An Inspector Calls on Andrea Rossi (UPDATE: Rossi Comments)

A web site, Ecateu has posted documentation from an official report made by the Florida Bureau of Radiation Control (FBRC), a Florida regulatory agency charged with inspecting all nuclear materials activity within the state.

The public report from this investigation is published in its entirety on this site and includes a complaint from a citizen named Gary Wright, who expresses concern about the fact that Andrea Rossi may be manufacturing nuclear devices in Florida without a license. Wright states, “since these devices have been known to melt down and/or explode, and produce unknown quantities and types of radiation I feel very strongly that your department might want to investigate this matter.” Wright also includes a detailed history of Andrea Rossi outlining many of his activities and statements about his work on the E-Cat.

The report states that the original complaint was originally sent to the US Nuclear Regulatory Commission (NRC) who forward it on to the FBRC to conduct the investigation.

The incident description is as follows:

This is an NRC allegation forwarded to us for investigation It is alleged that owner is building a cold fusion reactor with no radioactive components that when running emits 511 keV gammas, strength unknown. Investigator talked to owner and found all production, distribution and use of these devices are overseas; therefore no action is required. Owner will seek Underwriter Laboratories (UL) approval for manufacture in the US when the time comes. No further action will be taken on this incident.

The following incident report was made on March 1 by a James Stokes:

I spoke to Dr Rossi concerning the construction and operation of his E-cat device. He stated the active ingredients are powdered nickel and a tablet containing a compound which releases hydrogen gas during the process. The output thermal energy is six times the electrical energy input. He acknowledged that no nuclear reactions occur during the process and that only low energy photons in the energy range 50-100 keV occur within the device. There are no radiation readings above background when the device is in operation. Since the device is not a reactor, the NRC does not have jurisdiction. Since there is no radioactive materials used in the construction and no radioactive waste is generated by it, the State of Florida, Bureau of Radiation Control has no jurisdiction. Currently, all production, distribution and use of these devices is overseas. Dr Rossi has arranged to meet with Underwriter Laboratories (UL) to seek approval for manufacturing in the United States. I thanked Dr Rossi for his time meeting with me.

James Stokes apparently met with Andrea Rossi at his corporate office in Miami — not at the factory he has mentioned many times, the whereabouts of which is still unknown. Rossi has said that a manufacturing facility is being prepared with a ‘robotized’ production line to make the 10 kW domestic E-Cats, but he hasn’t yet stated that production has begun on these devices. It is doubtful that any manufacturing will begin until Underwriters Laboratories safety certification is granted to Leonardo Corporation.

The first 1 MW plant E-Cat has been constructed in Rossi’s Bologna, Italy facilities. On the completion of this plant, Rossi says he will start manufacturing at least eleven more, but hasn’t stated where that work will take place.

It seems inevitable that as Andrea Rossi’s and Leonardo Corporation’s work on E-Cat technology becomes more widely know that there are going to be concerned people looking into what is going on. The secrecy in which the work is being done is bound to attract inquisitive followers of this story, especially when the claims about this technology are so groundbreaking. Rossi has managed to satisfy this particular investigator that there is nothing worth investigating from a regulatory point of view, but I am sure this will not deter those who are determined to uncover more about what is going on.

Plenty of people have motives to uncover more about Rossi’s activities. Competitors in the LENR field may want to stop him, environmentalists may fear radioactive contamination, investigators may want to uncover an elaborate hoax, and fans may just want to get a closer look at the E-Cat in production. Rossi seems intent on keeping his research and development, and manufacturing plans a secret, but I think it will be come more difficult for him to do this as time progresses.

