Energy Revolution Needed — Can Anyone Deliver LENR to the Masses?

As we look at the current volatility in energy markets where a spike in oil prices is threatening to put even more negative pressure on an already precarious world economy, it is clear that the world is ripe for a better energy solution. While staggering technological advances have taken place over recent years and decades in many industries, the energy industry has remained relatively unchanged.

While there are exceptions (e.g. nuclear fission, hydroelectric), we are still largely dependent on the burning of fossil fuels for our heating, electricity and transportation, and so long as that is the case we are going to be at the mercy of market forces that vary according to such things as geopolitical tensions, availability and discovery raw material reserves, costs of extraction and refining, etc. Energy prices rise and fall, but rising seems to be the long-term trend — and huge price spikes are possible in the face of international crises in energy producing regions such as the Middle East.

None of what I have said is news to anyone — it’s simply the reality of world economics, and to many it’s just the way things are, a situation that can’t be changed and something we must learn to live with, even if that means wars and international tensions, higher prices for goods and lower standards of living worldwide.

This would be the depressing reality if there were not the possibilities of better energy technologies on the horizon, and we are seeing great promise in the field of LENR/cold fusion. Certainly more attention is being paid to it now than at any time since it first burst on the scene in 1989, before rapidly falling out of favor. When you study the research that has been done in this area dispassionately, there seems to be firm evidence that it is possible to produce large amounts of excess heat from certain types of electrochemical reactions — heat that cannot be explained in terms of a normal chemical reaction — and it is possible now to conceive of LENR as a potential rival to fossil fuels.

The promise of LENR, however, does not amount to much if it stays in the realm of small-scale experiments in the laboratory environment. For LENR, or any new energy technology for that matter, to be of much use to the human race, it has to have a practical application, and ultimately this means producing energy technology on an industrial scale — and in today’s economic environment we really could benefit from seeing a new technology emerge as quickly as possible. This, of course, takes financial, engineering and manufacturing resources.

The goal of rapid production and proliferation of useful LENR technology at low cost is the stated goal of Andrea Rossi and Leonardo Corporation. Rossi is not shy in proclaiming that he wants to see a revolution happen, and it appears that he is fully committed to doing all in his power to make that a reality. There are also other players in this field — Defkalion, NASA, JET Energy, and others all believe they have discovered new and better ways to produce energy.
Whether anyone succeeds in their goals remains to be seen, but a heroic effort is needed by someone who has the vision, tenacity and ability to bring a much-needed improved energy technology to the masses.


  • tom h

    “Tests with the presence of high level Government officials have been concluded. Opinions and results were very positive.

    Announcements will be made upon mutual agreements, at a time yet to be defined.

    Tests continue with international Authorities in the coming weeks.

    DGT”

  • Kim

    Is Defkalion site down?

    Kim

    • Kim

      Should not they be reporting Test Results?

      Respect
      Kim

      • Geoff

        Looks like their complete failure to update on any progress about tests after stating that they would provide live updates, lends itself to this being a scam.

        I’m guessing they will continue to use the NDA as an excuse as to why they cannot release test details.

        • Daniel

          what would you do if u had a revolutionary technology in your hands that just about every major corporation in the world would want to get their hands on… Moreover that international patents were not yet approved on..

      • morse

        Have a little faith and patience, it’s been only 1 day.
        Give it til Monday

        • sapain

          yes waiting patiently, might not release anything until after the 96hr tests.

          • Kim

            They said they would involve
            the public with status updates
            videos, names ect.. ect…
            ad nauseum

            They are playing us.
            Buying time

            Respect
            Kim

          • psi

            Kim, what, exactly, would be the point in such “buying time.” You seem to think these people are morons.

  • sapain

    stanford and mit r into induction road charging for ev. mit can do 10kw up to 6.5 ft.
    another research group has finished stage 2 on iron catalysist for feul cells instead of platinium, getting go effeciencies.

  • Joe

    Rossi, Rossi, He’s Our Man, If He Can’t Do It, No One Can!

    The goal of rapid production and proliferation of useful LENR technology at low cost may be the stated goal of Andrea Rossi and Leonardo Corporation.

    His previous scheme, Rossi claimed he could achieve high efficiency from the Peltier effect to produce power. He demoed a small version of the device that appeared to produce 100 watt and when his larger devices were tested by real science they either produced no power or jut 1 watt versus the claimed 1000 watts.

    Nothing Rossi ever produced every lives up to his wild claims, he is just misunderstood.

    • http://www.forbes.com/sites/markgibbs/2012/02/24/dick-smith-rossi-e-cat-too-fantastic-to-be-true/ Geoff
      • Andrew Macleod

        Yea great article! Gibbs must be running out of topics because his latest is.. “The ECat is a scam because Dick Smith said so”. Did anyone else hear he backed out of the testing with Defkalion because of the NDA? I now refuse to post anything there.

        /boycot Forbes

        • sapain

          smith was commenting as lenr being perpetual or over unity, i wonder if he realizes that lenr is contained nanofusion. his statement is like the sun and hydrogen bomb don`t work because there perpetual.

  • sapain

    here`s a tidbit.
    look up-Maurizio Melis-smart city-radio 24.
    interview with Professor Peter Hagelstein from mit on cold fusion, lern.
    2 part interview.

    • morse

      Providing a link is too much work? :-)

  • tom h

    hey matt

    imo LENR is the only real hope, as its the only one that is even close (hopefully anyway) to being commercialised, but unless it happens within the time rossi has staed 2013 latest then i think it could be too late as once PO properly strikes, the energy might not be there too make and distribute them.

    lets see what/if defkalion annouces today, hopefully some good news.

    one more thing i would like to add though is LENR will not stop the coming economic collapse (2012/2013) its gonna happen guys stock up on water and food (atleast a months worth).

    • Matt S

      To be honest one of my own “pet theories” without sounding like a conspricy theorist, although it is hard not to be, is the reason that we are now seeing so much activity around lenr/cold fusion again is that PO is very much on the world leaders agendas. The P&F discredit came about as the oil co’s were not ready to let go of energy control and predictions for oil reserves 20 odd years ago were far healthier, so it does possibly seem now that we are now being “allowed” to look at lenr/cf again as we should have been before purely because of a highly possible forthcoming PO crisis that needs to be averted.

      Another easily shot down theory of mine (by myself as well) is that the climate debate is just a cover up for PO and a reason why we are being told to reduce emissions (oil usage)! But I quite welcome anyone to shoot that one down, like I say just a silly personal theory of mine.

  • tom h

    i must add one thing reserves does not matter there could be 10 trillion barrels underground but unless you can get it out quicker enough (rate of extraction) then it wont make a difference to PO.

    Now with conventional oil it is easy and quickly (and cheaply).extracted where as non conven oil is slow to extract and expensive to extract. So when you start loosing 5-10mill barrels a day from conventional oil (quick and easy), the non conven oil wont be able to replace it (slow extraction) as its slower to extract thus doesnt matter how many reserves are in the ground. If you dont understand this then i advice you to re research PO.

    example for you:

    my friend has 2litres of water in a bucket, i also have 2 litres of water, however mine is in a spray bottle (kitchen cleaner bottle etc) and the lid is stuck on.

    now my friend can tip her bucket up and the water spills out within seconds, however i have to keep spraying my water to get it out so it takes a lot longer.

    Not the best eg but best i could do off top of my head, anyone with a better one feel free to comment.

    • tom h

      to matt s

      • Matt S

        Hey Tom, I do understand the concept of Canadian oil tar sands and the difficult extraction and cost/environmental damage that such oil production would require. I entirely agree with you about it all. And it is very relevant to all of this as a debate.

        The fact that reports are stating so many new oil wells are being created is a major concern purely because the easy reach oil quantities in each of those new wells is no where near what the big easy oil finds were over the past 100 years, hence the high volume of new wells to make up for those huge reserves which are running out.

        All a very valid concern which more people should at least be aware of.

        Like I mentioned earlier, it was around 5 years ago when I was having sleepless nights about PO, and it was one of the reasons that I started looking at the possible alternatives such as it was then, cold fusion.

        If science could break the easy to extract hydrogen out of water issue then we could just about forget PO. The same goes with LENR should that become a reality, I think we are close on both, but time will tell and I know we do not have a lot of time but we do seem to be a whole lot closer even if these lenr theories are partly true.

        • sapain

          fracking water molecule, tough little nut to crack, they`re workingg hard on that little puzzle.

