Rossi: Already Started Production of Small E-Cats to Cost $100-150 per kW

This post from Andrea Rossi deserves its own thread.

Dear K. Dobrolecki:
We must make a distinction between the price of the industrial plants and the price of the domestic plants.
For the industrial plants ( the 1 MW plants) the price from 2012 will be around 1,500.00 US$/kW, moreless 10%.
The domestic E-Cats of 10 kW will be manufactured with a different technology and with a very good economy scale, due to the fact that we have started the production of 1 million pieces; such scale, obviously, will reduce by an order of magnitude the costs. If all goes as I hope and as I am working for, the 10 kW E-Cats will cost between 100 and 150 US$/kW. This fact will:
1- allow to everybody to buy an E-Cat
2- cancel the competition
The reverse engineering will be, I think, impossible, due to a system we invented for this purpose, but even if somebody will succeed to do it, it will anyway be impossible for him to compete economically. The 1 MW plants have a totally different technology and engineering.
Warm Regards,
A.R.


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  • David Schwartz

    “” NASA and others have validated that LENR using nickel as the main “fuel” is at least plausible. I do not find it difficult at all to imagine that someone may have stumbled upon a better “catalyst” than used in NASA’s experiments. “”

    Every successful liar is smart enough to make his lies plausible. Every successful lair fails to provide proof.

    I would put the chances that Rossi is a fraud at 85% and the chances that he has even deluded himself at 5%.

    • Joe Heeney

      Dear Mr. Schwartz, Why is it that in some circles; caustic negativity is accepted as a valid scientific stance, and proof demanded, when nothing in science is ever proven. (And the converse is not!) Science is about finding the best theory to describe the facts as they are known, the using the resulting insights to gain further facts and further insights, discarding old theory like torn clothing along the way.

      Mr Rossi is about bringing a product to market. If you want to test one, get in line, and buy one at Home Depot when they come out. If you are dissatisfied, they have a wonderful return policy!

      • http://Yahoo.com John Thomas

        John, you seem to be open-minded and I want you to know that others think as you do, don’t downplay progress towards new energy that is so much needed in this worls we live in….only wish they had a Home Depot here in the Philippines to buy one myself….

        • http://homepoweredgoals John Thomas

          perhaps you can let me know where in the Philippines you are living,as it may be possible that we could workout a plan for you to buy and me to ship one of these to you. I expect to be back to the Philippines after a few years here in the States..Ilocos Norte is now home to me…
          forgottencountry.at.yahoo dot com

  • Tiago

    People,

    If someone thinks that the Wright Brothers were justified in hiding their work for money. How much more could not be justifiable for the creators of e-cat?

    The e-cat is a new achievement, not built upon already existing engines, kites, baloons and other previous stuff. So the e-cat is a more important breakthrough than flying an airplane. It may allow for flying disks, or flying cities.

    Another important point is that, if you don’t know Italian, its time to learn it. Complaining that things are not in English won’t change the work or its validity, but will only show your ignorance towards other cultures.

    English is widely known, but is not the lingua franca of the World, so knowing the basics of half-a-dozen important languages can open many doors to your minds and yourselves.

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  • Anne Ominous

    Flat rejection of something that challenges your understanding is not the same as skepticism.

    NASA and others have validated that LENR using nickel as the main “fuel” is at least plausible. I do not find it difficult at all to imagine that someone may have stumbled upon a better “catalyst” than used in NASA’s experiments.

    As for why he’s keeping it a secret: it’s the money, stupid. That motivation is also perfectly plausible and explains many of the actions that other people have called “strange”. Further, being a researcher in this field, maybe Rossi wants to capitalize on it before others do. After all, it seems other researchers have been more-or-less on the same track.

    I am reminded very much of the Wright brothers just a bit over 100 years ago. Many in the “science” community — including Scientific American, which was a more influential publication then than it is now — did not believe the claims of the Wright brothers, because they tended to be secretive about their demonstrations and their inventions… for reasons of money. They wanted to profit from their hard work.

    In fact, a couple of years later SciAm credited the invention of powered, manned flight to someone else. It wasn’t until years later that they admitted their mistake.