UPDATE: Andrea commented on this story today on the Journal of Nuclear Physics

There is not “my version” , there is only one version of the Florida Bureau inspection at Leonardo Corporation, as a matter of fact it is the version derived from the actual facts: We have been very glad to receive their visit and we have explained to them all we had to. We agreed with them that we will keep them informed of all our developments and also explained to them that we do not use radioactive materials and do not produce radioactive materials. The persons we talked with are very prepared and expert, they have been right and correct, and I have been honoured to deal with them. What we said beyond this is confidential and I have nothing to add at all. I give no information at all regarding our factory, as I always said, until our production will be officially announced. I can say, and I am delighted to say this, that the Officers of the Florida State I have been contacted from are glad that we are making jobs in Florida with a company that respects the Law. Of course they will have free access to us in our Florida site, also to verify that we do not use radioactive material and we do not produce radioactive material and, also , we agreed that we will not sell in the USA the domestic E-Cats before the due certification, that will certify that no radiations are emitted from the E-Cats outside the body of the E-Cats while they are working.

  • http://www.american-reporter.com Joe Shea

    One thing about the “robotic” factory idea bothers me: If AR sold dozens of 1Mw reactors at $1.5 million each, he could not even make a dent in the cost of robtics gear to construct his devices – particularly sufficient robotics to build the planned 1 million of them. He would need at least a billion dollars to get started in earnest.

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  • jack

    Well, in Rossi’s case any news is good news. This seems to be the core element in his “business” strategy.

  • vbasic

    Wow! Miss a day at e-catworld, you miss a week. I thought it was going to be quiet for awhile.
    But this is a big deal.
    I think it shows Rossi has nothing much
    (to my dissappointment).
    I don’t blame the citizens who complained about the possible radiating reactors. Even people who just read up on the field remember what happened to Leclair and his cavitation LENR.
    Google “Leclair Lebid radiation sickness”. Their approach is more energetic and produced transmutations in the core and enough gamma to sicken them for about a year, with classic radiation exposure sickness. Serious stuff.
    So it makes sense Miami locals may worry.

    But I think this whole Florida Bureau of Radiation Control episode is hirarious. Rossi probably brought it on himself because of his claims. Big Factory under construction. Working 1MW device with American customer.
    The one sentence I really don’t understand is when asked by the inspector “He (Rossi) acknowledged that no nuclear reactions occur during the process.” Huh? Then what kind of reaction is it? He just may really have stepped in it.

    • Colin Connaughton

      Of course. So Rossi says there is no nuclear reaction? The Nasa video stated there was no loss of mass. So e=mc^2 where m=0 and so e=0. Ha! If there is a reaction at all I expect it is a chemical reaction and, since there is a catalyst involved, that would make sense as catalysts aid chemical reactions.

  • Jerry Green

    You think America has turned into a Communist country when you read some of these ignorant posts attacking Rossi – Rossi is a guy with a new innovation that could change life for all and he is being attacked on all sides by these “imbeciles” Big Oil Reps and the Krivet fan boys.

  • http://nuvolesenzafiltro.blogspot.com andrea.b

    I am sincerely looking forward to see the million robot-cats.
    Miew!
    Nine months to the domestic unit! Counting…
    LOL

  • Robert

    Will industrial spying be enough for u people!
    It’s incredible what people will do when completely
    Obsessed! And after u have all the info and maybe a
    Machine or 2 to take for a spin. What then will
    U poor slobs with nothing better to do turn to next??

    • NH

      Isn’t it the Truth. All the vitriole, hatred, and loathing exhibited within. And all behind a cover of public blog. Such a relief when there is the occassional erratic informational discourse rather than the insertion of one’s nose into someone else’s private business without being invited. Spouted like a gossip show. Manners rarely exist in this day and age, along with real understanding. But that’s ok, what comes around, goes around and those will fall into their own ideoloy and become victims of their own practices. You just can’t teach class.

      • Kim

        This is an example of what money does to
        people at a microcosm level…

        Look what money does to people at the
        macro level…

        Respect
        Kim

  • John

    Excellent news!