  • abc
  • John

    Is today we will hear about a new energy revolution? Defkalion said that today 24th of February they will start independent tests. So I guess it will not be long until we know if its a hoax or not.

    • Ged

      I am waiting excitedly to see what happens, one way or the other. Nothing out of Defkelion yet, except one comment in Greek today. But I would expect the testing would take time and likely go over the weekend.

  • morse

    We could use LENR in Europe. It would boost our economy and create jobs in different fields. But Europe is a sinking ship at the moment. They always look at other’s first, what will they do, how will they react. They even give 1 billion to the development of hot fusion. They lack vision and courage.

    • jurek

      It would destoy whole world economy. Think a little.

      • Alain

        joke ?
        it will save the economy from crash!
        it will kill the oligarch that control oil around the world, and put back competition in energy technology by creating the “local” option to power-plant, to force big-player to reduce their costs.
        It will kill renewable energy who don’t work and won’t soon.
        it will kill the expensive suicidal green jobs that destroy employment through the subsidies and taxes they needs to compensate their inefficiencies in term of human work, and resources.
        It will kill the climate mental depression by decarbonizing the energy at no cost, giving no possible painful solution to force us to apply (because the goal of some is not to solve climate problem but to punish us from our prometheanism).

        but I expect the lobby to invent bad reason to avoid LENR at home, usin FUD, precaution principle, cowardliness and neoreligiosity…

        no limit to stupidity and integrism.

        • Robert Mockan

          If the crash is desired to implement Agenda 21 deindustrialization, we should not expect LENR to alter oligarch plans. Also, even if LENR products becomes common, unless production can be distributed among users provided with information to make their own fuel and use it in simple designs they can procure easily and quickly, altering the worlds balance of power (pun intended) would take many years.
          100 million people waiting to buy a product from a factory making even 10 million a year, is a long wait for customer satisfaction. But if those 100 million people each contributed the labor and materials to build their own, simplified design, they might have product in a few weeks. Introducing LENR technology from the manufacturing viewpoint might require a paradigm change in production and distribution methodology.

          • Steve Robb

            Think of the cost of producing your own electric fired space heater. It would be at least five times more expensive, clunky and unreliable and possibly dangerous. There won’t be a single factory running but will be many dozens in time.

          • Robert Mockan

            Supposing you could make LENR fuel by mixing a few readily available chemicals. The active material would easily separated and made ready for use. Then you put this material into a steel drum, like a 55 gallon size oil drum, and you insulate the drum with fiberglass insulation readily available and used in house construction. Then, using some simple method, you turn the reactor on, and it generates a megawatt of thermal energy at high temperature. Suppose further that the fuel, or catalyst, whatever, is not damaged by temperature spikes, and works well from a few hundred degress to a thousand degrees, and more so, the temperature is easily controlled. When you want steam, you wrap a coil of tubing around the drum under the insulation, and pass water through the coil. Finally, you get steam that can be used directly in a steam engine.

            That is the kind of LENR I’m talking about.

          • Robert Mockan

            @Steve Robb

            I hear you. But read my other comment. I’m not talking about people making E-Cats, but rather a simplified, modified, improved method, to make megawatt reactors that can be “easily’ adapted to power vehicles of all kinds, or to use in any house. Think of cost of a dollar a kilowatt, not $1000, or $100, or even $10.

            If such a design existed, it would sell.

      • Andrew Macleod

        The changes would happen so slow that the economy would have time to adjust. Rossi producing 1,000,000 units a year only displaces 10,000,000 Kw of current usage. The world uses about 14 terawatts that’s 14,000,000,000 000 watts. At that rate of production it would take 1400 years for a total transition to LENR. Also assuming that usage doesn’t go up.

        • sapain

          rossi will produce 1mill units, dgt will produce through liciencing 18×300,000 units, others will step in, world production will probably be over 10 mill units a yr or more.
          hydroelectric will stay, solar will continue.

          • Andrew Macleod

            Even at that rate it will still take 480 years.

          • Andrew Macleod

            Even If Rossi produces 14,000,000 units a year this will only account for 1% of the market

          • dragon

            When, LENR becomes worldwide available… we will have production of 1 to 10 million 45KW Hyperion and 10KW E-cat per year or more.
            When competitors will go into it …then, 2-3 years later we will go to up 1000 times more production then in early days.
            EVERYBODY will want to be involved!

          • Andrew Macleod

            The point I’m trying to make is It’s not going to ruin the economy. They can’t produce them fast enough to do that.

          • sapain

            with china, japan, india, pak, all net importers of energy start producing lenr units, 20 yrs for full implementation.

          • Andrew Macleod

            For this to happen 70,000,000 10/Kw units/yr would have to be produced. Not likely.

          • Matt S

            Andrew I see your point, but think of this; if the world currently produces around 50m road vehicles per year, which as you know is a highly complex bit of kit in terms of a manufactured product, then it is not a great leap of imagination that at least 70m lenr type devices (which rossi has said are quite basic) could quite easily be achived if the demand was there, and if these devices do actually work then the demand would most certainly be there.

            IF these devices do work and they can be easily manufactured then at least 70m of them will be produced in something like a war time effort that gets the world working again and possibly kicks starts the world economy?

          • Steve Robb

            Solar (with the exception of south facing windows) will be gone in a flash, so too will wind and fission. I cannot wait to hear of all the hot fusionists looking for work.

          • sapain

            silicon is heat dependant for production, with lenr, silicon production cost would drop dramatically and would end up being cost competitive with lenr.
            wind would problably go, tidal and ocean current electrical gen. would increase.
            would it be wise to rely on one source to carry the load.
            silicon energy is almost maintaince free.

        • sapain

          once lenr kicks in, how much energy would b used yearly and how much would it lower the 14 terawatts.
          oil extraction, shipping, refining and maintaince loss.
          electrical line loss.
          increased thermal barriers due to lowered cost of styrofoams for buildings.
          effeciency gains by using evehicles.

  • Tom h

    “the problem today
    is that demand is increasing faster than
    oil production”

    That is what peak oil is about!! And no not long term by 2015 at the latest. You obviously have not researced peak oil.

    • Matt S

      Tom, around 5 or so years ago I had the same peak oil dread that you seem to be going through at the moment and I was more or less looking at getting a farm somewhere remote so that I could become self sustaining and avoid any oil wars that would happen someday soon…

      I’ve since come to the realisation that humans are a very inventive lot; something some day will come along to wipe all of those peak oil worries away. It could be an lenr revolution or it could be something else, but I do understand where you are coming from.

      In the meantime you should read this report; https://www.citigroupgeo.com/pdf/SEUNHGJJ.pdf
      This is all about shale oil, using similar extraction techniques that have helped shale gas to become so readily available. I cannot see this being a long term solution to be honest and it is not the end of all of our oil concerns but it will extend our supplies a bit more until something far more cleaner and more efficient comes along.

      Also according to this report the US is indeed now a net exporter of oil, how true this is down to further research but I think you may possibly be wrong to admonish some posters on here for their previous claims.

      I stand by my belief that IF an lenr/and or another energy tech revolution was to come say tomorrow, the big oil companies would have a few decades still to get the most money out of it as it would take many, many years for the majority of people or companies to be able to switch over and purchase and afford a new lenr charged electric car/van/truck/airliner! The people who say that a lenr/energy breakthrough will damage the world economy are really not seeing the larger picture here, sorry the more likely scenario is that the world economy will receive a huge boost.

      But I also believe that it will not stop the big oil companies doing their level best to slow down any new energy breakthroughs in the meantime especially if they have a stay of execution as it were with shale oil.

      • Bruno

        The US in NOT a net exporter of oil. It is now a net exporter of REFINED oil products. There is a huge difference, like comparing a mouse to an elephant.

        • Matt S

          Refined oil, absolutely I apologise that is what I meant to say. But if you believe a citigroup (futures trader report!) you will notice that there is a self sustainablity trend of oil in the US as a possible reality. Not entirely sure what that means for the rest of us, do we fight it out between us? Who really knows?

      • tom h

        ive seen that report already:
        1) never believe a bank
        2)deutsche bank seem to think different
        http://longfinance.net/images/
        reports/pdf/db_shale_2011.pdf

        as for the rest of your post i dont worry about PO ive come to terms with the FACT, i just try spread awareness to hopefully help a few families that will listen.