    • http://homepoweredgoals John Thomas

      Anne…your right, others are on track to bring LENR to the market, many from here in the U.S.A., Japan, Korea(S), Canada and other places..Seems like there may be many new “Energies coming to market soon and you can bet, those coming with it first are the ones to reap the greatest rewards for their efforts…

  • EricKuma

    This guy is a liar and a sociopath. If he really has something that is obviously so important to the human race he should just release it for everyone. Otherwise he is lying for his own devious reasons. Nothing will ever come of the e-cat.

    • Anon

      Yes, release it for everyone!

      Just like the internet, something that is so important to the human race, it should be free for everyone.

      Death To Capitalism!!

  • Michael A

    According to this you can either buy a 1mw plant at $1500/kw or a 10kw plant for $150/kw. Any customer can buy any number of each.
    I guess you have to be an inventor of cold fusion to find the logic in this pricing scheme.

    • Jimmy

      Maybe, maybe not. Cost/Output is not the only factor. What if the 1MW plant requires 1/10 the volume of 100 10kW plants?

      Regardless, I am rather leery of claims made with such little apparent support.

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  • John Smith

    Wow, I’m surprised at how quickly shills for the power industry turn up, given the number of negative posts here – though I suppose I shouldn’t be! Then watch how, without batting an eye & contrary to what they say, they will be among the first in the queue to buy an E-Cat with their shilling-$ once they are available. Depressing how weak-minded sheep like that are in the majority. Thank God/etc. for people like Rossi.

    • Henry Paulson, PhD

      It doesn’t take a “shill for the power industry” to question why, at the very least, doesn’t Mr. Rossi have an E-cat powering his home.

      Imagine that you’re the inventor of what Rossi has claimed to have invented. As an engineer wouldn’t you have an early prototype powering your home to work out any bugs on a small scale?

      He has yet to show that his invention can even power a light bulb or any load for that matter.

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  • http://www.lepost.fr/perso/sophareth Sophareth Camsonne

    Scientific reasoning is important, but it should not hinder in any case, the marching progress of the century

  • Max

    The idea is to produce 1 million e-cats and sell them all at once. Martini and Rossi know that once 1 of these units leaves their control the game is up.
    I will not be the first fool to pay $1,500 for $10 worth of home depot piping covered in duct tape. I’ll let the “true believers” part with their money first.

    • Darren R. Starr

      I have a similar feeling to this, though I have to admit that I don’t think I’d phrase it the same way.

      The way I see it is, if he’s this concerned about protecting his invention, then the answer is to get whoever is backing his first production run to pay to protect his investment and technology through the patent system (which is why it really exists) and then he can collect royalties off of any “losses” from people stealing the tech. While I imagine that he’s probably made a fairly brilliant “anti-reverse engineering tech”, it’s utterly meaningless since someone will in fact reverse engineer it no matter what. If the tech is everything he claims it is, then the value of it is high enough that spending a few million bucks reverse engineering it shouldn’t be an issue.

      The other thing is, cold fusion IS based on nuclear reactions… hence the whole nuclear fusion bit :) While I feel strongly that we should all be trying hard to get this kind of tech in the future if it works out, I think a person would have to be an absolute idiot to install one of these things in or near their home without having a pretty good idea of how it actually works. I’m not an expert on the topic in any way other than the “I get it better than many other do since I can actually read the math”, but the fields generated by a device such as this have to be disturbing or disrupting. They can even be high energy microwave or even gamma radiation. I simply don’t trust anything built by a small number of individuals employing a technology which can sustain and harvest 10kw/hr to not leak like hell. I doubt this group has at their disposal all the technology or resources necessary to measure all the different types of radiation that may emanate from the device to detect whether it is safe for use around people.

      I would be really happy if this guy did actually pull it off. It would be a huge step in the right direction. But if he really did it, then bringing the tech to a company like GE, demoing it and offering to sell the rights for $10,000,000 plus royalties and getting GE to foot the bill for producing a safe for consumer device would be not only profitable, but practical.

