heat energy).

    • Ged

      Minimum COP of 2.5 using most conservative calculations possible, using several independent methods.

      Edit: This is apparently part of the report, or was during the certification process?

      Edit 2: did the calculation, at a COP 2.5, that’s 9.15 KW out. I did hear him say 9, but that’s all I caught earlier when he mentioned the power out. Certainly not the rosiest way to present the data, and thus strengthens it greatly.

      • admin

        No self sustain mode used in this high temperature test. Rossi mentioned problems still to solve with self sustain.

        • Ged

          Very interesting indeed!

        • artefact

          he said something about obstacles by the certifier

          • Ged

            It was stated awhile ago that the certifier says no to self sustaining from a safety point of view, not theoretical.

        • GreenWin

          I can imagine a NG driven high temp “hotcat” would be very interesting to the existing energy companies. It’s a hybrid and new energy supporters love hybrids (Toyota’s sold 3 million)

  • http://www.electric-sailing.fi Pekka Janhunen

    He said “thermal chamber”, but maybe he meant “thermal camera”

    • Ged

      I couldn’t follow that point either. Whatever it was, it was 3 cm away from something else in accordance to the manufacturer’s directions.

      Edit: Something about windows now, two of them, so camera sounds likely.

      Edit 2: Definitely thermal chamber being imaged by a thermal camera. The image is very interesting, surprisingly uniform in the long axis, but definitely an interesting profile.

      • Ged

        Measurements were showing 820 C or so temperatures. The uniform long axis is very good as it means there’s no glaring hot spots, and the reaction is well dispersed throughout the reactant material. Interesting to understand the slight gradient in the short (vertical) axis, but that might be from the curvature of the steel cylinder.

        • Ged

          Also, before anyone misunderstands, by uniform I’m seeing there isn’t huge hot spots that are hundred or more C different from surrounding areas. Such hot spots would be bad and keep a reaction from being stable (also, we don’t see any hot spot from resistive electrical heating, so this is a uniform reaction throughout the device that swamps that out).

    • Antonella

      camera means chamber in italian.

  • Francesco CH

    Rossi said that steel used is not AISI 316 as erroneously written in the report. It is AISI 310.

    • Ged

      Melting temp of stainless steel AISI 310 is 1454 °C

      Melting point of 316 is 1370-1400, so 310 is clearly superior for this application.

    • Ged

      Talking about the July hot cat tests now. 130-900 C temperature range, 2% measurement margin of error.

      • Andrew Macleod

        The ability to “dial” in a specific temp is great news. They must really know what’s going on in these reactors.

    • Ged

      Talking about frequency waves to drive resistance? Dang, having trouble following this at the moment. Something about high frequency waves not as effective, and 2 months still to go of testing this… frequency thing that’s going on…?

      • GreenWin

        The current feeding the drive resister is sometimes driven at frequencies from 5Hz to 50kHz+ – This is claimed source of NASA’s Plasmons for “heavy” electrons in the WL theory.

        Looks like Rossi is delivering just what he said he would. The written version of the report will give everyone plenty to scrap about. I expect the first attacks aimed at the professors and engineer authors of the report. We have Blacklight’s CIHT 6 recent validations as proof of the modus operendi.

      • Francesco CH

        It is a matter regarging some interferences generated by the electricity passing through the resistors. They resolved the problem by inserting a variac before the resistors.

        Not a big issue, but they fixed it just two days ago. Complete measurements released within two months.

  • Andre Blum

    I understand from Frank, who is in the lenrconnect chat box, that he will publish the report right after this presentation. (not tomorrow).

    • admin

      Yes, that’s correct, Andre. It’s already tomorrow in many parts of the world :)

      • Hampus

        Thank you so much frank for being so fast :) We have all been waiting for this soo long!

    • Ged

      I am Very much looking forward to it now!

    • GreenWin

      That will be a great relief to my eyes and strained hearing faculties!

  • Renzo

    I think this is the other engineer named by Rossi, but I didn’t understand exactly what his part was: http://tinyurl.com/8e8a566

    EDIT: from the audio it’s not clear if name is Penon or Peron, the one I linked has an excellent cv to make such measurements but I’m not sure

    • Ged

      we need a transcript of this whole talk. So many details are hard to nail due to this audio quality, and the amount of information being released.