        2nd the only reason business as usual is still continuing is because non conventional oil (tar sands etc) have been replacing the depleting conventional oil, however as conventional oil depletes even more non conventional wont be able to keep up, thus creating shortages and forcing the price up sky high. This will happen by 2015 at the latest.

      • Wizer13

        I totally agree with you Matt S. If new energy source appears, the economy will just make a slow transition. The economy cannot just decarbonised itself, even if many (like myself) would like that to happen.
        And, just telling, the corporates will try to make us pay for energy for as long as they can. Control energy, and you control everything. There were many inventions through the last century that could have have change everything, but were silenced because : OH my ! Free energy ! No more taxes ? How preposturous ! There are other ways to produce energy for transportation, so, let’s just wait and see.

        • Steve Robb

          Would you please name some of those inventions that have disappeared or been suppressed that would have changed this nations use of energy or production that would have made a serious impact?

          • wizer13

            Well, one example that comes to my mind is the water car from Stanley Meyer back in the 90′s. This is a favorite among conspiracy theorists. Some may tell this was a scam, but, hey, with other people showing same results, or the Pantone motor (another one from conspiracy theorists) that gained 50 % energy from water, just imagine the impact on oil consumption if all cars used this technology. As for myself, I think it really works. Too many people tried it and tell the same story.

            If not for indivual vehicules, I think of Maglev trains in asia (I know they weren’t suppressed and cost a lot to produce). If not, there’s one kind of tramway which uses compressed air in Jakarta, the Aeromovel – which only work in hot climates though. If investments were made in a king of tramway system using hydroelectric or nuclear energy going all the way through america and Canada, Europe and asia, they could secure exchange, create employment, and make a great mean of transportation just to travel, as everything would be thought to last.

            Yeah, a fool’s hope, but a hope nonetheless. Sometimes, it is better to hope than despair.

  • Brad Arnold

    First, peak oil is something long term to be concerned with – the problem today is that demand is increasing faster than oil production.

    Second, Obama is just preaching to the choir – it is hard to believe that he hasn’t been informed yet about Defkalion’s probable independent verification in the next month.

    Third, I sincerely doubt there is going to be the market crash that some people are predicting when LENR emerges – look at how hard it is to convince people that LENR is even real (a fact proven repeatedly in a lab). There probably isn’t going to be a sudden market epiphany.

    • Robert Mockan

      The creature in the White House has revealed even an ignorance of Constitutional Law, a subject it allegedly taught. It would be very wrong to assume it has any knowledge of Defkalion. Even if it was told by advisors, that does not mean it has any comprehension.

    • Andrew Macleod

      Sadly even with 1,000,000 ecats being produced every year it would still take hundreds of years to put a dent in the current energy market.

      • Steve Robb

        One factory producing one million per year is just the start.

  • Robert Mockan

    Deliver to the masses?
    It might take almost a step by step description of making the fuel and using it in simple do it yourself reactors, that an 8 year old can follow, to “deliver to the masses”.
    It is an interesting problem that I’ve been looking at.

    • dragon

      It is easy to deliver it to the masses. You just need the good will to do it. It is THAT simple.

      • Robert Mockan

        LOL! If it was only a matter of good will!
        Most people are science, technology, AND math challenged. That is why I said it needs to be communicated in a way so an 8 year old can do it. How do you explain even the measuring and mixing of chemicals if the listener has no understanding of basic chemistry? Also try to educate about measurements and chemistry? Or try to explain the thermodynamics of heat exchangers when the listener does not even have a clear understanding of what that means? How do you describe the shaping of metal to one who may never have used machine tools? A video seems almost essential. You know, show and tell. See and do. But that still leaves communicating the details to go along with the video. It is not a simple problem.

        • J

          Writing that people are “science, technology, AND math challenged” is redundantly redundant. Following a recipe to bake a cake involves “the measuring and mixing of chemicals” which is done routinely by those with “no understanding of basic chemistry”. What precisely are your credentials, oh most lofty wizard of shaming judgement? And if Obama is a “creature” what would one call Bush, perhaps a deceitful, treasonous troglodyte?

          • sapain

            i once asked a builder, how do u square ur structure, they started talking about using a square and other things, i replied, the sq. root of a2 +b2, they gave me a puzzled look.
            go onto the street and ask the aver. person simple things about science and c what happens. ask, how do u get the area of a circle, what is the differnce between fission and fusion, what is the acceleration of gravity.
            even baking a cake takes learnig and practice, i realized long ago that theory and practical use r totally different.
            a baker uses an electic oven, then one day they get a gas oven and tries to figure out how to make it work.
            political groups and their politicans r no more than a group of lobbyist going for self interests. if politicans really cared about energy self sufficiency, there would b silicon cell plants in every territory of this planet putting pv on every roof oof this planet.

          • Robert Mockan

            Worked a few years in manufacturing. I have a resume around somewhere. I think it says in positions held have been a supervisor in charge of testing products to environmental standards, a quality assurance engineer in charge of special projects with military clearance (forget level), an associate engineer in charge of building computer based diagnostic equipment for product analysis, that also involved writing the machine level and assembly level code. That was up to about 30 years ago. Sometime back then also wrote tests that applicants for jobs in the technician departments had to pass to be hired, organized product repair departments, trained personal in assembly tasks and as machine operators, and so on. After that just a manufacturing engineer and production manager. Normal stuff. None of which qualifies me to be a lofty wizard, obviously. But last time I measured ingredients and baked a cake I did not need to understand chemical equations and reaction stoichiometry, required working with industrial chemicals for conformal coatings, catalyzing polymer reactions, de-greasing equipment, ultrasonic cleaners, powder coating, adhesive bonding, and so on. A lot of technical writing over the years has revealed that communicating effectively to people without the hands on experience of production and manufacturing requires shifting to lower gears of explanation, so to speak. I’ve hired and worked with people in industry who were very good with “tribal” knowledge, and with a few who might be called fair “textbook” technicians, but unless they were in design engineering and upper management level, they could not communicate details of the science, technology, or math describing their tasks, if their lives depended on it.
            Technical writing is not difficult, just an interesting problem to determine what level to proceed with. As to Bush, some people might think of him that way. I hold a lessor opinion of him.

          • Robert Mockan

            @ sapian

            I’ve worked functionally as a general manager for contractors doing facility construction in buildings for manufacturing or production, (although actual position was manufacturing engineer I got called on a lot to do tasks no body else wanted, or sometimes were unable to do). I can understand the builders puzzlement in your example. Although today it is easy to square a structure by centering a laser rangefinder and measuring the diagonals, typically in construction the floor is obstructed, so they would use levels and squares at the corners, and tape measures along the walls. Even though getting a contractors license can be a tough effort, many do not have formal education above high school, and even then might not need a lot of technical math in their work. I agree with your comment about solar cells on roofs. In the USA if any real desire was to reduce foreign oil dependence, automobiles would also have been converted to using natural gas for fuel years ago, while substitute fuels made using photosynthesis were developed.

  • Pingback: Energy Revolution Needed — Can Anyone Deliver LENR to the Masses? | ColdFusionBlog.net

  • Joseph Fine

    The US Administration’s decisions on the Keystone Pipeline, Oil exploration restrictions, ethanol subsidies (which have mostly stopped), Solyndra and other Solar expenditures et cetera, make sense only if the Govt. knows LENR is real and that increasing the rate of use of other energy sources is a waste of money. I find it quite difficult to believe the US government does not know about LENR or E-Cats. There may be less noble goals in funding wasteful energy loans and subsidies – that is, to get votes or make a fast buck while accomplishing nothing. (Making hay while the sun shines.) The high and increasing cost of energy will get the publics’ attention. Especially if the cost of oil doubles or even triples.

    If we can manage the economic shocks both good and bad,

    • Joseph Fine

      If we manage the economic shocks both good and bad, looking back at today’s energy choices may show that the government and some industries in the know decided not to invest hundreds of billions of dollars on a resource (oil) that could be worth less than $30/barrel in a decade.

    • Luca Salvarani

      I have been thinking on it… and I hope so: what you writes would make perfectly sense…. but we must also consider the deep ideology of mr Obama and his costituencies.. Hope the first one.

    • admin

      Hi Joseph,

      I have wondered about how high up knowledge of LENR goes in the US Government. From what the president said today, it might not be on his radar yet”

      “President Obama admitted today that he does not have a “silver bullet” solution for skyrocketing gas prices, but he proposed alternative energy sources such as “a plant-like substance, algae” as a way of cutting dependence on oil by 17 percent.