      • Tiago

        If you have got to see the videos, you would see how much care these guys took with radiation. They have in their team just the most experienced scientist to take care solely of this issue and nothing else, of course the others help, too. But one guy for radiation measurements, mitigation and control.

        There’s not only GE in this World which would be capable of producing such a device. But if the guys can do it alone and profit alone, why would they sell out to old smart industrial crooks?

    • Advill

      At least, Rossi is showing himself and taking the risks with face, name and surname, the man is a scientist and is risking a lot personally with this, is hard for me to believe he is a snake oil seller.

      we can´t say the same with many radical “advances” as EESTOR or A123 that are just filtrating news with no support.

      Rossi can be wrong or right, but for sure he is not after the money, he is really looking for Humanity improvement.

      • Henry Paulson, PhD

        If that were true all of his research would be out in the open. We would know how the e-cat functions and would have plans to build it ourselves.

        The only reason he would hide his research would be because his intention is to maximize profit. There is no other logical explanation.

        Since the patent system is designed to protect inventors’ ideas from competitors and yet he chooses not to utilize it, it lends credence to the idea that the e-cat doesn’t actually work.

        • http://Yahoo.com John Thomas

          so, what is wrong to make a few extra bucks on a device it took years to perfect…you don’t like money or just never had enough of it to know the many things it can buy?

        • jason

          Henry,

          I’m sorry to say this, but you have an idealisitic notion of how the patent process works. Ideas like this get stuck in the patent catch-22. If you release into the open the way it works, you risk having the idea stolen out from under you by a large corporation, changed slightly and they patent it for themsleves so that no one else can develop it. Then if you try to challenge that patent, they entangle you with the legal process for years with their army of legal council and bags of cash to defend against you. You are left drained with legal costs and eventually are forced to settle for a portion of what you could have made for yourself. If you do not release it you are called a snakeoil salesman by people such as yourself.

  • Brad Arnold

    Frankly, this whole Rossi thing seems too-good-to-be-true. Krivit is making a pretty good case that Rossi is a fraud.

    On the other hand, I am a believer and rate the chances of Rossi being a fraud at less than one percent (which I told Krivit in a phone call).

    What most impresses me is the fast rate Rossi (and Defkalion for that matter) are bring LENR generators to market. It is no small feat to mass produce that many units per year – I am forced to conclude (given both Rossi & Defkalion are legitimate) that the potential profit is so great that these companies are making Herculean efforts to rush it to market.

    The humanitarian result of such a market emergence I rate as bigger than all the UN efforts combined – and our leaders seem to be in the dark.

    • Tony Dee

      Our leaders are not in the dark…they are scarred sh#tless!

    • http://Yahoo.com John Thomas

      “and our what a leaders seem to be in the dark” What a surprise to learn that others think the same of the nitwits (whom we have elected) could be so far out of the loop

  • http://none Bo Miller

    I have to smile, when I remember all of the Naysayers
    who said that William Lear absolutely could not produce a personal jet passenger aircraft for a million dollars. Boy !…Were they wrong ! : )

    • Neeneko

      That was a case of economics and engineering, not of physics. Everyone knew you could build jets of that size, it was just a question of could the process be done cheaply enough to be viable.

      People are calling Rossi a fraud for reasons of physics. No one has done what he claims to have done, and no one has a viable theory for how such a device could work that matches current knowledge. Or more accurately, no one has a theory that does not make him fraudulent since there are all sorts of perfectly known ways he could fake results coming out of a black box.

      • RocketScientist

        “Science” (The Guardians of The Temple of Knowledge) far too often works at defending the interests of the industry incumbents (not to mention its supposed monopoly on knowledge).

        Recent Academic studies have shown that the vast majority of scientific publications are not even bothering to present reproducible facts (apparently, corporate propaganda is good enough to qualify for “peer-review”).

        So, before you mention “Physics” as THE (only) reason for the proof of a fraud, ask yourself what “Physicians” have to lose in the game.

        “It’s difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on him not understanding it.”
        – Upton Sinclair

      • http://Yahoo.com John Thomas

        What about “BlackLight Power? seems to be close to same setup by brought forth by Mills, not Rossi

  • Dave

    He’s going to make 1 million E-Cat, but can’t spare just 1 for an independent 3rd party test?