    I was getting worried that [somewhere between the payment for my E-Cat, and its arrival in my mailbox] Mr. Rossi would get a late regulatory “surprise” regarding the need to license through the NRC. Like an X-ray machine, (the best analogy), the E-Cat (E-Cat user???) will need to be NRC approved/licensed/certified.

    It is very good to hear the regulatory ball is rolling – especially since my acquaintances in the NRC could find nothing indicating NRC review was underway (I asked a couple of weeks ago…).

  • Sanjeev

    30 Minutes with Andrea Rossi
    http://youtu.be/9fef8sHD34M

    • Frank

      Very funny, in particular the part with the ‘unused hydrogen atoms going back into theire home [tablet] when no longer required’. :-)

      Also in his calculation of the hydrogen consumption, Rossi seems to consider that ALL of the mass of an hydrogen nucleus is set free as energy – not just the ‘mass-deficit’ of a fusion process!
      I don’t have any idea what strange theory Rossi therefor has.

    • Robert Mockan

      Interesting video. The part about powder and bar not exactly correct. It is not the surface area but the number of nuclear active sites. True that a large number of metal nano-particles of proper dimensions provides larger number nuclear active sites, but if the lattice structure of the bulk metal or alloy has the nuclear active site morphology then it would work as well. Until a better understanding of what constitutes a precise nuclear active site then having a large number of nano-particles is a shotgun approach to solving for higher thermal power to fuel mass ratio. The temperature of the reaction is much higher than the coolant because it seems the design has poor thermal conduction from the source to the sink. Getting production approval might be easier without using a compressed hydrogen gas tank, but military applications would probably go with high pressure hydrogen to enhance thermal conduction from the source to the sink. The working fluid at sink temperature needs to be raised for higher efficiency. The tef (thermal efficiency) = 6 for gas loading seems to be a design issue, since even back in early 90s the fused salt design using palladium and heavy hydrogen was doing over 15. So near future we could expect at least tef=15, and a higher temperature of the working fluid, enabling use of less expensive heat engines even if lower thermal conversion efficiency. From other information sources the “catalyst” does not seem to modify the reaction coordinates or rate, but activates metal surface for more concentration of atomic hydrogen on the metal surface (in the field it is realted to the “spillover” effect). This is consistent with typical catalyst chemistry. The video does not really add anything new to the subject. What is needed is a simple way to make fuel with the nuclear active sites. Simple mixing of chemicals under the proper conditions can make nano-particles with varied structure. And when electroplating and electroforming of nickel and other metals was being developed in the early 20th century there were many “failed” experiments where deposits had a rough powdery texture. It is a pity the laboratory journals from that era are not available today. I suspect LENR effects have been observed in many experiments having nothing to do with excess energy expectations, without any body the wiser.

    • Robert Mockan

      The biggest problem Rossi faces is people, just not in the way he might think.
      http://cagle.com/working/080222/tab.jpg

      Good luck Rossi in trying to change the world!

  • Frank

    CWatters
    March 12th, 2012 at 3:46 AM
    The BRC Incident Report says..

    “Currently all production, distribution and use of these devices is overseas”.

    Is theis correct? There no working ECAT in the USA?

    Andrea Rossi
    March 12th, 2012 at 10:03 AM
    Dear CWatters:
    We are manufacturing in the USA all what necessary to make the production, which also will be made in the USA, of the E-Cats, in our factory in Florida.
    All the other information is confidential and there is no reason at all for us to give more public information, presently, regarding our production present and future, mainly for safety and security reasons. We give only due information to the due Authority and our right to confidentiality and privacy must be respected. I received many other comments similar to yours, so this answer is valid for them as well.
    Warm Regards,
    A.R.
    ————–
    So, it seems Rossi changed his mind again (‘we are manufacturing in the USA … in our factory in Florida’)

    Anybody willing to check if their are any pending permits which could be associated with Rossi’s factory?
    http://www.dep.state.fl.us/secretary/info/permitting.htm
    I bet you will not find …

    • dragon

      At this point in time, regarding manufacturing E-Cat in USA… we have evidence of only one apartment in Miami.
      The only place in USA where Rossi is working on E-CAT is an apartment in Miami Florida, where all day long he is answering emails and posts like a deluded old con-man.