      “We’re making new investments in the development of gasoline, diesel, and jet fuel that’s actually made from a plant-like substance, algae — you’ve got a bunch of algae out here,” Obama said at the University of Miami today. “If we can figure out how to make energy out of that, we’ll be doing alright. Believe it or not, we could replace up to 17 percent of the oil we import for transportation with this fuel that we can grow right here in America.”

      http://campaign2012.washingtonexaminer.com/blogs/beltway-confidential/obama-use-algae-substitute-oil/391536

      • Paul Richards

        Obama does have a “silver bullet”, all he has to do is stop the “quantitative easing” this has been the basis of the dollars per barrel prices increase. Given the Federal Reserve is demanding it he won’t pull the trigger and kill the energy increase.

        • Brad Arnold

          Quantitive easing is the basis of dollars per barrel price increase? Man, you’ve really drank the cool-aid. Maybe that flies inside the bubble, but it is nonsense in the real world. US dollar inflation has nothing to do with the price rise in oil – get real buddy and stop being the tool of the Republican party.

      • dragon

        Obama is not working for the people but for the elite. So for sure he knows about LENR… and he tries to keep it hidden with all his powers.

        • Steve Robb

          Obama is a clever clerk. He has little originality. There is no wild card hidden within him. He displays none of the “crazy” needed by a leader that would make him capable of pulling a rabbit out of his hat. Obama won’t know anything about LENR until Steven Chu tells him and that won’t be for another year and when the e-cat hit the shelves and they suddenly realize someone wants to sell nuclear reactors.

    • J

      Why would one implicate “Solyndra and other Solar expenditures” as “wasteful energy loans and subsidies”, without lumping in the several orders of magnitude greater loans, subsidies, and outright taxpayer handouts to petroleum and nuclear fission unless one was either pathetically ignorant of the topic or shamefully hiding an agenda of misinformation?

  • Sparks

    It is disconcerting that many posters on this site consider peak oil to be (direct quote, here), “BULLOCKS” and, er, “DOOM CRYING”, I believe was the term. I hope the believers and supporters of LENR are not these same folks, because if they are, it rather undermines the value of their LENR convictions. I would hope that there are some believer in peak oil (meaning, sound thinkers who are guided by scientific principles and fact) who also believe LENR will become a viable energy source. Folks, read the postings of tom h throughout this session. Tom h gets it exactly right. I’ve studied these issues for 3 years now. The world is in overshoot.

    • http://www.lepost.fr/perso/sophareth/ sophareth camsonne

      A Rossi , certainly.

      • http://www.lepost.fr/perso/sophareth/ sophareth camsonne

        Andrea Rossi
        February 22nd, 2012 at 5:12 PM
        Dear Charlie Sutherland:
        We are working very hard on this issue. I can say you, based on the last weeks improvements, that for the industrial plants we probably are very close to the production of electric power: if we reach 260 Celsius the efficiencies will be around 30-33%, and we will be able to make power plants of 25 MW. For the domestic things will be more difficult, but we will get also this target, sooner or later.
        Your considerations, anyway, are right.
        Warm Regards,
        A.R.

        • Brad Arnold

          Defkalion says they get a temperature of around 900C (although they still are stuck with a hydrogen tank attached to the reaction chamber).

          • Alain

            compared to e-cat they have higher temperature (415C max in the early spec, 900C recently), and alos they use higher H pressure (50 bars it seems, and a bottle of 200bars)

            reaction seems different from e-cat

  • http://www.nickelpower.org Bruce Fast

    The assumption that LENR will save the economy is misplaced. Once the dust has settled, an LENR world will be economically much better, but not in the short term. Mass produced LENR will create a severe shock to the economy. This kind of shock will be worse for a while before it gets better. As the current economy in the “first world” is so precarious, I expect that the LENR shock will be enough to topple the whole system.

    • http://E-Catworld TimTim

      And that’s a good thing.
      Serving banksters vs Free Energy Revolution.
      Cruel slavery vs equitable freedom.
      All brought to you by … Free Energy
      … from Dr. Rossi.

      Enough with pathetic inertia to preserve banking cartel. Toppling the bad system is good.

      • J

        I don’t believe Mr. Rossi has completed a PhD, so the “Dr.” title may be premature. Neither did Mr. Edison or Mr. Land early on; but plenty of honorary doctorates will follow if he is for real.

        • Andrew Macleod

          He graduated with honors I do believe 110/110

          • J

            I graduated with highest honors. That does not grant me a PhD. What is your point?

    • Luca Salvarani

      You should explain what “save the economy” really means? It depends a lot on what model you have in mind! For me LENR will enormously benefit the economy (in the short or mid term…) because I’m have an Austrian point of view (Mises, Hayek, Rothbart, Milton Friedman..). The majority now are telling the same but when they can notice for example that a lot of workers will lose their jobs (because turn obsolete), a lot of companies will default, a lot of financial assets will devalue… so very few people will think lenr benefit the economy…

    • sapain

      a shock to whom, the elite or the middle class and poor.
      lenr will start at the bottom. the money saved will trikle up to the elites. this trikle up will magnify by the time it goes from middle class to the elites.
      one person saving $2500 per yr x 1 billion people is alot of $ not making it to the top.

      • Al D

        There are currently a little less that 200,000 people directly employed in the oil and gas industry in the US. Add to that all of the office and billing personnel and the consequential persons (gas stations, distribution network, truckers, electrical power generation, maintenance, grid support and you are probably talking about several million jobs plus the families that they support along with the trillions of dollars in infrastructure that would have to be written down and the banking industry and stockholders that support them.

        It will be quite a shock!

        • sapain

          jobs mentioned will be rerooted to other fields, high rise agriculture, offshore development, hydrogen plants, desaltation plants, ocean mining etc. electrical generation will be used to support industrial output, truckers will always b needed.
          the revenue for development will come from the savers with excess to now spend.
          if all of a sudden u had an extra $5k a yr what would u do.
          space will become a hugh frontier. jobs will always b as long as the imagination is furtile.
          robotics displaced alot of people and still continues,computers and the internet displaced alot of workers,what happened, they went to different fields, people adapted.
          with the lowering of personal cost there won`t b a shock, only the deflection of capital.

      • Andrew Macleod

        It always trickles to the top. It just hast to take a different path.

    • Philip

      The idea that new technologies creates these huge, destructive “shocks” to the economy is very exaggerated. Its true that new technology and industries do cause to disruption to the workforce, but in a health competitive market there is always disruption and reshuffling of the workforce. Actually, if there weren’t any disruptions in our economy that would be an indication of a stagnant economy that is not growing.

      • Alain

        in fact the key factor is the structural monopoly linked with a technology, it’s dependency on resource, capital or on work, it’s capacity to be copied despite patent/IP

        LENR is much better in that domain than oil.
        oil technology (engine, power plant) is structurally a monopoly on resources, huge need of investment to get the resource (thus monopoly), geographic inequality (geopolitical problems,corruption) … it has allow the cartel of 7 sisters to control the production.
        non crony capitalism works only on machines, not on resource, to create competition…

        with LENR Ni+H the resource is a non problem (energy of the worls with 33% efficiency to electricity, result in 10% of today nickel production)..
        the patent and IP seems not to be problems, since ther are many variants of reaction and “catalyst”…

        in fact the main cost is investment in reactors, and maintenance.
        in fact work.

        very good for the social structure, much better than oil.
        a bit like the car industry have been for the big growth of 50-70s…

    • daniel maris

      I agree Bruce and in fact it would be better if it was brought in gradually beginning with central electricity generation. But I agree that the overall result must be good in terms of raising the productivity of the whole planet and bringing cheap energy to poor people.