    • Jim

      Here’s what you do. Wait until Fall 2012, buy one, and have it independently tested.

      But personally, if the things work, I don’t need some physicist to verify it and tell me so. I’ll see the damn things in action at Home Depot.

      • Dave

        Jim he’ll never have them for sale anywhere. These grandiose claims are designed to suck in gullible investors.

        • H. Hansson

          Dave.. perhaps.. but on the other hand he have always done what he said.

          But admit.. it would be good to close down Saudi Arabia.

          • ben

            we want these in Israel !
            free(almost) energy in the middle east, people r more relax, dont want to fight…

            • http://homepoweredgoals John Thomas

              Anne…your right, others are on track to bring LENR to the market, many from here in the U.S.A., Japan, Korea(S), Canada and other places..Seems like there may be many new “Energies coming to market soon and you can bet, those coming with it first are the ones to reap the greatest rewards for their efforts…

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  • Cliff Bradley

    Well, this is great progress. Working E-Cats in homes will certainly silence people who what to know what the physics is. I can’t wait.

  • arian

    The beginning of a new era

    Book written by Camillo Urbani

    Camillo Urbani profile
    I am a physicist and in the last twenty years I have devoted myself to study the phenomenon of cold fusion and free energy. Given that the main problem is the lack of a shared theory that can explain the phenomenon, I thought I’d share my knowledge. In a forum of more ‘followed on the subject (www.energeticambiente.it) I opened a thread that has had some success with the public in which I wrote last year.

    In the quest to make myself understood even by less experienced, I wanted to explain some basic concepts of physics to allow everyone to understand what he was talking about and why science can not accept the cold fusion so easily. I then introduced some concepts of quantum mechanics in this field can help us to understand something more ‘.

    Since the work was interesting I thought I would group the more ‘relevant in a book. Of course there is no intention to give an official theory, but just some ideas to give the reader a chance to get an idea. I think anyone interested in reading fluently and find information. I hope that disclosing this information may be of interest, and help the cold fusion to be something a little ‘less mysterious.

    http://www.ecatnews.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/E-cat-english.pdf

    • Tommi Elonen

      The PDF needs source, it only shows the website it’s coming from, but it doesn’t have a writer’s name, or any other sources. I did not bother reading it, as I can’t confirm anything it says.

      • Tommi Elonen

        I mean, it’s nice it’s out there, but just a direct link to this PDF does not do it justice, I don’t speak italian, but the website it comes from is italian. The book is in English, but the credits and source are NOT.

    • will

      Mr (Dr) Urbani,

      Even though the translation is a bit rough at times. as a layman, I find your descriptions very enlightening as well as amusing.

      I would recommend that you hire a professional translator (and maybe an illustrator). I think your way of describing this counter intuitive subject is very valuable!

      • James Rovnak

        I too enjoyed the writeup and forwarded it to my son. I commend Dr Urbani on his efforts to explain further the system and its development history. References to Dr Mills of Black Light Power Corp, Dr Godes of Brilliouin Corp and the RF drivers and EESTOR the ceramic super capacitor under development for years all revived fond memories of my path in this exploration of finally a working fusion product.Freedom, Efficiency and Justice in reference to the new fusion process

        From: JAMES ANDREW ROVNAK [mailto:[email protected]]
        Sent: Wednesday, January 11, 2012 10:17 PM

        Here is an interesting short book translated to English by Physicist author Camillo Urbani. He mentions Dr Mills of Black Light Power Inc, Godes of Brilliouin Corporation and EESTOR – a few names we have discussed in the past. He knows all the Italian principles in the E-Cat evolution and a bit about the Nickel and the transmutation to Copper in presence of pressurized hydrogen and initial external heating to get the process to catch.

        The English translation is very entertaining in parts. (Tehory, etc). Some words you know what he meant but not by what he wrote. Our English to Italian would be just a fun to him I am sure.

    • http://Yahoo.com John Thomas

      Post it in a book and make some money yourself, seems to be many of us that do not understand the scientific theory.