    • http://www.electric-sailing.fi Pekka Janhunen

      If I understood and remember correctly he was an SGS safety engineer who certified the industrial units for safety.

    • Renzo

      the other option is this one, a consultant engineer but I can’t find any info about him
      http://www.paginegialle.it/abano-terme-pd/consulenza/penon-fabio

      • Renzo

        found his name in the order of engineers, ph.d in nuclear engineering in Bologna: http://tinyurl.com/cz9ykzb

        • Ged

          Very nice, that may well be the guy.

  • Francesco CH

    Ok,

    Rossi said that the professors were able to determine the nuclear nature of the process by measuring the consumption of hydrogen. Compared by the amount of the energy released during the process, hydrogen consumption was so small that chemical reactions could be excluded at all.

    • Ged

      That was the weight measurements he was reading the report was talking about earlier, it seems.

    • http://www.electric-sailing.fi Pekka Janhunen

      It is noteworthy that parts were weighed before assembly, and overall that it wasn’t measured as a “black box” (OK, it’s black) but we are told that it was taken apart by the testers/professors.

      • Ged

        Yep! He’s reading the report, and it states the E-cat was disassembled after running to verify each component was the same and to take the weight of it all after energy generation.

        Edit: 2.5 grams was lost due to dust loss during operation and hydrogen consumption.

        3.4 grams lost from hot cat cylinder due to partial melting/surface loss of steel?

        “it is particularly, particular….. hot” XD

  • Steve Bannister

    I believe Dr. Horst Eckardt, a close collaborator with Dr. Myron Evans, is present at this conference. If so, he should be discussing what I believe will become the preferred theoretical foundation for LENR. I do not see him on the agenda, but if anyone has other knowledge, please let us know.

    • artefact

      he now has a LENR theory which he sent to the Zürich conference.
      “Completed ECE Fermion Theory of LENR for Zurich Conference”
      http://drmyronevans.wordpress.com/2012/09/08/22710-completed-ece-fermion-theory-of-lenr-for-zurich-conference/

      • Steve Bannister

        precisely

      • Andrew Macleod

        Although I don’t understand most of what is written. If I understand correctly this prof has a working theory for lenr that fits into a universal field theory that replaces the standard model? And he is highly regarded in the scientific community? And he is working with Rossi? That’s awsome news!

        • Steve Bannister

          Correct on the theory, which has so many important implications, of which LENR is just one. Highly regarded depends on who is speaking. I have been following his work for over six years; I have forced myself through enough of the math to be comfortable with it; his theory far out-explains the standard model, or strings or just about anything around in mainstream physics. But, he is treated as a heretic by those whose funding would be threatened, and by other small minds. So in a way, he is a perfect theorist for LENR.

          • Ryan

            If anyone knows how to get ahold of this guy, they might tell him about Yuri Milner. He’s started up a new theoretical physics prize and has already given out millions to a small number of physicists with interesting theories, even if not proven. Here’s a link with more info: http://singularityhub.com/2012/08/29/tech-billionaire-milner-aims-to-accelerate-progress-by-bankrolling-science/

            • Steve Bannister

              He and his collaborators and supporters are aware of the Milner prize. I think it’s now a matter of finding the supporter(s) best placed to nominate.

  • Renzo

    He said he’s authorized to reveal 2 names of people who partecipated in the testing, one is Davide Bianchini who we already know about and who made radiation measures, the other one is engineer “Penon” (if I understand it correctly). The other parties involved don’t want to be named until the end of all tests.

    • Ged

      There’s that Hot Cat picture we got leaked by Cures :D

      Edit: The unnamed people are those currently testing the hot cat, from my understanding.

    • Ged

      New picture, but can’t make it out exactly…

      Something about weighing components and “charge” or “change”?

      • http://www.electric-sailing.fi Pekka Janhunen

        Weighs 4.3 kg

        • Ged

          Oh man, so many new pictures flashed past. I think I hear them (Rossi reading from the report) talking about taking the mass of the active “charge” (I guess they mean the active material) by total mass of the device minus all the inactive masses… and then evaluating this mass before and after running the e-cat?