  • sapain

    the state of mankind is caused by the slow over take of reliance on others instead of themselves. this reliance on others created the state at which a few could exploit the whole. the few set up the laws to protect this state, ie. patent protection for 30yrs, corporations and it`s laws, fiat currency.
    solar energy itself can power the world. patents have kept the price artifically high for 30yrs and kept the price out of range for the whole.
    silicon energy is actually cheap to produce. commercial silicon (98% purity) costs around $1/lb.
    electronic grade (99.9) costs around $200/lb, quite a jump.
    to purify silicon it is put in an inert gas, heated to melting point and slowly rotated (speed determines ingot diameter size) and drawn.
    silicon ingots r then sliced and diced, using diamond saw, water jet tech can replace diamond saws.
    the silicon wafers r then heated and a dopant is applied by infusion, (preesure over time) and then waffer plating for circuit grid. finally assembly under a temported glass and aluninium frame.
    for the cost of a nuclear power station, 100 silicon factories can b set up. add in replication to the system and presto self sustained energy.
    the average home needs around 7kwhrs per day. a 1500w system can meet the needs easily.
    so why is it not done. silicon cells lasts for 50 plus yrs and can b recycled, i believe silicon cells can last a lot longer than that, say a 1000 yrs. silicon cells produced 30 yrs ago r still going strong. just another illusion created by the few.
    with something that lasts and puts out energy for free, yes free, once it`s paid for than the rest is for free, the few can not make and maintain their artifical and illusionitory system.
    the few use debt, ie. morgages, loans and inflated land prices to enslave the whole to lower and stagnate the whole`s ability to aquire the buying power to purchase low energy systems. ie. i can not afford solar, i have a morgage, car loan, utility bills etc. the home costs $100k add interest over 30yrs, actual cost $200k (a $100k goes to the few). how many solar panels can u buy for a $100k. apply this to everything else.
    electric transportation can b powered by solar using on the fly charging, ie induction, and battery or hydrogen for off road use. (mellenium challenge used solar to power a ship to travel around the world)
    so that is the problem, what is the solution.
    i use silicon energy, it`s paid for(pay back time was under 5 yrs) and i have free energy for the next 50yrs, and the people that acquire it will have free energy for their time span.
    i use the temp. of winter to preserve my food, use the heat of the sun to warm my home (pay back time, one winter) and the light to power my appliances. i use gravity to collect and filter my water.
    rossi, dgt and a few others r fighting the few who control this rigged game.
    until lenr comes on line, learn how to manufactor silicon, ie. silicon based thermite reactions and flood the market, this will help to lower the price. use bikes and ebikes for transportation under 40km, i love ebikes they r cool and fun and most of all cheap- no insurance, low maintaince and fuel cost. form groups to invest and produce silicon cells, a few million and ur off and running. spend time learning about and how to built alternative systems to lower ur cost of energy. use sand filtered rain water to lower water costs, use plastic pop bottles, collect glass to build a passive solar heat collector to save u heating costs.
    one gal of feul oil=35 kwhrs or 35000w for 1hr or 1 kw for 35hrs or 9.9w/sec. the sun gives 1kw/m2/sec. a aver home with a south wall 3m x 10m will give 30m2 x 1 kw/m2/sec=30kw/sec. take the cost of fuel and apply it.
    for 2 gallons of flat black paint, $100 in 2x4s and an investment in glazing can save u alot in heating cost. ALSO a solar wall creates an added thermal barrier for reduced night time heat losses. design it as a solarium to produce food. a few black pipes laid on the black surface to preheat water.
    what i would do first to b self sufficent in energy, 1-build a solar wall or solarium, 3m x 10m costs around $800, saves u $800 on heating and x amount on food per yr.
    2-use savings from solar heating plus buy one silcon panel per yr for 5yrs and u will have a 2kw elecrtical system.
    so the solution is simple, start doing things that use that fusion reactor in the sky and quit playing the fews game of reliance and become self reliant.
    tomorro the dgt tests start, keep the fingers and toes crossed and good luck to the whole.

  • tom h

    dont worry about it mate and i have replied but again its ended up at the top :/ strang.

    • tom h

      stupid laptop again for Luca Salvarani

      • Luca Salvarani

        Very gentle…

  • tom h

    yes i agree we COULD save lots if energy if we 1) stopped wasting it on needless things 2) use more enetgy efficient technology.

    the reason i say could is because we needed to start doing these things years ago! you need to read the Hirsch report:
    full report:
    http://www.netl.doe.gov/publications/others/pdf/
    Oil_Peaking_NETL.pdf

    slimmed down version:
    http://www.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hirsch_report

    The Hirsch Report is a risk mitigation study
    on Peak Oil released in early 2005,
    commissioned by the US Department of
    Energy

    Main points from report:
    1)Waiting until world oil production peaks
    before taking crash program action leaves
    the world with a significant liquid fuel
    deficit for more than two decades.

    2)nitiating a mitigation crash program 10
    years before world oil peaking helps
    considerably but still leaves a liquid fuels
    shortfall roughly a decade after the time
    that oil would have peaked.

    3)Initiating a mitigation crash program 20
    years before peaking appears to offer the
    possibility of avoiding a world liquid fuels
    shortfall for the forecast period.

    Basically weve left it too late to do what you say it should of been started in the 70s after america suffered peak oil !

    As for the unconventional gas (shale) im not even going there the shale bubble will pop within a year or two its not economically viable. As for tar sands etc yes there are vast reserves but it costs alot more than conventional oil and you will NEVER be able to get it out the ground quick enough for it to make any meaningful difference to the loss of conventional oil.

    Sorry to say mate your living in a dream as i said only hope is LENR so you best get praying its real otherwise your gonna have a nasty shock within next few years when civilisation collapses.

    • tom h

      For Luca Salvarani

    • Luca Salvarani

      To tom

      1) I believe in LENR exactly like you!
      2) The main difference between us is that I don’t think there’s a real phisical shortage! I don’t trust any PEAK! I simply think that oligopolistic suppliers have a great market power and consumers not at all..this is the real reason of energy high costs! And it’s the same path for a lot of other products/ services that curretly cost much less than only few years ago.

      • tom h

        Luca

        i can see im not getting anywhere with you basically look up a term called EROEI, then look up the EROEI for said energy. If you still believe in what you say then fair play i like cornicopians they give you hope, however i am a realist.

        • Luca Salvarani

          To Tom

          I know Eroei.. because I thinked exactly like you reading the same arguments! However we agree on the most important thing: LENR (in particular I hope E-Cat but it doesn’t matter). With some fortune LENR will solve all these problems and turn all of us happy!

    • daniel maris

      I’m all in favour of green energy and am a great fan of LENR. Doesn’t mean I have to buy into this peak oil crock. Long before the oil runs out the price signals will make people change technologies. Cars can for instance run perfectly well on natural gas and don’t take too much adaptation to do so.There’s plenty of natural gas left.

      Long before we reach the oil and gas crises we will have an LENR solution I believe.

      • http://E-Catworld TimTim

        Reduction in the abundance over time leads to zero. So, even if there is 90% oil or natural gas is left… how moral is it to consume it if can live happier without consuming it?

        There are enough people like you…
        “There’s plenty of natural gas left. ” … who’ve aided the entitlement monster we’ve created.

        What entitles you to “finish-up” all the ‘natural-gas’? … It’s natural gas not your gas or Big Oils’ gas or a nation’s gas. I guess, you are ok with killing the endangered species as long as a banker pays million dollars in fine that he prints using fractional banking.

        Grow up.

        • daniel maris

          It’s perfectly moral if the time horizon is 100 years. Within that time,even if didnt have LENR green energy will be able to carry the burden.

          I don’t believe in hairshirt economics. Energy is there to make the good life for us.

      • Sparks

        Peak oil is now established fact, whether you “buy into” it or not. Here is the blueprint for the future — you would do well to heed it: Economic growth for the OECD nations is now over and done. From here forward, all OECD economies will stagnate and decline, much like Japan, but terminally so, due to the oil shortfall. China and India use oil much more efficiently and will continue to spurt upward economically for a couple of years, at the expense of the OECD nations, then they will peter out as well. If we convert the “fleet” to natural gas, there will no longer be “plenty of natural gas left” for the enormous increase in rate of consumption that will occur as a result.

        • Tom h

          This!!

  • tom h

    i apologise my friend, didnt mean to be abusive! please read my post and the links provided or do your own PROPER reserach on PEAK OIL. i have researched and thus listened to every expert on the planet who comments on peak oil and seen every graph or evidence there is out there. I did this for 3months frantically trying to find some evidence to prove peak oil is a myth. Sadly i found nothing apart from billions of barrels of non-conventional oil and gas which will do hardly anything to offset peak oil because, as i keep saying, its not about how many barrels of oil are in the ground its how quick and at what price you can get it out that matters.

    The last super oil field found was the gawahar in 1960 (provides most of the world conventional/cheap oil) they usually last around 40-50years before depleting. The last ‘big’ conventional oil field (big my ass) was found in 2005 it contained roighly 4-5 billion barrels of oil, which sounds big but its not, it would only provide us with 2 months worth of oil (crazy i know). We use to find loads of these a year now virtually nothing.