      More than that, we DO NOT HAVE EVIDENCE!
      We have lots of hope based on the assessments of the other respectable scientists (like Brian Josephson), that are starting now to retract their endorsement of Rossi’s E-Cat. So hope is fading.
      We have to ask ourselves what are the chances that in less than 1 month (March 2012) both Defkalion and Rossi to go dark regarding tests and verifiable statements? These companies are supposed to be thousands of miles away and not connected to each other. Where they connected after all? Is this just a Mafia side-operation (with Rossi as originator) that didn’t go as planned?

  • http://none.com Charles Ponzi

    Gary Wright’s methods are lowlife in my book. This is a case of the ends not justifying the means.

    • Ged

      True. That complaint was completely unjustified, as production of the device isn’t happening in the US, and we’ve known that the whole time. UL certification must happen first, and that’s months away.

      I’m not sure what all the uproar is about.

      • dragon

        I think the uproar is based on the conclusion that comes from the contradiction of Rossi’s statements to Public vs. his statements to US Government Body.
        It is pretty revealing and sad, in my opinion.
        And another thing is this Piantelli-Focardi thing, which I didn’t noticed before.

        • Ged

          I didn’t know of the Piantelli-Focardi thing either. They’ve been all but forgotten.

        • Ged

          Also, by “nuclear reactions”, the NRC means “fission”. Pretty sure they have nothing to do with fusion, and the FDA is the body that regulates radiation producing devices (e.g. microwaves, x-rays). The NRC regulates fissionable (radioactive) elements and material (e.g. Uranium, Sulfer35).

          Nothing Rossi told the government is anything different than what he’s said in his blog for months now, that’s the thing. He’s already been saying there’s no “nuclear reactions” in that sense, no production in the US until UL certification (let alone Florida), and no radiation produced outside the E-cat.

  • dragon

    Interesting. If you put the name of a certain person on your comment, or his website… then you get moderated by… moderators.

    • dragon

      Let me do the test. Krivit.

      • dragon
        • dragon
          • Robert Mockan

            Good reference you posted, dragon. I had not read it before but it confirms my speculations about others dancing little jigs and trying to get in front of the parade to lead it. That Piantelli would say that about Focardi is especially revealing. It means that Focardi violated implied confidentiality of information he acquired working with Piantelli, but still does not have a real understanding of what the LENR reaction is. This all reflects poorly on Rossi.
            Piantelli also nails relevant factors that increase the thermal power out per unit mass of nuclear active fuel. This all looks bad for Rossi, because any hint of fraud will doom his plans to market product. He might be funding his efforts himself, but if prospective buyers smell a rat, they will not be inclined to put out their own money.

        • Ged

          That timeline is fascinating, if overtly biased. Still has a lot of good material.

        • Robert Mockan

          Nothing in the time line leads one to think that Rossi had any involvement with LENR before 2007. Before that he was working on thermoelectrics. And before that in litigation about the waste to fuel business (some of that time spent in prison). And before that making the waste to fuel business.
          Does not really seem likely Rossi keeping credibility much longer even among people who know LENR is real.

          • dragon

            The sad conclusion based on the time-line can be resumed in:

            “If it looks like a duck, swims like a duck, and quacks like a duck, then it probably is a duck.”

            In this case Duck can be substitute to “Rossi=Dangerous and Elaborate Scam”.

            LENR has in front of it a bright and (hopefully) quick future. I know that.
            But Rossi (and now even Focardi) just went from shades of Grey to Dark in my book.

          • Ged

            I think they fooled themselves into thinking they could solve the LENR conundrum quick and shoot out a product after prototype phase; but it turned out to be much more difficult than they hoped.