          • Sanjeev

            Yes, before and after weights to rule out any hidden fuel.

            • Ged

              Very important and vital point.

        • Ged

          Active ‘charge’ is nickel, catalyst, and some material I missed the name of that holds the hydrogen.

          Edit: temperature controlled hydrogen storage by a molecular compound. Something that came out years ago, and there’s a variety of those compounds out there. Wonder which one this is.

          Edit 2: 1 gram of this mix can give 83,000 MWh?

        • Ged

          Resin(?) material that coats(or makes up the shell?) the Hot Cat can take up to 2120 C? Didn’t quite make that out, but important info. Well above the temp of nickel melting and reaction cessation. Definitely an important part of safety.

          Edit: Ok, the paint on the hot cat can radiate 1200 C and is made by a company that makes such paints for the engines of jet fighters.

          • http://www.electric-sailing.fi Pekka Janhunen

            1200 C, not 2120. They had the black paint specificially designed by some company that makes such paints for jet engines. (Edit: OK, Ged said the same.)

            • Ged

              Yeah, I originally heard wrong the first time he was talking about it XD. Sometimes it’s hard following the audio; I just totally misheard that whole paragraph of it being first mentioned.

            • artefact

              and the cost for the color of one cylinder is ~1000 Euro

              • Ged

                So pricy.. but important for proper radiation of heat at that high a level. At least we know hot cats won’t be cheap at this point in time, if it’s ~$2000 to paint one with its necessary dissapaitor material.

                So a 1 MW plant made out of 100 of them would be $200,000 just for the paint alone.

                • http://www.health-answers.co.uk Peter Roe

                  But paint would presumably not be needed if heat is removed another way (e.g. by coolant flow).

                • Ged

                  Good point, Peter. Very good point.

                • Sanjeev

                  Ged, that paint is there only for measurement purpose. The heat output was measured by a camera, so a black body is needed.

                  I could understand this much for now, but I’m sure that special paint is not necessary.

          • Renzo

            the same as told by Cures

    • Francesco CH

      Fabio Peron

      • admin

        Actually, Penon.

        • Francesco CH

          Thanks Frank!!!

    • GreenWin

      Bianchini is under contract to University Bologna as a “Technical Expert in Radiation Protection.” He appears to be the guy who can certify the lack of harmful radiation.

  • GreenWin

    From what I can glean from the live stream:

    “Classic” e-cat has received safety certification from SGS-Swiss company. More certifications for other variations (hitemp?) e-cats are in progress. Report prepared by Nuclear Engineer, at SGS?? And Dr. David ??? physicist from University Bologna…

    • Ged

      Heard all that too. Didn’t catch the names!
      One thing they were evaluating it for was radiation.

      The SGS people ran the e-cat device by themselves and did their tests on it as they chose, is another point that was stated but easy to miss.

    • artefact

      Dr. David Biancini from Bologna

      • Francesco CH

        BiancHini

    • Francesco CH

      David Bianchini

    • GreenWin

      AR did name both the SGS Engineer, AND the UniBologna Physicist who tested the Classic ecat for Safety Certification. Italian speakers may help with both names…

    • Sanjeev

      Yes, significant info.
      Two names are better than none.

      • Hampus

        Omg it’s happened!! Proof!!!

  • Sanjeev

    Certification by SGS makes the Ecat 99% real. This is a great news, perhaps most important since Oct 2011 demo.

    Rossi told that he will not reveal the names of independent testers. So its a bit disappointing.

    • Ged

      He won’t say the name of the independent testers currently testing the hot cat, but he just dropped the names of the SGS person and a Bologna professor.. Missed them both though.

      • http://www.electric-sailing.fi Pekka Janhunen

        The Bologna physicist was David Bianchini (I’m not 100% sure of the first name)

        • Ged

          Awesome, we must look up info on him after this is done.

        • admin

          Yes, that’s him. He was on an early video that Steve Krivit shot when he went to Bologna.