    Again i apologise if you thought i was being abusive i didnt mean to be, im just trying to ‘wake’ as many people as i can which will hopefully save a few lives. Research my friend prepare your family i personally recomend my top link he explains everything petfectly.

    • clovis

      I LIKE THIS PLEASE READ.
      John Michell took this idea one step further, describing what he saw as the universe’s habit “of reflecting back ideas projected onto it, of seeming to provide positive evidence for any theory that can possibly be formulated.” He claimed you could test it for yourself. “Take the wildest idea imaginable, commit yourself to believing it, become obsessed with it, and you’ll soon find all kinds of evidence turning up as confirmation of it.”

      “The universe is so generous that it gives to anyone, crank, scientist or religious believer, the evidence which confirms his particular belief or theory,” wrote Michell.

      The storm that brews on the horizon, the flag that whips in the breeze, the hand outstretched by a stranger, the gaze of a lover; whether we’ve projected our self into the skies or onto our nation, or through the pupils of a fellow human being, the same question brews for all of us: are you friendly or not? Storms occasionally destroy property, friends sometimes betray us, and government doesn’t always have our best interests at heart. But what if you add it all together and ask the universe as a whole? Perhaps the answer depends on the way you put the question

      • tom h

        Yes i like that aswell! if you get where im coming from clovis ;)

        • clovis

          hi, Tom.
          I didn’t mean to be rude.
          I just believe we will take control from the 1% we will have a world government one day but it will not have a dictator as a leader it ‘s people will rule.—smile

          • tom h

            i didnt think you were being rude mate and like i said i hope your right pal, rossi needs to hurry up though.

          • dragon

            “I just believe we will take control from the 1% we will have a world government one day but IT WILL NOT HAVE A DICTATOR as a leader it ‘s people will rule.”

            Man are you naive! YOU seem not to know how things work with human nature.

            LENR or not LENR breakthrough… we will always have a 1% elite (usually evil – that is why they are at the top)and a DICTATOR born from that elite. That is how things will stay until the finish line for this Univers.

    • tom h

      for roger bird ;)

    • Luca Salvarani

      You aren’t considering some things:
      1) The energy saving technologies ARE now very effective and could improve a lot in short time.
      2) We can organize a lot of things in different ways that let us save a lot of energy.. for example you can save a lot of trips simply using CURRENT technologies: don’t go to school but use e-learning from home, work from home, teleconference ecc.. This would mean not only less trips but also less buildings to warm, bright, build and mantain… the energy savings could be enormous simply using the CURRENT technology and using CURRENT best organization processes! (I’m assuming those technologies and processes will be adopted quickly and on a large scale)
      3) On the unconventional: your reports don’t consider some possible future changes:
      3.1) US unconventional gas could be exported where it’s worth much more (Europe gas are 5/6 times higher than US ones… this is a FACT not my opnion, you can check now)
      3.2) Car propulsion conversion from fuel to gas! It’s possible and it depend’s on fuel/gas relative prieces. It would be also more environment friendly! The same conversion for electric production like here in Italy.
      3.3) Unconventional gas exists in a lot of countries but as of now only the US is extracting it… If you add that extraction techniques could be improved a lot, unconventional exploration it’s at a beginning step, other countries could soon start production…. There could be a standardization of those techniques and economies of scale are also possible so their cost is poided to decrease (maybe a lot).
      3.4) I’m not saying that unconventional gas could replace all fossil fuels in the short term! I’m saying something much more different and sophisticated: unconventional gas could create a structural supply surplus forcing other energy-dependent counries to low their price to mantain their energy revenues! At that point those countries can’t no longer control the price! On the contrary they have the full control and sell you at 100 what they pay 5-6… How can you say that there’s enought competitition? In what other even littel competitive market someone can sell something at a price 20 times higher its cost of production? This is the problem! And the only way to break this oligopoly il unconventional gas! Let me be very concrete: if US exports its unconventional gas in Europe, US corporation can assure them substantial profits (a scenario that your reports don’t even consider) and our current supplier would be forced to low their prices… because without energy revenues those countries (Russia, Algeria, Lybia, Tunisia) will coppaspe wery quickly…. You main error is to be static: you don’t understand that 1 change triggers other changes and so on… and those processes now are very very quick! This is the same error of very intelligent and educated people, expecially in science, that have poor economy and finance background.

      • Luca Salvarani

        Sorry for a lot of errors but I wrote it in a hurry…

        • tom h

          did you see my replies?

          • Luca Salvarani

            To Tom

            yes but those reports are based on CURRENT situation, and are also questionable on many points! This situation could easily change dramatically for istance with the beginning of export in Europe: this could happen very quickly because both Europe and US already have the necessary infrastructure, and as your reports highlight US gas price are too low for marginal production.. so exactly its supposed weak (too low prices) could be the main trigger of the change I’m describing. I’m speaking about building a structural surplus that force energy nations to low prices so it’s not necessary an enormous output! By the way: your reports condider a treshold of 4 $ ot ensure profitability… so look at our current price (in a still depressed market)…

    • wizer13

      Yeah, yeah, heard all of it before. One thing must be said, though. We, as a specie, have a great capacity for innovation and adaptation. There has been stupid decisions made in the past, but, humans have thrived. If the economy is to collapse, so it will, that’s the way people choose to live. But, so far, so good, standards in living has risen, and we are not there yet. Many doomsayers were saying the same thing about limits to growth in the 90′s, 70′s, the 30′s and so on. Every generation have heard the same old song, and that we must repent of our wrong doings. No one can predict what the future will be, nor be 100% accurate about predictions. For one correct prediction, an expert can make 40 false assumptions.
      When people face a problem, they tend to search for solutions. We are problem solvers, and screaming wolf won’t help.
      Oh, and adding many exclamation points won’t prove that your argument is relevant. I acknowledge that our civilisation is based on oil, so is the economy, but many things can happen in just a few years.
      If it’s not LENR – which I personnally think can really be a gamechanger, and we will soon know about it -, than it could be salt molten nuclear reactors from thorium, as India and China are experimenting as we speak. And they achieved a lot of energy from borane.
      Has for me, i’m tired about hearing we will all die soon. We survived 162 end of the world predictions since two millenias, and each time they were saying : we are at a defining point of humanity history. Each day you live is a defining point in existence : you live this very moment. Is it good or bad ? Life is this way, and for now, we live at higher standards than romans, and we surely have better opportunities than our ancestors or our grandparents.

      • tom h

        yes but how many civilisations have collapsed since then??? i never said we would all die i said with out cheap oil we cant support 7 billion people end of FACT.

        As for the living standards remark that was all created through DEBT, its a bubble mate that popped in 2008 but the fed printed trillions and governments bailed out banks thats the only reason the economy didnt collapse. Look at greece they had high living standards look at them now in chaos it will soon spread to USA. Even here in the UK austerity is kicking in and living standards are dropping, once greece dafaults it will set off a chain of dominos which the USA with its 14 trillion dollars of debt cant hide from, thats why your government are passing all these ‘terrorist’ (lmao) laws ready for the civil wars that will abrupt. All i have to say to you is IRAQ was all about oil, iran the same even afgan the same (they thought there was vast reserves lol ooops).

        I too thought the same as you “heard it all before”etc but once you look at the facts and take off the rose tinted goggles there no escaping the truth as sad as it is.

        • wizer13

          I do not see life with rose tinted goggles. Life can be harsh, and yes, many civilisation has risen and fell over the centuries. Maybe it will be our case, what do I know ?
          Oh, and i’m not American, but Canadian, thank you.
          I know the facts just has you do, for I, too, did my own research and I went to a lot of stress because of it, and nearly forgot to live the present moment.
          But, as I was telling, preaching don’t save lives, innovation and sharing ideas do. Has people rush to secure energy, new ideas will emerge. From necessity comes progress. And, as for now, we have been aiding people go out of poverty for a century and a half, and we shall continue this way if we can.
          If securing food is one problem, there is new technology emerging, such has vertical farming, hydroponics, aquaponics, etc. which use only 10 percent of water, electricity and space, 365 days culture year round, and use no pesticides has a boon. For now, it is emerging, but given some developments, it could supply the world. Waste pyrolysis could recycle 98% of garbage, turn it to energy and construction materials or biofuel.