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  • Jerry Green

    Paul Story you post a website ecatEU – but the URL is http://ecatdoteudotcom.wordpress – that is not ecatEU as you said .. seriously

  • QC-JYM

    That sounds like april’s fool, remember, Gary Wright is a singer from the 70’s (Dream weaver)!! Seems that FBRC has been taken for a ride!

  • Blanco69

    Why would the FBRC say everything is overseas but at the same time be very happy about the new manufacturing jobs in Florida? As usual, a perfectly clear situation is cleverly made ambiguous by Our Man in Florida!

  • s

    Even if Rossi and defkalion never manufacture or sell a LENR device, it’s possible some people might be making good money from the Ecat story and hype. Do an internet search on the terms below and you will see what I mean.

    “unique visitors” per month ads 2012

    • http://none.com Charles Ponzi

      What’s amazing is that the ads (that I see) are for fuel cells and green energy products. The very companies that will go out of business instantly if LENR ever proves to be a real viable option in energy production.

      • s

        You seem to be missing the point of my post perhaps a little. It is now possible for people to make 4 figures per month just from people viewing a page with adds. Clicking is no longer required. This is similar to the tv ad model. Perhaps, and this is only speculation on my part, the reason why so many ecat websites spin everything positive and might seem to quickly ban people who imply anything negative about the ecat is that website views, and ad revenue, will fall if people start thinking the ecat might never be manufactured or sold.

  • http://www.shake-speares-bible.com psi

    For another perspective, I highly recommend this recent blog: e-catsite.com. It contains an abundance of factual information supporting the authenticity of Rossi’s venture and giving some clues as to the “behind the scenes” relationships that are relevant to assessing Rossi’s credibility, especially in view of the barrage let loose by the Florida report: http://e-catsite.com/2012/03/11/the-e-cat-and-the-us-navy/

    • Robert Mockan

      Some big names are being dropped, but those same have a track record of involvment in dis-information campaigns. I notice in another article Rossi is saying it has taken him 18 years to develope the E-Cat. They are all trying to get in front of the parade. Thus far, we could step from 1992 and Piantelli, to the present, and not miss much. A lot more noise now. But the theory still has not been nailed done for the public. Previous efforts by others to commercialize the technology with products were stopped ( for example Patterson, the Case reactor, the LENT-1, the Fox charge cluster reactor, and so on).
      I’m not impressed with the band leaders.

  • NH

    An interesting read:
    http://e-catsite.com/

  • Frank

    Quote “I give no information at all regarding our factory, as I always said, until our production will be officially announced. I can say, and I am delighted to say this, that the Officers of the Florida State I have been contacted from are glad that we are making jobs in Florida with a company that respects the Law”

    If you read the whole 34 pages of the FBRC document, you will see that the FBRC doesn’t have any glue about an existing or planned e-cat factory.
    If Rossi is – as he announced many times – in progress of establishing a huge factory for the ‘robotized production’ of 1 Mio e-cats a year (the production should start this year), does anyone believe that he could do this without applying for building permits, buisness licenses etc. etc ???

    • daniel maris

      Yep, I believe it.

      He could take out a lease on an existing factory building maybe previously used for assembly of white goods e.g. washing machines and boilers. He could have done so under a different company name, as sole trader or whatever.

      He could be developing the robots in Italy (remember Fiat?).

      He doesn’t have to start with full one million production – do you believe everything businessmen tell you? :) He might start with one line producing perhaps 100,000 per annum.

      The casings may well be produced in China. My experience suggests he could get those made within two months of submitting good and accurate designs. Starting from now they would be available beginning of May.

      If he does it that way, the main permission he needs is the safety, which is perhaps why he has focussed our attention on Underwriters Labs. That might be the only permission he needs if he can evade nuclear licensing.