          • Ash

            Bianchini is a student a UniBo, not a professor or staff member. :/

            • admin
            • GreenWin

              Ash – you are wrong. Bianchini is not listed as a student but may be a grad student. He holds a MSc. degree and IS on paid University Bologna staff (I have the payroll document) as “Technical Expert in Radiation Protection.”

  • Marc Cleiren

    According to Rossi, it *is* SGS that is doing the safety certification..

    • Ged

      That has completed the safety certification, actually, according to his word.

    • Renzo

      I missed that phrase!

    • Martin

      OK, who calls or emails SGS and asks if this is true?

    • Andre Blum

      like I said earlier: it was denied, so it must be true :-)

  • Renzo

    And now for something completely different, it’s the time of our hero

    • Ged

      Now that we know the “bodyguards” aren’t, and just are engineers, one being Fulvio Fabiani… Who is that “fan” guy XD? He came right up on the stage!

      • Renzo

        he doesn’t look italian, I suppose he’s one of Schneider’s team!

    • Ged

      Darn, video contrast too poor to see what’s on the screen.

    • Ged

      Rossi has just said SGS has certified the low temp E-cat! Safety certification is complete! So that leak was accurate in the end, how amusing.

      Edit: Dang it, now he’s talking in italian. Gosh blast it.

      • http://www.electric-sailing.fi Pekka Janhunen

        … but for now only for safety, functionality test will come later if I understood correctly (Edit: Ok, Ged said that already…)

        • Ged

          Think so, thus the emphasis on the university/military colab to analyze long term hot cat performance.

          Still, safety certification requires the device was active and running to be tested. Just won’t look at hard performance data in a scientific way; just make sure it doesn’t do something dangerous.

  • Renzo

    Fulvio Fabiani now speaking, he presented himself as one of Andrea Rossi engineers

    • Ged

      Interesting, bumped him up from last of this block. Unless the stream didn’t show the other two presentations…

      • Renzo

        It is probably a change of schedule. Rossi and Holm will speak later

        • Ged

          Ok good, they are the ones I want to see.

    • Renzo

      it’s not clear from photo but isn’t Fabiani one of the supposed bodyguards?

      • Ged

        Looks like it might be. Those two “bodyguards” also look like brothers. In fact, twins even. So, they may simply be engineers.

        edit: funny how easy it is to judge a book by its cover, calling them bodyguards cause they are persons of larger disposition :P

        Edit 2: it’s definitely the “bodyguard”. When he turns around and we can see the back of his head and neck folds, there’s no mistaking him for anyone else.

        • Ged

          Err, by “it’s” I mean Fulvio Fabiani is. Now for the star of the show!

        • Renzo

          Plumbing takes strong arms ;)

  • Kim

    So whats the big deal?

    Einstein said energy in the mass

    Mushroom Cloud = Lots of energy and lots of poison

    Cold Fusion = Lots of energy and no poison

    Please turn the page already!!!!!!!!

    Respect
    Kim

    • Kim

      And what really bothers me is that the
      caveman want to cower in the corner ignorance.

      We sent great minds to college for a purpose.

      guess what – someone figured it out.

      We live in a sea of energy – what the heck is the
      big deal

      Respect
      Kim

      • GreenWin

        Kim, the light from new fire reveals the fear on those “cavemen’s” faces. So, they skitter into the dark and scribble graffiti on Frank’s wall… :)

        • Kim

          This is True!

          It’s all really comical for me watching
          college educated men deliberate about the
          idea that their may be a different way to
          get energy out of the atom. Duh.

          The fact of the anomalous energy has been
          established.

          Why are we having dinner and coffee breaks
          while great minds play with thier lap tops.

          Respect
          Kim

  • PaulSmith

    Glad to see sturdy German body guards protecting the future Noble Prize Winner!

  • http://www.zazzle.com/energyrevolution Tony McDougall

    That balding hippie with the camera is certainly a fan of AR :)

    Oop’s… did I put my foot in it! He could be a respected physicist working on a theory for LENR or, alternatively, he could he be a plant of Steven B Krivit :)

    • Ged

      Let me tell you something… that guy looks like most of the professors I have known XD.