          I share your hope about LENR. I want too to believe in a world with aboundant energy, no wars and justice for everyone. I think it will bring a brighter future. We can just adapt to change. If it’s the worst case scenario – which I hope not – what’s the worst case that can happen ? We die. That’s not all that bad, depending on how you see it. Has for my own befiefs, it cannot be worst. Yes, death is a tragedy, but that’s a part of life. So, for now, at this present moment, I do not need to worry about the future.

          Cheers, and keep hope. That’s what drive humanity.

          • tom h

            Yes i know about all of them (hydroponics etc) but they wont be done on a big enough scale untill a crisis strikes (PO) which will be too late (they take energy to set up). I do live my life with my 2 kids i dont worry too much about PO now i feel refreshed from it, i see life so different now in a good way.

            Anyway i dont preach, i spread awareness so families like myself can try prepare as best they can.

            tom ;)

        • http://E-Catworld TimTim

          “i said with out cheap oil we cant support 7 billion people end of FACT.”
          … So, the joke begins…?

          We can – The truth.

          If you mean… without cheap oil & cheap labor to some at the expense of expensive oil to cheap labor; we cannot live MORE lavishly than the cheap labor, then, you are right.

          But as a humanity, devoid of old-wisdom, we’ll replace cheap oil with free energy and cheap labor with free (robotic) labor. The only question becomes … how much surface area of Earth each man is entitled to? I.e. Desire of “SPACE on EARTH” will control population density…. not food, not energy and NEVER the oil. I wait patiently to let you all old fools die and let us the new generation do good work.

          • tom h

            lol im 23 mate and think what you want, i know the reality.

    • Sparks

      Spot on! Add to your peak oil sketch, existing “easy” (meaning cheap) oil fields depleting at 5% flow rate per year, which needs replacement each year, oil producing (especially OPEC) nations keeping more of their oil for their own consumpution, and China and India oil demand skyrocketing, and we are right on top of the perfect storm right now.

      • sapain

        i agree with the perfect storm, iran and syria, western debt crisis, china and russia gaining strenght, weather patterns shifting, world wide unrest over monetary balance, atlantic ocean current disruption.

  • Hurley

    I think this topic states the obvious. We need to ask ourselves, if I had a gismo worth trillions, what would I do. Would you take a working model and walk into the offices of GE, Siemens, Google and others with the money that can make something happen and just sell it or secretly make a factory and just start making it to sell. There are a lot of lessons to learn from history where new technololgy replaced old with new and there was always a stugle but nothing on this scale. Edison and electricity is a good example. Imagine trying to explain how electricity worked to the average individual back then given most people couldn’t even read. Volta had a glowing wire from electricity in 1800. It took into the late 1800′s until Edison perfected the light bulb and had to invent a way to light it with electrical distribution (even if it was DC until Tesla’ AC system). He promote this with shows such as 1897 Tennessee Centennial Exposition. Note that he got his start by selling the quadruplex telegraph for $202,000 in todays dollars.
    I think we are on a 2 to 4 year wait until this takes off unless GE gets on CNN and says, look what we bought!

  • Luca Salvarani

    I strongly trust in Rossi and lenr in general.. but I disagree with this article. And here’s why:
    1) The US (but also Europe… even if we are too much naif on this topic) has enormous amount of gas (I mean expecially not conventional gas). This gas can be extracted at mid to low cost, and used to get heat, coal, electric energy (here in Italy the most of electric energy comes from gas) and to power cars! But the very best is another thing: the structure of the market! Now energy prices are high because of no or very little competitition (and expensive technologies that idiot politicians as Obama obliged us to use… such as photovoltaic). But this can radically changes: in the unconventional there are a lot of players, a lot of countries where you can produce and you can very easily export it where it’s worth much: for example the gas in europe is 5/6 times more expensive than in the US… at least untill American corporation will soon begin to export here. When this will happen other countries such as Russia or Middle East ones will be forced to low their prices.. indeed they can extract an oil barrel for few dollars (max 10 but also 2-3 in some cases) and sell it at 100 dollars… there isn’t absolutely a shortage of resources, the real problem is lack of competition! This could enormously benefit US and us (Europe) at the expense of islamic and enemy nations that are getting reacher and more powerful simply doing nothing but! By the way just in 2011 the US is no longer importing gas but has become a net gas exporter… only the beginning!

    2) Energy prices as so high also because taxation: for example here in Italy at least 50% of fuel price is due to taxes… So simply take the government back!
    3) There’s a lot of new technologies that enable you to save a lot of fuel or gas… so accelerate their diffusion.
    Conclusion: i trust in Rossi and think that e-cat can dramatically change forever the energy (and also geopolitical) field… But also without e-cat we can get very cheaper energy!

    • tom h

      never heard such nonsense in all my life lmao seriousy

      http://www.smartplanet.com/blog/energy-futurist/everything-you-know-about-shale-gas-is-wrong/341

      http://oilprice.com/Energy/Natural-Gas/End-of-the-Boom-The-True-State-of-the-Shale-Gas-Industry.html

      http://www.smh.com.au/business/shale-gas-relegated-to-back-burner-20120208-1rf1s.html

      unconventional fossil fuels (oil and gas) are not going to save us we have peaked on conventional oil and are not far off peak natural gas!!!!!! Unless LENR is real and rapidly commercialised billions upon billions will die FACT!!!! see my below links research PEAK OIL properly i did for 3 months and as much as it pains me it is a fact tar sands, shale gas, heavy crude, none of it will save us as it is not about the amount of reserves it is about maximum extraction!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      • tom h

        o yea energy prices are so high because they have nearly peaked. its got f all to do with tax did you know they heavily subsidise oil?? with out it the economy would of collapsed already seriously people wake up!!!!!!!!!!!

      • Sparks

        Yes, and those unconventional fossil fuels are not only slow producers (low flow rate), they are also very expensive to produce, and the wells deplete typically 80% to 90% in ONE YEAR. Sure we can have plenty of gasoline, at maybe $10 per gallon, but only for a while. But bed $4/gal gasoline (in the US) goodbye, not because it’s going down, but because it’s going up, never to return (except maybe briefly during upcoming global economic crashes).

        • daniel maris

          I think what you call gas and we call petrol costs two or three times in the UK compared with the USA. But we all still drive cars and there are traffic jams everywhere. It’s not the end of civilisation as you know it. Get a grip!

          • sparks

            Did I say it’s the “end of civilization as you know it.” Hmm … No … Re-reading it again, … Nope, still doesn’t say that. It is common courtesy NOT to put words in somebody’s mouth, then ridicule them for your words. What I said is it will take gasoline prices of $10 per gallon in the US in the not too distant future to maintain the rates of consumption we have today. I also said we will have economic crashes (much like in 2008, I add) in the near future. But why am I wasting my time repeating what I already said above? I’ve got you on “ignore” henceforth unless you demonstrate some level of rehabilitation in your posting style.

    • Francesco CH

      For me there is no enemy nation, and nuclear fusion is an energetic improvement for all the mankind.

      Cheers from Italy

      • Luca Salvarani

        To Francesco
        1) I’m only saying that even without e-cat we could achieve low energy prices with right choices in some years so the continuous increase is not unavoidable!
        2) E-cat or other more efficient lenr-based technologies could take years to reach millions/billions of users…. And could face some obstacles… for example if governments will lose energy revenues they could tax e-cat strongly reducing the benefits for the people… so we however need this changes (for istance very very few goverment, expecially we in Italy where government directly or indirectly controls everything)… Without these changes we will only replace oil/gas/photovoltaic.. tycon with others, without benefits for the people which is the real goal of Rossi (and mine also)!
        3) “For me there is no enemy nation” If only it would be so simple… I’m the first one to hope so but unfortunately the reality is very different! But I must correct: not enermy “nations” but enermy “groups of interest” because even is nation that quite all recognize at least not friendly for example Iran.. the vast majority of its people has no fault… Do you agree now?

        PS Where are you from? I’m from Mantova.

    • sapain

      silicon energy.
      6.5 grams of silicon needed for 1 watt of electrical power and will last indefinitely. silicon is the second most abundant element on this planet.
      silicon will produce as long as the sun shines.
      water will flow as long as the earth shines and spins.
      tides will rise and fall as long as the moon orbits the earth.
      the earth will stay warm as long as the core will last.
      therefore there will never be an energy shortage until the sun blinks out.
      oil is a monoply of the few, and controls the life of the whole.