      • dragon

        All these efforts (specially the cases from China) will leave trails on the Internet (a photo of the E-Cat case or something), so it is very hard to do all this under the nose of Internet blogers that pay for this kinds of leaks.
        I Start to think that something is not “kosher” with Rossi. It looks like now it is well beyond industrial protection… it looks more and more of a scam. THe only way to really convince people is to make another (more open) demonstration with the new E-CAT and invite “Heavy” people to test it for us.

        • daniel maris

          Nonsense –

          If you’ve got the money you can send a design to China tomorrow and get them to knock it up in a few weeks. (Of course they probably copy it through to the secret police, but that’s another matter.)

          • Rogerborg

            And if you’re not completely insane, you’ll get your final design certified for domestic installation in your target markets before committed to mass producing it.

            Until that happens, there’s no product.

    • Ged

      I’ve always thought the location of the factor was/would be in the north eastern seaboard (New Hampshire), not Florida; ergo, there’d be no information in Florida to find.

  • http://blog.teledyn.com mrG

    I thought I had read this here, but perhaps not, perhaps it was on some other LENR site where I read someone say that the way to discover the location of Rossi’s plant in the US was to leak a tip to the NRC and follow the investigation; that appears to be what has happened here. The wording of the ‘complaint’ seems to me to be pretty close to the wording in that post whereever it was where I read it.

    So this may have been a troll, a journalist trying to get around Rossi’s silence by tapping his certifications process.

    • daniel maris

      I must say I applaud this gambit. Rossi can’t really expect to direct everything himself. If it’s a scam we are going to find out. If he’s genuine he ought to start opening up more.

    • Ged

      But why Florida? New Hampshire is where I’d look, where the “official” Leonardo corp HQ is supposedly located.

  • Pontus

    Rossi is very street wise. This prick who made the complaint is obviously an energy company stooge. Seems that Rossi dodged the bullet once again.

  • Jerry Green

    Rossi is a very clever business man with a great product and this is just more nonsense from the Hot Fusion Boys and Oil Reps trying to create more noise but that’s all it is.

  • Pizarro

    Lies and more lies … the game is over

    Goodbye dear Rossi

  • dragon

    Rossi! Come clean and show the damn E-cat robot factory. Show something to the public. At least show us the E-Cat in the new design and make another demonstration for us.

    • dragon

      Is there anybody here on this FORUM that know how to forcefully get to the truth with this E-CAT story? Anybody?

      • http://deadstickarizona-zedshort.blogspot.com/ Steve Robb

        Yes, contact a “mainstream” news organization that has the money enough to send people out to talk to the various parties involved in the story. The motivation for the investigation is that people are buying the exclusive distribution rights that may be of no value and may try to sell those rights to smaller investors. I doubt if they have money enough these days to pay for the shoe leather.

        • daniel maris

          YOu could apply to buy the machine and then write to your local trading standards (consumer protection) department, indicating you feared you were the victim of a scam on teh basis of the BRC report. That might get some attention.

          If Rossi is a scammer we need to smoke him out.

          If he is genuine we need to get him to do the right thing and make this known.

      • John

        How about a private investigator? Or just offer a large dollar amount to some low wage worker to spill the beans.

        Both of these techniques cost money, of course.

        • Robert Mockan

          If Dick Smith was sincere about his original offer, he would have had a file put together about Rossi and his activities. With his money, an investigator would have all the information about Rossi and the E-Cat in a few weeks tops. If there is a factory, Smith knows where it is. If Rossi is not legitimate Smith knows. Any question any person has about Rossi, Smith either knows or could find out in short time. Possibly the way to proceed about proving Rossi would be to contact Smith.

          • daniel maris

            Absolutely correct. There is a lot of shadow boxing going on.

      • Ged

        If we had someone in Italy to look at that Bolongia factory (where he’s been making E-cats in the past). That’s the start of the trail and the only place we can begin to reliably look.

        It’s a real quagmire, no doubt about it.