      • http://www.zazzle.com/energyrevolution Tony McDougall

        The only professors I’ve come into contact with recently are in the field of medicine, and they are a bit more conservative.

        But you’re probably right about engineering and physics professors. They probably haven’t changed much since I went to Uni 30 years ago.

  • Lu

    Uta Stechal is speaking now. I notice no bruises or black eyes…. She has a translator but the audio is difficult to hear. Looks like the program is running about 1/2 hour late.

    • Ged

      Saw some graph things too, but couldn’t make them out or what they were about :(. Audio is too low quality to even follow the English reliably, what little of that there is.

  • Ged

    Guys, this isn’t a scientific conference, this is a business/investor conference. We’ve known that all along. If anything scientifically interesting or validation wise is going to be stated, it’ll likely be during that 8 pm their time, 2 pm EST/1 pm CST presentation today.

    If I have missed some sort of huge, blatant falsehood or disinformation, please point me to it, as I did just get here and could have missed much. So far in all the comments I’ve read, I haven’t seen a single unexpected thing. I am honestly confused by some folks here.

    • AB

      Adolf Schneider’s talk was terrible and unprofessional. He is owner of Transaltec and organizer of this conference.

      He frequently mentioned his four other “free energy devices”, talked about Tesla & the FBI, cited Zawodny as proof that LENR is real (remember Zawodny’s efforts to make it clear that he does not endorse the ecat?), showed an Italian TV show on Rossi (in Italian, no subtitles or translation), abused some of Prof. Petterson’s cautiously optimistic and reasonable comments as validation. I didn’t watch the whole thing so there is probably plenty more of these.

      Are you sure you don’t see anything wrong with that?

      • Ged

        I didn’t see his background/overview talk as I was asleep, but he isn’t important to me anyways; he isn’t Rossi and his talks were obviously just meaningless fluff as per any standard conference opening.

        None the less, I do see wrong about the “free energy devices” if he talked about such. I don’t see anything wrong with mentioning Zawodney as “proof” of LENR being real, which it is, and would only be wrong if he said it was specifically about the e-cat (which you did not say he said). Don’t see anything wrong about the Italian TV show. Don’t know what the Prof Petterson stuff is about, so you’ll have to clarify.

        So, that leaves with 1 thing wrong, 2 things ok/right, 1 thing unknown.

        How is this so terrible as you are making it sound? I must continue to fully disagree with you.

      • Andre Blum

        The only thing Ged and myself are saying is that it is not unexpected. This is what was in the program.

        These are the guys that have had the guts to do business with Rossi. And we all know Rossi is not easy to deal with. It is disappointing but nothing new that Rossi has attracted no big players, only private/ small&medium business entrepreneurs or wannabe-entrepreneurs, usually from related (heating, alternative energy) industries, to be his licensees. Most of them will have no experience talking on conferences like these.

        Also: Knowing Rossi, he has left these guys almost as much in the dark as he has left us. This is their first attempt for a gettogether to share knowledge, and probably also an attempt to tickle Rossi into releasing more info. They are trying to bring in their personal backgrounds, hoping it will be of help to others.

        This was not expected to be anything spectacular.

        • Jim Johnson

          “this is a business/investor conference”

          +1

          “These are the guys that have had the guts to do business with Rossi.”

          +1

          “This was not expected to be anything spectacular.”

          I dunno, it’s pretty spectacular that *investors* who have *enough guts to do business with Rossi* would put themselves out there like this.

          Which points to the idea that the main point of this conference was *FUND RAISING* for the Tier 1 investors to attract Tier 2 investors.

    • GreenWin

      Ged, the disparaging posters are here to ridicule, accuse, criticize prior to investigation. It is a first time convention of new sales people prior to a product launch. Darn! It is doubtful many critics have any product planning or manufacturing experience.

      The number and quality of negative comments indicates a preponderance of pathoskeps (why are they watching?) apparently disturbed by the commercialization of LENR. What’s new?

      • Ged

        I have been to so many presentations, and given so many presentations myself, I just have a different perspective on how presentations work — their purpose and content and limitations — especially when in an overall framework like a conference, than most people will have.