  • http://neotreksoftware.com Allan Shaura

    Free us from shackles. This will no only be more freedom from a portion of the international and political economic manipulation but also on a local and personal level. A healthy environment creativity and independence have much better chance as the bonds of global mass servitude are eased.

    • Andrew Macleod

      :)

  • tom h

    im afraid the situation us alot more serious than stated above. If LENR is not comnercialized by 2013 latest then it could possibly be too late. The worlds economy will collapse this year, like it did in 2008, only this time it cant be bailed out. It will start within the euro zone probably greece and within a few weeks a catastrophic collapse if the worlds financial system will happen. It will bring about mass starvation and civil and international wars.

    Yes TPTB and bankers have screwed us over but the underlying problem is high oil prices which means no economic growth which means no debts can be repaid. The reason we have high oil prices, is a phenomen known as peak oil, i advice you with urgence to research it.

    Unless LENR happens asap the worlds population will collapse from 7 billion to 1-2 billion as without cheap and economically recoverable fossil fuels that is earths carrying capacity. Basically with out oil we cannot feed more than a couple of billion (if not alot less).

    Now one thing to not get confused about is peak oil is not about running out of oil, we have plenty of oil in the ground. It is about how much oil we can get out of the ground at a time for example the world consumes 85million barrels of oil daily (although we would like to use more we cant as that is our maximum extraction) but with peak oil then it going to deplete every year. It will go to 80 mill then 70 etc meaning the price goes sky high as people outbid. Now some will say dont worry we have the tar sands with billion and billions of reserves. Ignore them it is not about how much reserves there are (tar sands will never be able to get out more than 5mill barrels of oil a day). Also back in the day 1 barrel of oil used to return 100 now it is nearly down a ratio of 1:1. Which means we use 1 barrel of oil energy to get out 1 barrel of oil so it is nearly econmoically unviable hence all the financial crisis going on in the world.

    People will read this and think so what big deal were just walk more, but the thing you have to understand is the link between oil and food once you realise that, you realise that the world is facing the most catastrophic threat of all time. Our civilisation is built on cheap oil and it is about to come to an end. The only hope the world has is LENR. By the way the reason for all this, is our population. I urge you all to read the following links especially the top one:

    http://www.unicamp.br/fea/ortega/eco/traducao-DieOff.pdf

    http://www.oildecline.com/

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hirsch_report

    if not watch a video on it
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5sMF1n9EgzU

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOMWzjrRiBg

    If you at all care about your families future then at least give one of these ago as without it you will not have any chance of surviving the coming crisis

    o by the way reading the first link will probably make you loose it for a while and possibly make you feel sick but it will all be worth it when your prepared and the rest of the masses are fighting over what little food remains.

    • J

      The Club of Rome sponsored publication “Limits to Growth”, in 1972 predicted the world scenarios that we now see unfolding. This is nothing new. And the vast majority of humans remain unaware and oblivious to what is coming. What really sucks is that it could all have been avoided.

      • tom h

        yes my friend i have read it and you are correct could of been avoided but TPTB have been given a free ride to destroy this planet (and ultimately ourselves) by the masses. Yet still there are people who can not see it, all you have to do is look around the world! As i said LENR is the only hope, the whole system is creaking and it will collapse within 2 years max so time is running out. Conventional oil peaked on 2006, we have been on a plateau ever since (only thing thats kept the system going is non conventional liquids) the decline will start very very soon.

      • daniel maris

        well clearly there weren’t any real limits to growth as the population has about doubled or more and the vast majority of people are much wealthier than in 1972.

        What is correct to say is that if we want to live well on a pleasant planet we ought restrain our population growth and gradually reduce it in absolute numbers. However, even with current technology we could handle twice the number of people.

        • J

          If you spent the time to read “Limits to growth” you would perhaps have understood that the abrupt and severe reversal of the first derivative of human population, food production, general natural resource use, etc. vs time are predicted to kick in around 2025-2030. So far the predictions are pretty much on track; the only caveat being that technological breakthroughs are unpredictable, perhaps a la LENR. Your post validates that general behavior of human populations is quite predictable and generally foolish.

          • daniel maris

            Your sneering at humanity is indicative of your general misanthropic attitude.

            People have big families for a reason. Most people cut back on family size hugely once they attain a certain level of material prosperity and they can be reasonably sure their two or three children will survive.

            We haven’t even begun to maximise food production. If we wanted we could bring in polytunnel production and artificial heating and lighting. We don’t do it in the UK because currently we can get our food cheaply from elsewhere. But if the price of food went up that’s exactly what we would start to do. If our food cost twice as much as today it would impact on our budgets but we wouldn’t starve.

    • clovis

      HI,Tom.
      MAN, WHAT A LOT OF BULLOCKS, all i will say is this —DOOM CRYING, I would say we are headed into a new world, where all that crap you suggest will happen, will in fact be the very opposite,we now as a human race have the ability to save ourselves when in the past we did not, lenr will come to the rescue and help or something else will come along, it all ways has.– smile.

      • tom h

        I certainly hope so mate. I did say LENR was our only hope but if for some reason LENR fails to becone reality (pretty sharpish) then im sorry doom will be here weather we like it or not.

    • Petrol

      You’ll distroy the environment in the process but where there is a will and sufficient money there will always be a way to produce oil.

      Methane to Oil
      Coal to Oil (Germans famously did this when their supply was cut off during WWII)
      Crummy oil sands
      Growing oil from seas
      Increasingly expensive drilling

      Unfortunatly the world currently has practically infinite (centuries) supplies of methane and coal at its disposal and I’m afraid we will not be shy about using it.

      In terms of carrying capacity and numbers of people on earth this is all discredited nonsense. A person in the developed world consumes 20 times the resources of a person in the developing world. The issue of sustainability has very little to do with the actual number of people on the planet and more to do with ineffeciencies, SUVs and general gluttony.

  • Thomas Ammons

    Doews anyone know what LENR really is? Let’s try to find the answer to that and commercialization if possible will likely happen. Or we can believe that there is an iconoclastic inventor in Italy who has in a Thomas Alva Edison kind of way succeeded in finding a secret catalyst that makes LENR work where others who are more knowlegible and have greater resources have failed and who will soon reveal his secret to the world and reward those who have been faithful to his promise. To all the believers–

    Warm Regards,

    Thomas Ammons–the puppet snake.

  • Roger Bird

    Unfortunately, the admin/writer is wrong about the cost of gasoline. If you factor in inflation, then the cost of gasoline is not the highest that it has ever been.

    • tom h

      lol your delusional mate see my above post, weather you like it or not everything i say is fact look up the us and german army reports on the matter.

      • Roger Bird

        tom h, why the eff you cee kay should I read your post when you are being abusive?

        • clovis

          The fact is that the U.S. exports more energy than it uses, so as far as being dependent on someone else is just not true.the oil sludge that Canada wants to ship via the xl pipeline would be exported and of no use to our country except to make the 1% ers even more rich. also to leave the left over toxic waste for us to dispose of.—

          • tom h

            clovis that is the most stupid thing i have ever heard in my life! the usa imports the most oil out of the whole world. Dont even get me started on the tar sands or shale gas you are being lied to they will not save you end of, seriously do some research before spouting rubbish.

          • J

            clovis, the u.s. produces ~2% of the world oil supply; the u.s. uses ~25% of the world oil supply. can you do arithmetic? (tom h, i’ve actually heard even stupider things, like nuclear fission is ‘cheap’)

          • tom h

            yes jon good one :)

          • Andrew Macleod

            Oil sands oil has been exported to the US for years, and will continue reguardless of the pipe line. The pipeline was more of an economic stimulus. 98% of Canada’s energy exports are to th US. Before you paint us as big polluters you might want to look at our energy policy. Over 95% nuclear or hydro electric one of the greenest in the world.

        • tom h

          i have replied to you roger bird but for some reason my post has ended up at the top

  • Andrew Macleod

    Throught history empires have risen and fallen. Until recient history this has been in the form of countries and governments. The raining empire right now is the oil empire controlled by capitalism and corporations, and it spans the world. We are starting to see the typical degradation that happens when flawed systems are left to their own devices. LENR is a means to remove one of the shakles that hold us in place our “energy shakles”. If Rossi succeeds or not I believe that future hisorians will view this time as the beginning of a new age. He has already done the world a favor, by bringing to light that there are better ways.

    • clovis

      Hi, Andy.
      I totally agree with you. dam, i can hardly wait to see what will happen next, and like Francis, i would like to see it move faster, gettie up.– smile