        AB is one of the great posters here; he isn’t trying to ridicule or deride for such in and of itself, I think. I may be at odds with him on this, but I fully respect his opinion. I just think he’s utterly mistaken in the import he is giving one fluff filled opening presentation (that wasn’t even that bad from the account he just gave above) by a name we don’t care about — and think the claim that this affects Rossi’s credibility is completely facetious. It’s like missing the mountain for a small tack.

        So far, it’s all been as expected. Even the description of Schneider’s presentation by AB is exactly what we expected from him.

        But you’re also right that some of the posts here have been disparaging for disparaging’s sake. And that is also completely expected.

        • GreenWin

          I agree Ged. I should probably expect negative reactions from people more tied to the science than the commercial side. Marketing departments are often at odds with engineering. Engineers cringe at the corny ways marketing people promote a technology, and marketers roll their eyes at engineering presentations. Such is the drama of life.

          • Ged

            That is absolutely true. Good to have that reminder of those two different perspectives.

  • Marius

    Frau Stechl is off the program?

    • Andre Blum

      no. speaking now.

    • Marius

      Ah she’s on now, just 40 minutes behind schedule

  • DaveS

    Any live tweets from the conference?

    • Andre Blum

      have not seen them. There is, however, a chat window in the second video link Frank provided.

      • Karl

        I’ve seen that one. It seemed for some time there came the usual negative childish comments about this conference as we see also see among the skeptics. It is quite difficult to follow though because of the sound quality and unless you can follow German fluently. Let’s wait and judge. To me is seems to be quite serious stuff.

        • http://www.zazzle.com/energyrevolution Tony McDougall

          The sound quality is typical for a conference with an audience full of engineers and scientists :(

  • Andre Blum

    (1) To everyone reacting disappointed about what they are seeing today: did you pay attention to the program at all? What else than this did you expect, based on that program?

    (2) Can someone enlighten me why e-Cat resellers (as seen on the eCat australia website, and now again from this German speaking guy) keep referring to solar energy as going along nicely with e-Cats? I totally don’t get that idea.

    • Ged

      1) the exciting stuff on the program isn’t even until 1 pm Central Standard Time, today. (if anyone here speaks the languages being used, as I don’t)

      2) Probably as a supplement to the fact solar power only works during the day, so what do you do at night? The E-cat would make a good way to fix up the difference at night. That or, they are thinking of using solar power to power the E-cat drive.

      • GreenWin

        Ged, unsurprisingly e-cat resellers are also resellers of alternative energy systems i.e. wind, solar, micro-hydro etc. They do not want to jeopardize their customer base with a new product that could make current customers look dumb. So, yeah, if you have a business (clearly few here do) you don’t undermine it with a new product intro.

        Actually the comments here indicate how far from the real world of products and economies many people are.

  • Renzo

    Hartmut Dobler who is speaking now is the CEO of a serious company
    http://www.dobler-heiztechnik.de

  • jfab

    All I can say is LOL, how pathetic. Rossi is insane! “The bigger the lie…”

    • Ged

      What makes you say that? No one so far has mentioned a single unreasonable thing going on at the conference. But I could be far behind.

    • http://www.health-answers.co.uk Peter Roe

      You almost certainly don’t know any more than the rest of us about the proceedings, so what exactly are you referring to? Or perhaps its just more important for you to make empty negative noises and indulge in a bit of 10-year-old name calling, than to keep quiet until you actually know something? (I apologise if you actually are 10 years old, by the way.)

      You’re beginning to sound more than a bit desperate, jfab. Chill out.

  • AB

    Who needs bodyguards when you’ve got Transaltec making a conference for you? So far the conference has killed the small amount of credibility that Rossi has accrued over time. Without credibility there’s no danger for Rossi.

    • Ged

      What in the world are you talking about?

    • Steve B

      however If he skrews up badly the Mafia may after him

      • Ged

        Only if he took mob money and they want it back. But this isn’t the godfather.

  • GreenWin

    From comments here it sounds like the orchestra is playing the score perfectly. A well orchestrated drama makes for great entertainment.